Hello, I'm Shelley
Quinn, and welcome again
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to Issues and Answers.
Today the issue we're gonna
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be talking about
is New Age Deception.
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And the answers are gonna
come from my special guest,
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Jay Christian.
Jay, it's so lovely
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to have you here. And
I'm thrilled to be here,
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thank you. You are 3ABN's
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Radio Production Manager, right.
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Yes. Well, I want to share
a scripture that I know that
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you're very familiar
with, and this scripture comes
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from Deuteronomy 18:10-11.
Actually I am gonna read 12 too.
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Deuteronomy 18
beginning with verse 10 says,
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There shall not be found
among you anyone who makes
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his son or his daughter
to pass through the fire,
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or who uses
divination, or is a soothsayer,
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or an augur, a
sorcerer, or a charmer,
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and one who cast spells.
Or a medium, or a wizard,
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or a necromancer,
that's one who talks
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to the dead. For
all who do these things
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are an abomination to the
Lord and it is because of these
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abdominal practices
that the Lord, your God,
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is driving them out before you.
Jay has written a book called
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"Falling for a Lie," it's about;
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the subtitle is New Age
Beliefs that Nearly Killed Me.
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Jay, once again, I'm
just glad you're here.
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Let's talk about what is
the definition of New Age?
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You know, I am asked that often,
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and it's hard to nail it
down because there is so many
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different beliefs.
But the general belief
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of New Age is that we
have an immortal soul.
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And that we go
through reincarnation,
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different lives, to
work our way to heaven.
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And that there is
so much more knowledge,
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so much more
available out there rather
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just the Bible to learn.
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And so the
Bible is looked at as,
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is really kind of a low
level. If that's okay for you,
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that's fine. If
that's all you can handle.
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But there is so
much more to learn,
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read this, read
that, read something else
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and find out
about true spirituality.
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And so when you start
hearing things like that you're
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moving into New Age.
Okay, not all New Agers
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believe in reincarnation
necessarily, do they?
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I can probably say that
if we want to put an absolute
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probably not every New
Ager, but it is major belief.
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It is. Yes. Now
and this practice
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of the morality of the soul,
I just want to give for you
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First Timothy 6:16 says,
God alone has a morality.
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And that's First Timothy
6:16, you might want to check
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that out in
Bible. So, for New Agers,
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it's more or less
since there such a wide array
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to choose from. I mean it's kind
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of smorgasbord style,
you can pick and choose
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what you like. And
this is more or less
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that whatever feels
good do it. Basically yes,
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Satan has devised
New Age brilliantly.
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Because, by the
time I got out of it,
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I was in it for 20
years. Okay. And by the time
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I got out of New Age I
was believing some things
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that had you told
me 20 years earlier
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that I was gonna
believe, I said no,
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I wouldn't believe
anything like that,
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not a chance. Well, I was.
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You just go in, step by step,
and as you learn something,
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then you add
something else to it,
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a little bit here,
a little bit there.
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But they are so many
different direction you can go.
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And, so there are some
people who believe that there
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are many different people from
other planets walking around
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on the earth.
That's actually what I
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was studying when
I came to the truth,
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when I began to understand.
And so I was reading books,
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having to, dealing
with whether or not
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there were
extraterrestrials on this earth,
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and what they look like?
People going through something
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that is... they
were called a walk in,
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and that's where, I
am tired of this life.
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I am going to turn my
life over to another soul,
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somebody else that had lived
in a different body before,
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and were ready to reincarnate.
I'm tired of this life,
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so rather than
committing suicide
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or doing anything like that,
I'll just let some other soul
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come along and
take over my body.
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So, those are the
things that I was studying.
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And some of them
were, some of the beliefs
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can get out there, okay.
Did you get into channeling
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of spirits or
speaking with the dead?
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I did not specifically do that.
I went through self-hypnosis,
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and I experienced former
lives, and I say that in quotes
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"former lives."
But I was at seances,
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I was at places where
people were channeling others.
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And, so I've seen it
happen, and I did believe in it.
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While I didn't
believe that everyone
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who did it was above
board, you know there were
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some charlatans in it as well.
But I believed it was possible
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when some people
doing it were valid.
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You know there are so
many on television today.
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There is so much about,
there is so much spiritism,
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yes, which is all
this New Age belief.
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We call it new,
but it's not new,
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I mean its been
around for quite sometime.
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But, we see so many
programs on today about ghosts,
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and speaking with the dead.
And we've got famous people
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now who built their celebrity
on speaking with the dead.
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Which the Bible
says is impossible,
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because it says the
dead, dead are dead,
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are dead and know
nothing. But what did,
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I mean what do you
think is the most dangerous
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practice out
there in New Age today.
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Well, there are so many of them.
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I would say the
most dangerous practice
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in New Age is New
Age. Because, no matter
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what's in there is leading
you away from God's word,
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away from the
Bible, away from His truth.
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And so we are judged
by the amount of knowledge
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that we have, but
we are also judged
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by our ability to
get that knowledge.
