Participants: Shelley Quinn (Host), Jerry Connell
Series Code: IAA
Program Code: IAA000211
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00:29 Hello, I'm Shelley Quinn and well come to another
00:31 Issues and Answers. What is your concept 00:34 of God the Father, that's what we gonna 00:36 be talking about today. And I have with us 00:39 Pastor Jerry Connell and Jerry is a pastoral 00:44 psychotherapist and a marriage and family 00:46 therapist joining us again from Lincoln, 00:49 Nebraska. Good to be here. Well I'm so 00:51 glad you're back because we really enjoyed 00:53 your program. The last program we did was 00:55 on marital intimacy and today we're gonna 00:58 be talking about intimacy with the Lord, 01:00 aren't we. But particularly we gonna 01:02 be talking about our emotional 01:04 response to God the Father. 01:08 Now it's a very interesting topic how 01:10 did this, why did you choose this topic. 01:13 Well it kind of grew over the years because 01:18 when I do intakes, when people come and 01:20 to talk to me, they want help with their 01:23 marriage or just if its an individual 01:25 wanting some help or wanting to kind of 01:27 process with some issues, I have a 01:30 intake form that I ask a lot of questions 01:32 about. So I can really get to know them 01:34 but because I'm both a pastor and a 01:36 clinical pastoral counselor, I've got some 01:39 questions that normally don't show up 01:41 in a regular say non Christian counselor's 01:43 office and one of those questions after 01:46 I deal with some of their issues and family 01:49 issues, the background is, tell me about your 01:52 experience with God? And you know it really 01:56 does affect our emotional response to 01:58 God the Father really affects us. I know 02:01 I usually share a scripture, and the 02:03 scripture that I would use for this program 02:06 would be Hebrews 1:3 and let me tell 02:08 you why I grew up believing in Jesus 02:11 Christ, I knew about the Holy Spirit or 02:13 I learned about the Holy Spirit in my 20s 02:16 but I had a terrible picture of God the 02:18 Father. I was very fearful of the Father 02:20 and Hebrews 1:3 helped me overcome that. 02:24 Let me read that to you, it says, He, 02:27 Jesus is the sole expression of the glory 02:30 of God, He is the perfect imprint and very image 02:35 of God's nature. And you know when I learned 02:38 that Jesus and the Father were one and the same, 02:42 then I was able to love the Father because 02:46 I knew he was just as loving and tender as 02:48 Jesus Christ, just as merciful and 02:50 compassionate and it did away with that 02:52 picture that God was just up there ready 02:55 to zap me when I made a mistake. But 02:57 what are some of the way that it affects 02:59 us if we don't have the right image of 03:02 God the Father. Well I think it affects us 03:05 in our spiritual life in many, many ways 03:08 obviously wanting to spend time with God, 03:11 right, or wanting to read the word., 03:14 or just the whole idea of letting God 03:17 get close to us. That's huge and people get 03:23 a very distorted picture of God, yes, 03:26 and its so distorted that it well sometimes 03:31 people frankly they just walk away from God and 03:34 you know the thing is in scripture the term 03:38 Father is used a couple hundred times, 03:41 very prominent, and especially in the gospel 03:43 of John its probably the most prominent book, 03:45 but I think Jesus you know when the disciple 03:49 said, well you know show us the Father 03:51 and that will be good enough and Jesus said 03:52 well if you've seen me you have seen the 03:54 Father. Jesus, I believe knew that if we got 03:59 that right, that would solve an amazing amount 04:03 of things in our spiritual journey, 04:04 if we can only get right what the Father would 04:08 really like, amen, if you have seen Me you have 04:11 seen the Father. One of my favorite authors 04:15 Dr. Michael Green who for years pastored 04:17 a church in Oxford, he is now at Regent College 04:19 of Vancouver, Canada but he said Jesus sole 04:23 passion was his Father, and to show us, 04:28 that was, yeah and that was the passion because 04:31 you know we're spiritual by nature. 