Participants: Agatha Thrash, Don Miller
Series Code: HYTH
Program Code: HYTH000166
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00:01 Hello, I'm Agatha Thrash, a staff physician
00:05 at Uchee Pines Institute 00:07 and I'd like to talk with you today about sleep. 00:11 I have a number of people who will be helping me 00:14 and we will be trying to help you to realize the sweetest 00:19 words in all of sacred Scripture I think... and that is, 00:25 "He giveth His beloved sleep. " 00:28 Sometimes we know we're beloved of the Lord... 00:32 but still, we don't sleep. 00:34 Is there a reason for that? 00:35 And can we do something about it? 00:37 We'll be talking about that and we hope you will join us. 01:00 Welcome to "Help Yourself to Health" 01:02 with Dr. Agatha Thrash of Uchee Pines Institute 01:06 And now, here's your host, Dr. Thrash 01:10 You know, all kinds of things interfere with people's sleep. 01:13 Sometimes people tell us that the noise interferes 01:16 with their sleep. 01:17 Sometimes people tell us that the quietness interferes 01:20 with their sleep. 01:21 In fact, at Uchee Pines, we are far out in the country 01:26 We hear no sirens, no horns, no traffic, no people... 01:31 just the quietness of the out-of-doors. 01:36 Now, sometimes people say to us... 01:38 "I couldn't sleep last night. " 01:41 Oh... why? 01:42 "It was so QUIET." 01:44 And I always laugh a bit about that because 01:47 some people simply must have a little background noise 01:51 in order to sleep... in fact, we call that "white noise" 01:54 And, some people want a little bit of that, so that they 01:58 don't hear anything that might attract the attention 02:02 and make it so that they would wake up and... that's all right. 02:05 If that is what helps you to sleep, that's fine. 02:08 Some people like to sleep with a tape... 02:12 So they plug in a tape and they listen to music, 02:15 or they listen to a sermon. 02:18 One woman told me that I put her to sleep every night... 02:22 and I didn't know whether to feel complimented 02:24 about that or not. 02:26 But, if a tape can help you to go to sleep, 02:31 then by all means, you can use a tape. 02:35 What other things might keep someone awake? 02:38 Well I have asked Dr. Winn Horsley to 02:41 help me discuss this problem with you. 02:44 So, Dr. Horsley is a staff physician 02:46 at Uchee Pines Institute, and welcome to this program. 02:51 So, we'd like to talk with you about some of the problems 02:55 having to do with interference of sleep... 02:58 And what would you like to start with? 03:00 Well, one of the most common, I think, is illustrated by 03:03 a patient that came to Uchee Pines, 03:06 about a 40-year-old, white, gentleman 03:09 from up in the New England area... 03:12 who complained of great difficulty sleeping and 03:19 so, I went through the history and couldn't really identify 03:25 causes... 03:27 I think he had a job with some of its stresses 03:31 But we'd about finished with things 03:35 when, in fact, we maybe even finished with the exam... 03:38 when it came to the surface that he drank 03:41 quite a bit of coffee... 03:42 In fact, he said that he drank how many of these 03:51 potsful per day. 03:53 It was enough to make the equivalent of 50 cups 03:55 of coffee a day... 03:57 OH... he was not even well-hydrated... 04:03 Well, you know, that is an interesting thing that 04:06 caffeine... most people, of course, know how caffeine 04:11 does stimulate and get the heart and the nervous system going 04:14 But most people don't know that caffeine affects the kidneys, 04:18 and makes the kidneys put out more water in the urine. 04:22 And in doing that, the person then, when he takes a 04:28 cup of coffee or of Coke or other caffeine beverage, 04:33 he is better hydrated for a few minutes 04:36 But in fact, once the kidneys start reacting to the caffeine, 04:40 he's more dehydrated than when he took the beverage. 04:42 Yes, it's an interesting thing... 04:44 Here is a model of the kidney, a plastic model 04:47 with the little cap up here of the adrenals... 04:52 Yeah... and then right here, we have what is called 04:56 the kidney cortex and the kidney cortex is the place 05:01 where the urine is formed and then it travels down 05:05 this... it's illustrated in brown here, and drips into 05:10 the little kidney pelvis 05:14 But out here, caffeine exerts its diuretic influence 05:20 It causes a dilation of blood vessels here in the 05:25 kidney cortex and that increases the rate at which 05:30 the blood plasma filtrates through the kidney 05:34 and that, of course, has the capability of producing 05:37 more urine. 05:38 So the net result of drinking a cup of coffee is actually 05:41 a little loss of fluid... Exactly 05:43 You know, I'd like to return to this issue of the effect 05:48 on the nerves... Um hm 05:49 And for that matter, on the heart... 05:51 Most people don't think of caffeine as a drug, 05:54 I don't think... it's just used so routinely and habitual 05:57 And it's classified in pharmacology books, I believe, 06:01 in the toxicology section 06:03 Toxicology... poisons Yes 06:05 As a matter of fact, right here, in the Merck Manual, 06:10 a standard textbook, it has a section at the back 06:14 where poisons are dealt with and right there... 