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And so we are to
study God's word.
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And if we are serious
about understanding what God
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wants us to know,
and to believe reading
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the Bible has to be
paramount. And when we read
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these other books,
these other stories,
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or whatever
magazines by people that tell
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a different story other
than what's in the Bible.
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That is the wrong path,
and so it's all the wrong path.
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Okay, but I'm gonna
play the devil's advocate
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for just a moment.
Okay. I hate even to use
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that
terminology. But I understand.
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But there is someone out
there, maybe that's watching
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us now or
listening on the radio.
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Who is saying, there
go those Christians again.
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They don't know what
they're talking about.
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They are so
narrow-minded, they are saying
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it all as to be from the
Bible or nothing else matters.
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How do you address
this? Now, one thing I forgot
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to mention, your
book, Falling for a Lie,
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the New Age Beliefs
That Nearly Killed you.
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You've been there and done that
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yes. So, you've
come out of this.
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But how do you address
to people who are maybe
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studying Hinduism.
And they've got someone
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who is their spiritual
guide, their mentor, or not,
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what do they call them even.
Anyway the spiritual guides.
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The guru probably. The gurus.
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Which you are talking about.
What would you say to someone
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out there who is saying
just what you just said,
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that they
believed that the Bible
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is a lesser source.
What kind of proof could
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we possibly have that the Bible
is the highest intelligence
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that's available to man.
The only proof is going to come
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from the Holy Spirit.
Because as people read
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the Bible you can,
Satan can always guide
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them to different things
that sometimes don't make sense,
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are certainly in today's world
there for us to understand.
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I wish I could say
there was a magic bullet.
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There is not a magic
bullet; the only way that anyone
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ever learns the truth
is through the Holy Spirit.
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And so ask for the Holy Spirit,
ask for God to keep Satan
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and his demons away,
and ask for the Holy Spirit
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to guide them.
Anyone who is truly seeking,
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truly searching
will find the truth.
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But if they don't want
it, they won't find it.
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You know for me personally,
because I am seeker as well,
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and I've
studied a lot of things.
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But for me personally,
the idea that prophecy
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was told with such
certainty, especially the
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Daniel 9:24-27
prophecy that seventy week time
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prophecy that actually told when
Jesus arrival would be here.
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When he would be anointed.
To me, the idea that archeology
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is proving the facts
of the Bible you know,
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I know things in
my own life time.
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I can remember
archeologists saying,
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well the Bible is not
true because of such and such.
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And, now within my
lifetime new archeological digs
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have uncovered to prove
what the Bible has said.
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Science has never disproven
anything the Bible said.
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The Bible said the
earth was round when everybody
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else thought it was
flat. The Bible talks about
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the speed of light before they
knew that light had a speed.
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So, the Bible to me
has so much evidence,
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in the fact that it foretold
history and was so accurate.
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As well as to see
these you know the historical
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evidence of Jesus,
and the disciple's lives,
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and to know that His disciples
were changed after His death.
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And they had to be
real what happened.
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And know they turned
the world upside down.
00:10:00.96\00:10:02.94
But I agree with
you, you have to pray
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and ask the Holy Spirit.
As far as what you're saying,
00:10:05.54\00:10:08.04
all of that is true,
but they have to be able
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to accept the Bible
and understand, yes,
00:10:12.29\00:10:13.83
see there are when
you talk about prophecy.
00:10:13.84\00:10:16.37
The prophecy in the Bible
is not the kind that says,
00:10:17.52\00:10:20.75
okay on July
15th, 9:22 am this is,
00:10:20.76\00:10:24.54
this particular
thing is going to happen.
00:10:24.55\00:10:26.57
And there are many people who
tried to look at Bible prophecy
00:10:26.58\00:10:29.33
and had some
challenges and problems with it.
00:10:29.34\00:10:31.31
And so many people today
want to learn today, okay.
00:10:31.32\00:10:34.58
I want to know right
now, so I am going to pick
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a prophecy in the
Bible, and see if it came true.
00:10:36.21\00:10:38.63
There is a lot of research
that goes along with it.
00:10:38.64\00:10:40.89
And, so, and there are
so many people speaking
00:10:40.90\00:10:43.93
against the Bible. There
are things that different
00:10:43.94\00:10:47.43
people will say for
instance that the Bible really
00:10:47.44\00:10:50.24
isn't as old as we say it
is. That there are aspects
00:10:50.25\00:10:53.37
of it that were written in
more modern times than that.
00:10:53.38\00:10:56.37
And nobody knows this
for sure and that for sure,
00:10:56.38\00:10:58.54
and you just can't trust
it. It's amazing to me how
00:10:58.55\00:11:01.20
many people will walk away from
something rather than studying
00:11:01.21\00:11:06.84
and wanting to know the truth.
00:11:06.85\00:11:08.45
And so, when you study
it, when the Holy Spirit opens
00:11:08.46\00:11:11.61
it up to you. And as you study
00:11:11.62\00:11:13.30
step by step, it's a life
time progression of things.