04:34 We're created an image of God but we have 04:36 a distorted image of God, yes, Jesus believed 04:41 and tried to communicate and tried to help us 04:43 to understand if we only get this right it 04:45 would solve and that's why he wanted to model 04:47 what God the Father was like. So, he could say 04:50 well if you've seen Me you've seen the Father 04:52 because He knew what we believed about 04:55 God really does effect our journey, 04:57 especially our spiritual journey. 04:59 Well and I imagine it affects more than just 05:01 our spiritual journey, it probably affects, 05:03 very much affects our family dynamics. 05:07 Does it not, if you don't trust God the Father 05:09 you're not gonna trust your own Father that 05:12 much or if you got a bad relationship with 05:14 the Father you won't trust God the Father, 05:16 how does this show up in a Christian counselor's 05:18 office. Well it shows up often if people are 05:23 tying to, sometimes work in their marriage and 05:26 they get down to some of the spiritual issues 05:27 in their marriage it'll show up there and so 05:30 we'll need to deal with those kinds of issues. 05:32 And so let me go directly Shelley into some 05:36 of the stories to illustrate, 'cause 05:38 it's best we learn by stories and it's best 05:40 illustrated by stories. Now I just want to say 05:43 before I share some of these stories, 05:44 I have permission to share this, go ahead. 05:46 And when people just open up their life to 05:51 me I feel like Moses at the burning bush when 05:56 God said, Moses take off your shoes because 05:58 the ground you're on is holy ground, this 06:02 is people's journey, this is people's life that 06:04 they're opening up to me and I don't take 06:07 that lightly at all. I mean this is like real 06:09 communally serious stuff that and they've invited 06:12 me into their life at this level, and so 06:15 I hope there's some scared trust but they 06:17 have given me permission so that other 06:19 people can learn and particularly so a parent 06:21 can learn, amen. The influence of their life 06:25 has on their children. There is no part of 06:28 a child's life that the parent's life does not 06:30 affect. There is no part at all, that's true, 06:32 nothing. We're just gonna isolate some spiritual 06:36 dimensions today, okay. Here's one 06:39 of the stories. This young adult was in her 06:42 20s, grew up in a home where dad was, 06:44 he worked for the denomination, he was 06:49 a workaholic, he was gone often all night 06:52 at his job even though it was a day job 06:57 and if there was a problem at home this 07:01 daughter could phone her dad at work, 07:04 he would come home solve the problem then 07:08 he go back to work. There is lesser 07:10 experience with her father, so I said 07:12 well tell me about your experience with God. 07:16 Now listen to this, this is a quote okay, 07:21 "sometimes he's distant, I run to him when I 07:26 can't go anywhere else. When I have a 07:29 problem I pray," yes, tell me your experience 07:34 with God. Sometimes when I have a problem I 07:38 pray, or talk to him. It feels good for a while 07:43 but it doesn't last. Notice the parallels, 07:47 perfectly newed her relationship with 07:50 the father. Here's another one, this young 07:52 adult when this young adult came in to see me 07:56 in her 30s. Grew up in a situation where dad 08:02 was a rageaholic, would just go ballistic, 08:06 literally would hide behind mom when dad 08:09 would just go nuts. And they felt as a 08:15 young adult they can never do anything 08:16 enough. It didn't matter how hard they tried 08:19 to be good it was only until time that dad 08:22 would go ballistic, amen. And then I asked the 08:30 question eventually, well how do you experience 08:34 God. Tell me how you experience God? 08:37 This is what they said, I try to be good 08:40 so he'll like me. I'm very consistent in my 08:46 devotion, in family worship. This is as a 08:50 married young adult, but regardless of how 08:53 hard I try it feels like its only a case of time 08:55 till God will get really angry at me. And 08:59 you know I identify with that. If I mess up 09:01 he'll reject me, I identify because that's 09:05 what I grew up with, sort of, yeah. 09:08 There's another one, this person was in her early 09:14 40s when she and her husband came to talk 09:20 to me and they drove some distance to come. 09:27 And this person grew up with just lots of chaos, 09:33 emotional abuse, sexual abuse by her mother. 