06:16 IS caffeine... Is that right? 06:18 It's together with a few other drugs, such as 06:22 theophylline which is used for asthma. 06:24 And, you know, among the toxic effects which we all know... 06:30 wakefulness, but then restlessness, anorexia, vomiting 06:33 and so on, and it can actually become dangerous. 06:36 It talks about when people are hypersensitive... 06:39 "Possible immediate vasomotor collapse" 06:42 And I was surprised to notice a greater susceptibility 06:44 in adults, "especially after an acute overdose 06:47 on top of chronic intake. " 06:49 If a person stayed up all night and drank a 06:53 cup of coffee every hour, they might really be 06:56 in serious trouble... Yes... If they were chronic 06:58 overusers anyway... Exactly 07:01 One other point about coffee, right here in the same book 07:09 They mention that several studies show that drinkers of 07:14 more than 7 to 8 cups per day, when this was a woman... 07:19 with pregnancy, there was an increased incidence of 07:22 stillbirths, preterm deliveries, low birth weight infants and 07:26 spontaneous abortions. 07:27 Now, they weren't accounting for the presence of 07:33 the use of tobacco and alcohol... 07:36 But, you know, those things go together almost all the time. 07:40 So, it is hard to sort out. 07:41 I've seen some studies done on animals where the mothers 07:46 ...before birth, like with rats, were made to drink the 07:51 caffeine in their food, or they took it ground up 07:54 in their food and the liver weights and brain weights 07:58 and muscle weights of the newborn was much reduced 08:04 below the normal in rat mothers that did NOT take the caffeine. 08:10 So it has a serious effect on babies... 08:13 And that would fit perfectly with what 08:14 the Merck Manual said there... 08:16 And would actually tend to single out the caffeine 08:18 as perhaps as dangerous as any of the other things. 08:21 Well, I wanted to take a little bit of time here to look 08:29 at the issue of sleep... 08:31 ...The nature of sleep and what does it consist of... 08:34 because it is rather mysterious. Yes it is. 08:36 It's right when the Bible says.. "The Lord giveth us sleep" 08:41 And we, of course, don't know that much about how we sleep 08:45 since we're unconscious. That's right. 08:47 What I want to show you is a graph... 08:51 again in this reference book. 08:53 A graph of normal sleep and on this little graph, 09:02 it starts from the awaking state... 09:11 The waking state is this area up on top, 09:16 and then as one falls asleep, you go through various stages 09:20 There's stage 1, which tends to be short. 09:22 Stage 2, where one is in a deeper sleep, 09:25 and that lasts longer. 09:26 Stage 3 and down to stage 4. 09:28 All of these are with greater relaxation 09:33 occurring as one goes deeper... 09:34 I think it corresponds somewhat to the stages of anesthesia. 09:39 Now there is a very interesting added phase of sleep 09:45 which is called "REM" sleep. 09:49 And that is the deepest stage down here below stage 4 09:53 "REM" stands for rapid eye movement. 09:57 During this stage of sleep, the muscles, which have been 10:02 relaxing gradually more and more down to stage 4... 10:05 they become, in a sense, totally paralyzed. 10:07 There aren't even reflexes when they've checked it 10:11 with scientific studies during this time... 10:13 BUT, one set of muscles in the body is just working overtime 10:19 ...It's the rapid eye movement, the external ocular muscles. 10:24 The muscles that make our eyes move are rapidly working 10:27 Now another curious feature about this REM stage of sleep... 10:32 the lowest one here, is that during that stage, one dreams. 10:39 When they wake a person up right at that point, 10:42 in general, he's in the middle of a dream. 10:44 It has been noted that if people, during their sleep... 10:50 if they're in a sleep lab and they interrupt the sleep, 10:53 and don't let them have any REM sleep, 10:56 that they then do not get the restorative value of sleep. 11:01 They are not refreshed the next day. 11:04 And people have called this the time of sleep in which 11:10 one's brain is reorganizing the material of the day. 11:15 Well, that's a little explanation of what has been 11:18 shown in studies about sleep... 11:21 And, I find it interesting what happens to this when 11:25 people use sleeping pills. 11:26 Tell us about that. 11:28 I think we can see better if you point with this... Oh, okay. 11:33 Makes your hand in the way a little bit... 11:36 The biggest class of sleeping pills is called benzodiazepines. 11:42 And some may have heard the names... Dalmane, Restoril, 11:47 Halcion. 11:49 These are sleeping pills that are commonly used which are all 11:52 in this class of drugs called benzodiazepines. 11:55 Now, in a publication for doctors, 11:59 I was quite interested to note what they concluded 12:04 about the effect of benzodiazepine sleeping pills 12:07 It was this... when someone started taking them because of 12:11 insomnia, at first, yes... you would get a bit longer 12:14 time asleep. 12:17 He would get more time in these first 4 stages. 12:21 However, they noted that the deep stage, the REM sleep, 12:28 the one that's shown in some of these deep areas, 12:33 was obliterated. 