00:11:13.31\00:11:17.47
It's not something that someone
is going to pick up the Bible
00:11:17.65\00:11:20.84
today and understand
everything in the Bible today.
00:11:20.85\00:11:23.46
Its a lifetime amount of work.
00:11:24.15\00:11:25.87
But when you look at the Bible,
nothing in the Bible has ever
00:11:25.88\00:11:31.41
been disproved, and
you mentioned archeology,
00:11:31.42\00:11:33.87
and that's one
of the major things.
00:11:33.88\00:11:35.63
People laughed,
they said King David
00:11:36.24\00:11:37.68
was a fable, was a
story. Well, now they found
00:11:37.69\00:11:40.77
some old texts
referring to King David.
00:11:40.78\00:11:43.43
There are so many things
that now have been proven.
00:11:44.28\00:11:47.07
The Bible has
never been proven wrong.
00:11:47.08\00:11:49.03
Science has been proven wrong
even by science so many times.
00:11:49.16\00:11:52.02
I don't see how
people can rely on that.
00:11:52.03\00:11:54.85
Yes. But the prophecy is good,
but the people are not going
00:11:54.86\00:11:59.47
to believe this, until
they have the right heart.
00:11:59.48\00:12:02.93
And so if they don't
wanna believe it they won't
00:12:03.55\00:12:05.50
believe it, so again
there is no magic bullet.
00:12:05.51\00:12:07.37
We can point to a lot of things,
but the Holy Spirit has to
00:12:07.38\00:12:10.39
impress someone, like
he did with me numerous
00:12:10.40\00:12:13.99
times as I was studying.
That's truth, that's truth,
00:12:14.00\00:12:17.81
and I kept hearing
that over and over.
00:12:17.82\00:12:19.25
Do you see in your experience,
and I know you talk with a lot
00:12:19.26\00:12:22.76
of people who call in
through 3ABN Radio Network.
00:12:22.77\00:12:26.73
Do you see New Age
that's trying to creep
00:12:27.46\00:12:30.02
into our church?
Well it's not only trying,
00:12:30.03\00:12:32.62
it's there, and it has
been there for a long time,
00:12:32.63\00:12:35.40
and I am sad to say it's also
00:12:35.41\00:12:37.06
in the
Seventh-day Adventist Church.
00:12:37.07\00:12:38.72
And if there is a Christian
church that should know better
00:12:39.36\00:12:41.88
than any of that. It is us,
but it happens over and over.
00:12:41.89\00:12:45.78
And I hear of some of
the things that are going on.
00:12:46.51\00:12:48.93
I hear of services
where a pastor is leading
00:12:48.94\00:12:51.80
a congregation in
prayer, and it's basically
00:12:51.81\00:12:53.98
a hypnotic
prayer. I was a member
00:12:53.99\00:12:56.37
of a New Age
Church, New Age wasn't part
00:12:56.38\00:12:58.80
of the title, but
they had New Age Beliefs.
00:12:58.81\00:13:00.92
And that was the
prayer and mediation we did.
00:13:01.67\00:13:03.76
We would go into
hypnotic trances more
00:13:03.77\00:13:06.55
or less through that,
through our meditation.
00:13:06.56\00:13:08.61
And I hear some of that,
I hear some of the different
00:13:09.36\00:13:11.52
concepts coming
out of the church,
00:13:11.53\00:13:14.13
they just
surprises me. Have you heard
00:13:14.27\00:13:16.35
of memory healing,
theophostics, ancient past,
00:13:16.36\00:13:22.19
where it's all
using a facilitator?
00:13:22.20\00:13:25.40
And even sometimes if
they don't use a facilitator
00:13:25.41\00:13:28.39
its guided
imagery. This is the part
00:13:28.40\00:13:30.66
of the New Age
moment, its been around since,
00:13:30.67\00:13:33.79
well it's not that new.
I mean I can remembering
00:13:33.80\00:13:35.99
in 80s when it was big
in the corporate world,
00:13:36.00\00:13:38.44
where they use this guided
imagery for memory healing.
00:13:38.45\00:13:41.22
But it's trying to
creep into our church.
00:13:41.95\00:13:43.81
There are so many things,
so, what would you tell someone
00:13:43.82\00:13:47.48
you wrote a book,
Falling for a Lie.
00:13:47.49\00:13:48.93
What is your advice to
one of our viewers who might
00:13:49.48\00:13:53.97
be out there, is
there something today
00:13:53.98\00:13:55.87
that you would like to
tell them be cautious of this.
00:13:55.88\00:13:58.57
I mean you wanna label
some things or you just wanna
00:13:58.58\00:14:01.42
give them some advice
on how they can avoid it?
00:14:01.43\00:14:03.69
Well, just general
advice if you know the Bible,
00:14:03.70\00:14:06.18
you'll know some of the concepts
that are coming to you that,
00:14:06.19\00:14:09.43
because there are so
many that you could mention.