09:43 And I asked the question tell me how's your 09:47 experience God? What's your experience with 09:49 God like? Well I've a hard time trusting God 09:56 where feeling accepted by him much like 10:00 I have a hard time trusting my mom and 10:03 feeling accepted by her. Now that's interesting 10:07 because you would think that it was more of 10:11 how she related to her father that would affect 10:14 God the Father but even the mother's 10:16 relationship this was her picture of parental 10:19 authority. Father was out of the picture. 10:24 That's interesting. So you see the parentified 10:28 image of God, right. Let me give you another one. 10:34 Its amazing when some, because I have people 10:37 come into me of a wide spectrum of professions, 10:43 doctors to lawyers to pastors, nurses to 10:47 people working in the technological world to 10:53 construction, you name it, okay. But this 10:56 person was a mid-level management person, okay, 11:02 very professional. But came into me because 11:07 he had a hard time, was having a hard time 11:10 feeling he said. And couldn't bond, feel like 11:14 couldn't bond with his wife and his children 11:16 in his early 40s, how painful. And so in the 11:21 process I began to ask him, you know the 11:26 questions about his growing up years and 11:30 this is among the things he said, he grew up in 11:35 a home where dad was very distant, harsh, 11:39 judgmental, emotionally distant, very 11:46 unnurturing. And so I said tell me about your 11:53 experience with God. This is what he said, 11:59 he's far away, judgmental, stern, not a 12:07 person I would go running to pretty much 12:11 like my dad. Exactly like my dad someone I would 12:15 run from. Oh mercy, how sad, did you see Shelley 12:22 the influence we have as parents on our children. 12:26 Did you see why Jesus would say if we've seen 12:30 him we've seen the Father because Jesus wanted 12:33 us to at least understand this to get it right, 12:35 because of the influence that I mean imagine 12:39 running from God instead of running to him 12:42 because God to him was so much like his father. 12:47 Well in, as I said at the beginning of the 12:49 program I can imagine because its hitting 12:52 a little close to home and thank God that 12:54 he brought me out of that and taught me 12:56 that Jerry don't you have some positive stories 12:59 about how people's relationships with their 13:03 parents have influenced their image of God. 13:05 Yeah, yeah, I want to get to those, I've one 13:08 more young adult 25 years old. The father 13:17 abandoned the family, he moved some hours away. 13:25 Very occasionally the father would visit, the 13:30 father was into drugs, alcohol, mom worked long 13:34 hours wasn't around much. So the kids were 13:40 on their own, lot of growing up. You know 13:43 it's pretty overwhelming for kids they have 13:46 to raise themselves, even though their mom's 13:51 working hard to try and provide for the family, 13:54 for the children. But if they don't have someone 13:58 to turn to for nurture, to care for them and so 14:04 I ask them eventually in the journey together 14:07 with me the question, how do you experience 14:12 God? What's God like? How do you experience God? 14:19 "I feel like he's not around a lot, sometimes 14:25 he's there. I wish I felt like He was there 14:29 more, I wish I felt like he cared about me 14:32 especially when I'm overwhelmed, I 14:36 would love to feel Him closer." Bless her 14:39 heart. The exact, now here's the sad thing 14:45 Shelley, with most of the examples these 14:52 are people who are very active in church 14:53 teaching Sabbath schools, some of them. Oh! 14:55 My goodness, oh, that's tragic, yeah, that's 15:00 tragic, yeah. Imagine teaching Sabbath school 15:07 but in your personal life you don't even trust 15:09 God, won't let him close to you. It all stays 15:11 up here its all cognate, you keep all of your 15:13 information cognate. But we as in the therapeutic 15:16 world we know long ago that people often will 15:20 over