00:14:09.44\00:14:11.58
As a matter of fact, I
was, a little while ago
00:14:12.59\00:14:15.49
working in my
computer, and I was looking at,
00:14:15.50\00:14:18.74
this is the
average Christian church.
00:14:18.75\00:14:20.87
Okay. Okay, so I am not
saying that this is specifically
00:14:20.88\00:14:23.60
Seventh-day
Adventist or anything else.
00:14:23.61\00:14:25.18
It's just the
average Christian church,
00:14:25.19\00:14:27.65
and there are some
similarities between the beliefs
00:14:27.66\00:14:29.70
in the Christian
church and New Age.
00:14:29.71\00:14:31.85
There is a lot of talk
about spiritual awakening,
00:14:33.44\00:14:35.94
be aware of that. But looking at
00:14:36.78\00:14:38.30
New Age in
Christianity. Now wait a minute,
00:14:38.31\00:14:40.63
'cause what you're
saying, I mean to me when
00:14:40.64\00:14:43.75
you say spiritual
awakening, I am thinking we need
00:14:43.76\00:14:47.25
a spiritual renewal. We
need to be made you know
00:14:47.26\00:14:50.86
baptized afresh
in the Holy Spirit.
00:14:50.87\00:14:52.75
We need the latter rain,
but what you're saying is
00:14:52.83\00:14:55.48
the word spiritual awakening.
00:14:55.49\00:14:57.47
If somebody is
inviting you to a seminar
00:14:58.01\00:15:01.92
about spiritual weakening,
this could be a New Age term.
00:15:01.93\00:15:04.87
Yes. Okay. And there
are a lot of New Age terms
00:15:05.43\00:15:07.27
that mean one thing to them
00:15:07.28\00:15:08.41
and another
thing to anybody else.
00:15:08.42\00:15:10.91
All right. And so a New
Ager would hear the term
00:15:10.92\00:15:13.48
spiritual awakening and say,
00:15:13.49\00:15:14.78
oh that's a New Age concept.
00:15:14.97\00:15:16.39
And, so sometimes
people not understanding that,
00:15:17.21\00:15:19.23
who have heard that
phrase some place else,
00:15:19.47\00:15:20.93
they are applying it
to something different.
00:15:20.94\00:15:22.47
But they don't
understand exactly
00:15:23.60\00:15:25.47
what's happening with this.
00:15:25.48\00:15:26.74
So, I mean, there
are a lot of phrases,
00:15:26.75\00:15:27.79
too many for me to go into now.
00:15:27.80\00:15:29.03
But there are a lot different
phrases that are New Age.
00:15:29.49\00:15:31.81
But when you look at
the different concepts,
00:15:32.55\00:15:34.37
okay, they, the new
ages downplay the authority
00:15:35.02\00:15:39.56
and relevancy
of the Bible. Okay.
00:15:39.57\00:15:41.66
So do many Christians.
We hope that our church
00:15:42.47\00:15:46.13
is never guilty of
that, but they are many,
00:15:46.14\00:15:49.14
there are many
Christian churches that do.
00:15:49.15\00:15:50.97
Second Timothy 3:16 says
that all of the word of God
00:15:51.42\00:15:55.06
is inspired, and is good for
our instruction, our reproof.
00:15:55.07\00:15:58.94
And okay, go ahead.
00:15:58.95\00:16:00.57
And so that's the main
thing that we have to remember
00:16:01.01\00:16:03.13
is that just because
something is in New Age,
00:16:03.37\00:16:06.95
it doesn't mean
it's not in the church.
00:16:06.96\00:16:08.29
because many of the concepts
are in the church as well.
00:16:08.30\00:16:11.57
In New Age, there is
focus on the love of God,
00:16:12.53\00:16:15.04
and if they believe in Jesus,
00:16:15.05\00:16:18.02
many New Agers don't
believe that Jesus is God.
00:16:18.55\00:16:21.06
As a matter of
fact most of them don't.
00:16:21.07\00:16:22.18
They just think
he was a good man
00:16:22.19\00:16:23.24
or he was an advanced
spiritual leader on the earth,
00:16:23.38\00:16:26.32
who came here to continue
to help one of many leading
00:16:26.59\00:16:30.48
pointing people to
the truth and so forth.
00:16:30.49\00:16:32.53
But they will
focus on the love of God,
00:16:33.42\00:16:36.86
not salvation
principles and requirements,
00:16:38.42\00:16:42.32
so everything
is focused on love,
00:16:42.33\00:16:43.98
be tolerant, and so forth.
00:16:43.99\00:16:46.14
Well, that's same
thing is happening
00:16:46.62\00:16:47.89
in many Christian churches,
00:16:47.90\00:16:49.26
and I've got to say that
I know that their concept is
00:16:49.27\00:16:51.38
in the
Seventh-day Adventist church.
00:16:51.39\00:16:52.92
Not talking about salvation,
00:16:53.50\00:16:56.04
not talking about
the coming of Christ,
00:16:56.79\00:16:58.79
but just focusing
on the love of God.