development the cognate domain even 15:22 in their religious life so they won't have to 15:24 deal with the stuff in him. And put it in 15:26 layman's terms it's head knowledge instead 15:29 of heart's knowledge, yeah, we don't have that 15:30 experience you may know the scriptures 15:33 but you don't have that personal experience 15:35 with God. Let me tell you a story that happened 15:39 several years ago that just as I was beginning 15:43 to see this picture come together from the 15:45 clinical study, my second daughter Cara who's now 15:52 26, she was 18 at the time so 8 years ago 15:57 she was applying for a job at Glacier View 16:01 Ranch in Colorado, they worked their for the 16:03 summer and so she was at home sitting at the 16:08 dinning table filling out the application. 16:09 I said sweetie, after you fill it, do you want 16:11 daddy to check it over and make sure its also 16:13 done right and then I can mail it from 16:15 the office for you and she said sure dad. 16:17 So she filled it out, left it on the counter 16:19 in the kitchen, I stuck it in my briefcase it 16:22 stayed there for a few days and finally 16:24 I thought oh man I really need to mail 16:25 this thing and I read it over to check it 16:27 and Shelley that knocked me over. Now 16:32 she knew nothing about this God image 16:34 theory stuff just a teenager, enjoying being 16:37 a teenager. I xeroxed it and I had it for a whole 16:43 year before even told her I xeroxed it but I 16:45 was asked to go to a seminar about helping 16:48 people understand God's grace and I said to her, 16:52 Cara I didn't tell you this but a year ago I 16:54 xeroxed your application because of something 16:57 you put in there and I used this, you suggest 17:01 that, that had to please her. Here it is, 17:06 in so much as you're applying for a summer 17:08 position at Glacier View Ranch please share 17:10 your thoughts in the following areas. 17:12 The first one, God, He's so loving that He let 17:18 his Son die in the cross. I picture God like my 17:22 dad, how precious, he's loving, caring, 17:28 forgiving, merciful, he's interested in me, 17:32 in my life and what I do. Do you see 17:38 the incredible responsibility as 17:41 parents, amen, that we have on our shoulders, 17:45 amen. It's just to me it was an overwhelming 17:51 thought, that I can color my children's picture 17:56 in relationship with God by my relationship 17:58 with them, amen, its beautiful. It's my 18:04 oldest daughter, she was for, one year went 18:09 to public school grew up in church school 18:10 but in grade 11, my wife was working on her 18:13 graduate degree at the local university 18:15 in Nebraska, in Lincoln and I was working. 18:18 I'd started I bid into my doctoral program, 18:20 she went to public school for one year because 18:23 we couldn't keep all the kids in church school 18:25 she said just for that one year daddy and 18:27 so she joined a group called Young Life 18:30 I think is, it's an evangelic organization 18:33 that their sole purpose is to teach the high 18:35 school students, the Christian high school 18:37 students how to do relationally evangelism 18:40 with the non-Christian high school students 18:42 and bring them to Christ and so she belonged 18:45 to that and in a couple of weeks they brought 18:46 her, took her into the leadership and had 18:48 meetings with different peoples homes, we 18:50 hosted at our house too and she came home one 18:52 of those one night Shelley and she said, 18:55 I asked her how it went, she said fine dad, 18:57 I said what you do? She said well you know 18:59 we had our Bible study tonight, and lets, 19:01 what was the topic tonight? She said it was 19:03 on the judgment and our concept of God to 19:06 be a God. And I said so what happened, 19:09 she said well we went around in a circle and 19:11 finally I was last and they looked at me and 19:13 they said Andrea what do you believe about 19:16 the judgment and your concepts of God and 19:18 I said so what do you say. She said well I 19:20 explained it dad the best I could and then she 19:23 said this to me, because most of the people in 19:26 this young life they're evangelicals. She 19:30 said dad where do these Christians of other 19:32 denominations get their view of God from? 19:35 She says they're such legalists, she say my 19:37 view of God is so relational. That's 19:40 precious, but you know while at night when I 19:43 would pray with the kids as they were growing 19:44 up before they went to bed I would either hold 19:47 them in my arms or just hold their hand, 19:49 I'd kneel beside their bed and hold them in 19:51 my arms or hold their hand, occasionally 19:53 I would say something like this in the prayer 19:55 not again every night I don't wanted to 19:57 redundant but I'd say this, I'd say Lord Jesus 20:00 I want to thank you for the privilege being 20:02 Andrew's daddy or Cara's daddy David, 20:04 Jerry, whoever. Well thank you for the 20:06 privilege you've given me to be their dad 20:08 and to watch them grow up and to enjoy new 20:11 experiences and become all that you've 20:13 created them to be and then I would say this, 20:15 and I'd say Lord, I love this child so deeply and 20:22 if I can love this child so deeply you must be 20:25 absolutely wild about them, oh how precious. 20:28 So, what kind of picture of God do they 20:31 grow up with? Amen, amen. 20:33 Let me tell you a couple of other stories 20:35 the people have given me. Well here's one that 20:40 is very religious family, very, very religious 20:44 family okay. But dad was gone, he worked hard, 20:48 there were several kids in the family, it was 20:51 a large family, several kids to feed. Mom though 20:54 was the boss, she was very structured, okay, 20:57 I mean to feed a whole bunch of kids, 20:58 I mean like I think it was like 8 or 10 kids. 21:00 And so she, as he said, ran a tight shift, 21:04 right, okay but she also tried to be close 21:07 to each child. And when I said to him, what is 21:11 God like as you experience God. 21:12 He said, He's a commander, no He's a 21:15 supreme commander and He's a personal friend. 21:19 Do you see the parallel? Yeah, how precious, 21:22 isn't that amazing? Here's, go ahead, 21:25 you know I was just gonna say we're getting down 21:27 to where we just have a few minutes left and 21:30 there are people in our audience who have 21:34 a perverted, distorted picture of God, as a 21:38 clinical psychologist what do you do to heal 21:41 that wound? How do you bring them from that 21:44 place where, I mean what do you do? Yeah, 21:49 you know its interesting as a pastor, yes, 21:52 and as a counselor as a pastor I got all this sort 21:54 of God stuff all over me, yes. So even coming in 21:57 and experience the heart of a Christian man 22:00 and who's present emotionally present 22:05 there, who cares very much about them, 22:08 who is very interested in them, listens 22:12 to their pain, listens to their journey, it's 22:15 amazing. What the research shows on that 22:17 too is a man can give to another man a changed 22:23 picture of God. Men can also do that for their 22:27 daughters, men can do that for women. So women 22:33 who come in and talk to me I have to deal with 22:35 it sometimes with them too. But here's a guy 22:37 whose only agenda is to help them heal. 22:42 No other agenda in the process. And so when 22:45 they experience a safe male to be around, 22:47 as someone who can listen to their heart. 22:50 Eventually it doesn't happen overnight, 22:52 its not a quick fix, but eventually it begins 22:55 to change. But what about the person who's out 23:00 there who can't run to Jerry Connell and they 23:05 may not know a Jerry Connell in their life. 23:07 Let's say that there is someone there who maybe 23:11 doesn't even trust their pastor or doesn't 23:13 be close to their pastor or maybe the pastor 23:15 is not really a people person, yeah, what 23:18 do they do? How, what can they do to start 23:23 on that path of healing? Well, there is a good; 23:26 there is a number of good books out here 23:28 that they can read on people where people 23:32 get their concepts of God. Its in a lot of 23:33 consoling books by Christian councilors 23:35 deal with those kinds of issues, that's one 23:39 place. Another one is to find someone in the 23:42 church who is, who does have a real heart 23:45 for God. You have to ask someone who 23:46 got a little heart for God. Has to be someone 23:48 who has a personal relationship with