00:16:59.14\00:17:00.93
And you know this is what
I think is the difficulty,
00:17:01.36\00:17:03.61
and maybe why some of
these things creep in.
00:17:03.62\00:17:05.78
First of all, the Bible
clearly tells us God is love,
00:17:06.40\00:17:10.05
and some people
don't pay enough attention
00:17:10.06\00:17:12.41
to the love of God.
00:17:12.42\00:17:13.43
And it is such a huge topic,
00:17:13.92\00:17:15.42
we need to
understand the love of God,
00:17:15.43\00:17:17.59
and we need to
understand that He loved us
00:17:18.35\00:17:20.90
enough to send
His son to die for us
00:17:20.91\00:17:22.92
while we were yet sinners.
00:17:22.93\00:17:24.41
But what you're saying is that
00:17:25.22\00:17:27.49
what's creeping
into the church is
00:17:28.40\00:17:30.17
they're beginning to
embrace this beautiful truth,
00:17:30.63\00:17:33.89
something that we need to spend
00:17:34.29\00:17:35.68
a lot of time understanding.
00:17:35.69\00:17:37.28
But they're doing
it out of balance.
00:17:38.00\00:17:40.44
In other words,
it's all about love
00:17:40.45\00:17:42.69
and not about the
empowering of God.
00:17:42.88\00:17:45.32
That when God loves
us and we accept Him
00:17:45.90\00:17:48.45
and yield ourselves to Him.
00:17:48.72\00:17:50.32
That He will empower
us by transforming power
00:17:50.99\00:17:53.68
of His word, and
of His Holy Spirit,
00:17:53.69\00:17:55.53
to walk in
obedience to His practices.
00:17:56.06\00:17:57.98
So, what you're
saying is when things get
00:17:58.36\00:17:59.77
out of balance even within,
00:17:59.78\00:18:01.80
yes, any church we
can end up going toward,
00:18:01.81\00:18:05.32
sliding toward that
slippery slope toward New Age.
00:18:05.73\00:18:07.91
Yes. Okay. And, or
least staying away from,
00:18:07.92\00:18:10.93
these are similar
concepts between the two,
00:18:11.49\00:18:13.63
so not necessarily
if somebody for instance
00:18:13.64\00:18:16.71
in the church,
00:18:16.72\00:18:17.69
just focuses on the love of God.
00:18:17.70\00:18:18.69
Not necessarily
they're going to New Age,
00:18:18.70\00:18:20.42
but they're making the
same mistake as New Agers.
00:18:20.50\00:18:22.77
Okay. So, it's very
similar and it does need to be
00:18:22.78\00:18:26.38
balanced and
that's the challenge.
00:18:26.39\00:18:27.89
Because many
times in our church,
00:18:28.51\00:18:30.21
we're very
oriented toward prophecy.
00:18:30.22\00:18:33.01
Well sometimes pastors
will spend all of their time,
00:18:34.04\00:18:36.36
week after week,
Sabbath after Sabbath,
00:18:36.37\00:18:38.22
talking about
prophecy and that just about
00:18:38.47\00:18:40.94
all they ever talked
about from the pulpit
00:18:40.95\00:18:42.59
And the only time
people get any relief from that
00:18:42.60\00:18:45.06
is if a guest
speaker comes in sometimes,
00:18:45.07\00:18:47.27
if the pastor can't be there,
he's on vacation or whatever.
00:18:47.28\00:18:49.64
A balanced message is the key.
00:18:50.25\00:18:52.33
Yes, the love of God
is extremely important,
00:18:52.64\00:18:54.75
and we all need we need
to learn and understand.
00:18:54.76\00:18:57.36
But if we focus just on that
00:18:58.03\00:18:59.36
and miss the keys we
won't be ready for other things
00:18:59.37\00:19:01.73
as and we won't
grow like we need to.
00:19:01.74\00:19:03.93
If we're focused
on the other things,
00:19:04.11\00:19:05.47
we'll probably be deficient in
understanding the love of God.
00:19:05.66\00:19:08.47
So, may I
paraphrase what you are saying,
00:19:08.95\00:19:10.45
what you're
saying is we can know
00:19:10.74\00:19:11.95
all the prophecies by heart,
00:19:11.96\00:19:13.26
but if we don't have intimate
relationship with Jesus,
00:19:13.27\00:19:16.12
we won't be
safe. Absolutely. Okay.
00:19:16.53\00:19:18.17
Very good, okay,
something else that is similar.
00:19:18.43\00:19:21.62
The focus on emotional
experiences rather than
00:19:21.84\00:19:25.32
studying scriptures.
00:19:25.33\00:19:26.44
And especially those
scriptures pointing to Christ
00:19:27.31\00:19:29.47
return in the time
and history where we are.
00:19:29.48\00:19:32.08
And so, how does that
make you feel, is the question.
00:19:32.09\00:19:34.76
How do you feel about that,
00:19:34.77\00:19:35.79
it doesn't make me feel good,
00:19:36.15\00:19:37.12
I don't like that, well
then get rid of it. Okay.