God, 23:50 a personal relationship with God, a heart to 23:52 heart and just talk to them, right, and just 23:54 say this is, this is what I'm feeling, this is 23:58 what I'm experiencing but I know this isn't 24:00 what it's all about. Would you walk with me 24:03 for a while. That's good. Would you journey 24:05 with me? That's good. You know in families the 24:09 relationships are so important and we want to 24:13 encourage families that are watching today how, 24:16 what else can you say to people who are watching 24:19 that will help them pass on a legacy of love 24:23 to their children from the Father through them 24:26 to the children. Well again I always come back 24:28 to telling people how important they are, 24:32 I mean you have to realize as parents how 24:36 important you are or it might be the 24:39 grandparents. In my case it was my grandmother 24:41 who raised me and you know what God end 24:43 up for me looking so much like my grandmother, 24:45 who absolutely thought the world of me, 24:48 who'd do anything for me. And my picture 24:51 of God is actually very much like her but its 24:55 for parents when you realize again how 24:59 valuable you are, how important you're life 25:01 is then you can begin to make the changes 25:05 and you want to as a Christian I'm thinking 25:07 as a Christian want to know this, you want 25:09 to do it differently, amen. You can't do it 25:12 the same once you know this, that would be, 25:14 that would be irresponsible. So then 25:16 you start the journey this is not a quick 25:18 thing, you start reading about how to be a good 25:20 dad, moms, how to be a good mom. How 25:23 to model a heart of God that to your 25:26 children and that's what it got to go, amen. 25:31 You know I can share from personal 25:33 experience that as I said I had a very, 25:35 I grew up in a extremely dysfunctional 25:38 home and I had a very dysfunctional, 25:41 distorted idea of who God the Father was 25:45 but I've learned in studying the Bible 25:48 when I, when the Lord opened His heart 25:51 of love to me then what I learned is that 25:53 God has my eternal benefit in mind. 25:55 Everything he's working out for my good for 25:58 eternity and it was something that 26:01 I just want to encourage each one who's watching 26:04 today that do as Pastor Jerry Connell 26:07 has said, reach out to someone at your 26:09 church that you know has something more than 26:12 "religion," a personal relationship with 26:15 the Lord. Ask them to help you on that 26:17 walk, to learn how to pray and to trust in 26:20 God, to trust in His word and to know the heart 26:23 of the Father. And if you are just pray and 26:25 ask the Lord as I do often, Lord, teach 26:29 me your love, teach me about your love. 26:31 Show me the father, and you know someone 26:34 out there has heard that you're worthless. 26:35 So you've had a parent that has told you 26:37 that, but I'm gonna tell you something 26:39 Jesus Christ, God sent him, Romans 5:8 26:43 says to die for you while you were yet a sinner 26:47 and you're worth nothing less than the price that 26:50 he paid for you with the precious blood of his 26:54 son. And it's something, I'm so glad that you 26:57 came here today Jerry to, thank you, 26:59 to encourage parents if they're making 27:02 a mistake and they're not showing that, 27:03 I believe you've given parents an idea of how 27:07 they need to change and make sure that they're 27:09 passing on that love to their children. 27:13 And for those who may have grown up without 27:16 that father image, you've given them some ideas 27:18 where to look. And I've to say I believe 27:21 that your children are very blessed to 27:22 have you as a father, oh thank you. 27:24 Well I just want to thank you once again, 27:27 the time went by so quickly but thank you so 27:29 much, you're welcome. And for those of you at 27:31 home I pray that the grace of our Lord Jesus 27:34 Christ and the love of the Father will become 27:37 so real to you and that you will experience 27:40 the joy of the fellowship of the Holy Spirit. 27:43 God is always with us, he never leaves us or 27:47 forsakes us. So call on him and get to know 27:50 God the Father. Thank you for joining us today. |
Revised 2014-12-17