00:19:37.13\00:19:38.74
See and that's
a part of New Age.
00:19:39.61\00:19:41.87
Whatever, one of
things I ran across,
00:19:42.81\00:19:44.66
as I would talk
to people in New Age.
00:19:45.50\00:19:47.04
I would learn
things that they believe
00:19:47.54\00:19:50.29
that I thought who
were really hogwash.
00:19:50.30\00:19:52.75
And so, my response to
them was, it all was not,
00:19:54.35\00:19:58.39
well that's hogwash,
my response to them was.
00:19:58.40\00:20:00.67
Well, that's your
reality and I can understand
00:20:00.73\00:20:03.25
if you believe that to be true.
00:20:03.31\00:20:04.46
If I would tell
somebody something
00:20:04.75\00:20:06.87
and they'll be
looking at me, like that,
00:20:06.88\00:20:07.96
their response to me was
well that's your reality.
00:20:09.30\00:20:12.24
And that's fine, whatever
is reality for you is okay,
00:20:12.83\00:20:15.32
and that's
happening. Anything goes.
00:20:16.10\00:20:17.66
Yes, and that's
happening in Christian church
00:20:17.67\00:20:21.61
and it's happening in
Adventist church as well.
00:20:22.07\00:20:24.15
The ecumenical movement
find something everyone can
00:20:25.38\00:20:29.59
agree on and ignore the
things that cause problem.
00:20:29.60\00:20:33.37
Like Ten Commandments.
00:20:34.07\00:20:35.47
Doctrine beliefs, doctrine
beliefs based on the Bible,
00:20:36.32\00:20:39.58
and I need to make
sure that you understand,
00:20:40.02\00:20:41.76
that's what I am talking about.
00:20:41.77\00:20:42.74
Because there are
doctrine beliefs that are not
00:20:42.75\00:20:45.73
based on the Bible.
00:20:45.74\00:20:46.71
Are the requirement
for salvation and so forth.
00:20:47.06\00:20:49.41
And so, if you're
focused on trying to get along
00:20:50.12\00:20:55.49
and we're not getting along
00:20:55.95\00:20:56.92
in this particular thing,
00:20:56.93\00:20:57.90
get rid of it.
Why talk about it,
00:20:58.66\00:21:00.29
if it makes you mad, if
it makes somebody else mad,
00:21:00.30\00:21:01.97
we just want to get along.
00:21:02.56\00:21:03.53
So basically
most New Age practices
00:21:04.14\00:21:06.42
its all about
peace, peace, love.
00:21:06.61\00:21:08.88
Age of Aquarius.
An acceptance is what
00:21:10.29\00:21:12.56
you're saying, yes.
00:21:12.57\00:21:13.54
Now, I want to
you said this twice,
00:21:13.89\00:21:16.92
so I want make
sure I understand.
00:21:16.93\00:21:18.47
When you talked about the
requirements of salvation.
00:21:18.48\00:21:20.47
You believe that, I
think you believe exactly
00:21:21.30\00:21:23.41
as I do and
what we teach is that
00:21:23.42\00:21:26.10
salvation is only by
grace through faith, yes,
00:21:26.11\00:21:29.07
in the Lord Jesus
Christ where there is no way
00:21:29.08\00:21:31.52
we can work our
way to heaven. Yes.
00:21:31.53\00:21:33.46
There is nothing we can
do to earn our salvation.
00:21:33.47\00:21:36.12
Yet once we are save
by grace through faith
00:21:36.95\00:21:40.69
that as same grace
empowers us to love God
00:21:40.86\00:21:46.17
in such way that we
will walk in obedience
00:21:46.18\00:21:49.01
to its commitments.
00:21:49.02\00:21:50.20
And Jesus tell us in John 14:15,
00:21:50.60\00:21:52.67
if you love me,
keep my commandments.
00:21:53.04\00:21:54.49
So, it also says Hebrews 5:9,
00:21:55.07\00:21:57.97
that he became the
author of eternal salvation
00:21:57.98\00:22:00.60
to all who obey
Him. So, we're saying,
00:22:00.61\00:22:03.11
Ephesians 2:8 says
that we're saved by grace
00:22:03.72\00:22:06.30
through faith. And
Ephesians 2:10 says
00:22:06.31\00:22:07.97
that we are his own handy work,
00:22:07.98\00:22:11.13
saved by grace
through faith to do
00:22:11.28\00:22:13.43
the good works he
prepared in advance for us do.
00:22:13.65\00:22:16.03
So the requirements of
salvation are being submitted
00:22:16.62\00:22:20.79
and committed to God, trusting
00:22:20.80\00:22:22.76
that we're saved by
grace through faith.
00:22:23.09\00:22:24.43
Yet yielding our
lives to his leading,
00:22:25.10\00:22:28.50
being lead by His
Spirit as Romans 8:14 says,
00:22:28.51\00:22:31.62
only those who
are led by the Spirit
00:22:32.24\00:22:34.35
are the children of God, right.
00:22:34.57\00:22:35.94
That's right. And
I'm glad you did that
00:22:35.95\00:22:37.59
because I didn't
want to mislead anyone.
00:22:37.60\00:22:39.72
So I am glad you
jumped in on that.
00:22:40.04\00:22:41.29
You know something
else that's happening
00:22:41.71\00:22:42.95
is hate speech
is being redefined,
00:22:43.62\00:22:47.06
it's being redefined
by the New Age Movement
00:22:47.79\00:22:50.35
and by the Christian
Movement as well. Yes.
00:22:50.53\00:22:52.97
And secularists as well.
00:22:53.53\00:22:55.79
So I mean, hate
speech is being redefined.
00:22:55.80\00:22:57.47
What it used to be
was, if I said something
00:22:58.18\00:23:01.14
that could cause you harm
00:23:01.15\00:23:03.46
then that was hate speech.
00:23:03.73\00:23:04.85
Where I said, this
person is a bad person,
00:23:05.10\00:23:06.80
everybody beat her up.
00:23:06.81\00:23:08.34
You know that could
cause you harm or worse,
00:23:08.94\00:23:10.42
and then people have done that.
00:23:10.43\00:23:11.69
Well now what's happening
00:23:12.21\00:23:13.19
is that if you say
something that say,
00:23:14.14\00:23:17.90
you say something
that hurts my feeling.
00:23:18.22\00:23:19.44
I can say hate
speech, hate speech.
00:23:20.33\00:23:21.61
Okay, you just, you
disagree with something,
00:23:22.87\00:23:24.41
one of my beliefs on
in my church or whatever.
00:23:24.42\00:23:27.66
And so, you disagree with me
00:23:29.10\00:23:30.63
and the way that I
can get you to shut up
00:23:31.07\00:23:32.49
and not tell people about that
00:23:32.75\00:23:34.10
is to accuse you of hate speech.
00:23:34.11\00:23:35.54
For example, the Bible
speaks against homosexuality,
00:23:36.47\00:23:42.98
many people cannot preach
against homosexuality now,
00:23:43.69\00:23:46.60
because it is
considered hate speech.
00:23:46.87\00:23:48.67
Yes. God does
not hate homosexuals,
00:23:48.68\00:23:51.28
he loves homosexuals.
00:23:51.60\00:23:52.87
But he disapproves of
the practice, this sin.
00:23:53.41\00:23:56.67
And we all are sinners,
00:23:57.21\00:23:58.65
we all fall short
of the sight of God
00:23:58.84\00:24:00.13
but is this what
you're talking about is that.
00:24:00.58\00:24:02.33
It's getting to the
point that hate speech is being
00:24:02.66\00:24:05.99
redefined that
anytime you correct someone,
00:24:06.23\00:24:09.95
even using scripture.
It can now be qualified
00:24:10.14\00:24:13.80
as hate speech,
because there is this movement.
00:24:13.81\00:24:16.67
This ecumenical
movement that lets don't say
00:24:16.68\00:24:19.53
that what you're doing is bad,
00:24:19.86\00:24:21.14
lets don't say what
they're doing is bad.
00:24:21.34\00:24:23.28
But rather lets all
just love one and another
00:24:23.75\00:24:26.01
and see what we can
agree on, yes, that's...
00:24:26.02\00:24:28.07
And that's it exactly.
00:24:28.87\00:24:29.84
And so that's
what they focus on,
00:24:30.09\00:24:32.37
that's what they
want to focus on,
00:24:32.56\00:24:33.77
is all the things
that we can have common
00:24:34.42\00:24:36.81
and love each other on.
00:24:36.82\00:24:37.96
And why do you wanna
hurt anyone's feelings.
00:24:37.97\00:24:39.75
Okay, well people can
hurt my feelings all they want.
00:24:39.76\00:24:42.43
If I am wrong, I
want them pointed out.
00:24:42.44\00:24:43.99
But so many people don't.
00:24:44.68\00:24:45.73
Now this is a story I've heard
00:24:45.89\00:24:47.05
and I have to got
tell you that I am other
00:24:47.06\00:24:49.22
than reading on the
Internet I can't verify it.
00:24:49.23\00:24:51.76
But I've heard other
stories similar to this,
00:24:51.92\00:24:54.39
and that's in Canada.
00:24:54.87\00:24:55.84
A judge has said that if anyone
00:24:56.75\00:24:59.04
from the pulpit preaches,
00:24:59.05\00:25:01.07
even reads the Bible verses
00:25:01.53\00:25:03.80
that speak
against homosexuality,
00:25:03.97\00:25:06.07
that person will be arrested
00:25:06.57\00:25:07.89
and charged with the hate crime.
00:25:07.90\00:25:09.15
I've heard the same.
00:25:09.36\00:25:10.33
Okay, we know that
it's like that in Europe.
00:25:10.55\00:25:13.10
We know it's like
that in Scandinavia,
00:25:13.68\00:25:15.16
it has moved to Canada.
00:25:15.90\00:25:17.12
And people are pushing
for that in America as well.
00:25:17.89\00:25:20.79
And so when it
comes, I can take it.
00:25:21.48\00:25:23.56
If somebody
looks at me and says,
00:25:23.95\00:25:24.99
you know I don't like
your church and I don't like
00:25:25.00\00:25:26.95
would you guys believe in.
00:25:26.96\00:25:27.98
And go right down the line
00:25:27.99\00:25:29.06
and say that's all
a bunch of boloney.
00:25:29.07\00:25:31.25
And I am just not going to
pay any attention to it at all,
00:25:31.26\00:25:33.47
you're stupid and
go right down the line,
00:25:33.69\00:25:35.24
okay, fine. And I just,
I let it go, it doesn't me.
00:25:35.34\00:25:40.29
I don't want to stop
that person from talking.
00:25:40.30\00:25:42.30
Let him say whatever they want,
00:25:42.90\00:25:43.98
they have the right
to say their beliefs,
00:25:44.19\00:25:45.84
like I should had the
right to say my beliefs.
00:25:45.85\00:25:47.63
Amen, Amen.
00:25:47.64\00:25:48.61
We only have a
couple of minutes left.
00:25:50.24\00:25:51.73
Okay. Let me ask you a question,
00:25:51.74\00:25:52.71
why did you write this
book, Falling for a Lie?
00:25:53.82\00:25:56.21
Well there were
two reasons actually.
00:25:56.90\00:25:58.83
And the people who
published the book,
00:26:00.18\00:26:02.10
told me they
wanted to have one reason,
00:26:02.64\00:26:03.97
I kept telling them
they are two reasons.
00:26:03.98\00:26:05.90
And so finally they
said, okay, all right,
00:26:06.48\00:26:08.08
because I can understand,
00:26:08.09\00:26:09.06
you wanna focused the book.
00:26:09.07\00:26:10.04
But there were two audiences
00:26:10.50\00:26:12.35
that I wanted to read this book.
00:26:12.36\00:26:13.68
Number one,
people who are in New Age
00:26:14.06\00:26:17.36
or share some of their beliefs.
00:26:17.37\00:26:19.08
I want to point out
the errors in New Age.
00:26:20.37\00:26:23.40
The errors in some of
the beliefs that people
00:26:23.85\00:26:26.09
have about the Christian church.
00:26:26.34\00:26:27.75
The second audience
is Seventh-day Adventist
00:26:28.85\00:26:31.65
and there are so many
people that don't understand
00:26:32.42\00:26:34.52
what's going on, that I
though this might help them
00:26:34.77\00:26:37.06
to understand some of the
things happening in New Age.
00:26:37.07\00:26:39.46
And it also provides a
vehicle for them to hand
00:26:40.00\00:26:43.06
to someone else and say,
00:26:43.07\00:26:45.69
here's a book
you may want to read
00:26:46.78\00:26:48.58
and you might find
it to be interesting.
00:26:48.85\00:26:50.73
And so, it was just
very important to reach
00:26:51.24\00:26:53.15
both of those
segments of audience.
00:26:53.40\00:26:54.61
I do have to say
it's a sad thing,
00:26:55.05\00:26:56.42
but right now the
book is out of print.
00:26:56.58\00:26:58.05
There have been
different times we've looked
00:26:59.00\00:27:00.15
at bringing back
into print again one day.
00:27:00.34\00:27:02.44
And maybe we will.
But you know I just,
00:27:02.45\00:27:04.97
it was a blessing
for my family and me,
00:27:04.98\00:27:07.76
to get that book out there.
00:27:07.77\00:27:08.86
And we've reached
so many people with it.
00:27:09.13\00:27:10.73
You know it occurs to
be that Jesus says that
00:27:11.46\00:27:14.25
there is going be
many false prophets
00:27:15.46\00:27:17.34
who will raise up and
that they will deceive
00:27:17.58\00:27:20.74
the very elect if possible.
00:27:20.75\00:27:22.48
And so I know
that one of your things
00:27:23.07\00:27:25.51
as you want people
to know, know the truth,
00:27:25.52\00:27:27.82
not be deceived.
00:27:27.83\00:27:28.80
So, thank you so
much, Jay, for coming.
00:27:28.81\00:27:30.23
You're welcome. You
know it is just it's sad
00:27:30.24\00:27:33.63
how fast the time
passes when we really on
00:27:33.64\00:27:36.66
an interesting topic.
But I just want you to know
00:27:36.67\00:27:38.91
that God loves you so much
00:27:39.66\00:27:41.78
and he does not
want you to be deceived.
00:27:41.79\00:27:43.77
And so He has give us his word,
00:27:44.55\00:27:46.35
I wanna encourage
you, get into the word.
00:27:46.36\00:27:48.39
Find out the truth, so
that you cannot be deceived.
00:27:49.06\00:27:52.76
May God bless you richly.
00:27:53.06\00:27:54.54