12:36 The person did not get this most restorative phase of sleep. 12:40 And so the benefit of the sleep, of course, was less. 12:44 Now another curious thing that happened was that 12:47 as time went on, after a number of days, not many weeks anyway, 12:51 they found that the person's total hours of sleep 12:57 that is only in stages 1 thru 4, actually went back 13:01 to the amount of time he was sleeping before he started 13:04 taking the sleeping pill. 13:05 Oh, that's very damaging to the drug isn't it? 13:09 ...The reputation of the drug. 13:11 That's right and, you know, this person then... 13:14 he's kind of locked in his situation. 13:17 He's got a worse sleep because he's got no REM sleep. 13:20 He's just as bad as he was before he took the drug 13:22 ...except NOW, if he tries to STOP taking the drug, 13:25 he's going to have rebound insomnia... a bad situation. 13:29 So he's got 2 things... 13:31 Number 1, he has lost REM sleep. 13:33 Number 2, he has no more sleep than he had before but 13:38 now he does not have this restorative property... 13:44 And he cannot do away with the drug because, if he does, 13:47 he won't sleep at all. 13:49 Now, we've worked with people that have tried coming off 13:53 and it is... you pretty much have to tell them... 13:55 "You'll need to bite the bullet. " 13:56 "You're going to have to go through some time of insomnia. " 14:01 And, if they're willing to do that... 14:04 By the way, there is some of that with a number of drugs. 14:09 If they're willing to do that, in this case with insomnia, 14:13 then after it's not too many days that they'll begin to 14:16 start regaining some of the sleep they were getting before. 14:19 A few things that can help them are such things as 14:22 exercising... Absolutely. 14:24 If they exercise abundantly, then their ability to sleep 14:28 that night, after they had been exercising a lot, 14:31 is a lot better than it could be. 14:33 And if they stay well-hydrated, sometimes we think, 14:35 "Well, the person is going to have to get up more at 14:38 night if they're well-hydrated, 14:40 but actually, the brain is a lot water and the work of 14:48 sleep is a positive work of the brain... 14:51 And so, if the brain is well-hydrated, it can 14:55 do its work better. 14:57 Can you tell us something about sleep apnea? 15:00 Now that's a curious kind of problem. 15:06 Actually, it's very related to snoring. Um hm... 15:08 And just like snoring, most people don't know they do it. 15:14 I thought I didn't snore... 15:16 You don't find out maybe until you're married... 15:18 and then your partner informs you. 15:21 I was able to inform the other way too but... 15:23 People that snore heavily tend to be 15:28 ones that do have sleep apnea. 15:30 Now sleep apnea is actually a further stage than snoring... 15:33 with a fair amount of body weight and, 15:38 therefore, generally fat. 15:40 There is going to be some of that fat deposited back 15:44 in the palate... the soft palate area. 15:47 And, when there's too much there, then it can actually 15:51 weigh down and obstruct the airway. 15:58 Now, sleep apnea then... there are things that could be 16:05 done... Maybe I should say something 16:06 about a problem that occurs with it... 16:08 It can actually be bad enough that a person will get 16:11 rhythm problems in their heart. 16:13 And, of course, going for periods as they do... 16:16 a minute, perhaps even longer, without breathing 16:19 of course, this is kind of a dramatic thing... 16:22 And then they can't stay awake well during the day 16:24 So, what can you do? 16:29 Well, there's not a whole lot that is really good 16:36 before surgery. 16:38 Maybe we could say this... 16:39 There is a machine called the CPAP machine... that is 16:42 used quite a bit... that helps the person breathe, 16:45 puts a bit of pressure there. 16:47 There can be a little bit of help from the mouth device 16:51 that moves the jaw forward, the lower jaw is forward like that 16:56 and that tends to keep it away from the soft palate. 16:59 But, I think the biggest thing, the best thing to do of all 17:03 would be to lose weight... Absolutely. 17:07 Yes, because that helps with the opening up of the airway, 17:12 and makes it so that they can sleep better. 17:15 Thank you so much. 17:16 I think that that's all very helpful and can make it 17:21 so that we can know better how to sleep. 17:23 I'm so thankful for this information about sleeping pills 17:27 because a lot of people who are having difficulty sleeping 17:32 ...They think, "What I need is a sleeping pill and that will 17:36 solve ALL my problems. " 17:38 But that really doesn't solve problems. 17:41 Now, there are some things in foods that have been 17:45 noted to be helpful... 17:46 Some people say that when they eat a certain type of food, 17:50 they're going to sleep like a baby, 17:54 and some others say... "Well that doesn't help me, 17:57 but something else will. " 17:58 And so, some people need to have a little encouragement 18:02 with the food that they are going to eat. 18:05 And so, I am smelling the aroma of something that is 18:10 absolutely wonderful! 18:12 And this is Lidia Seda, who has something that 18:16 smells SO GOOD! 18:18 Can you tell me what this is? 18:20 Lidia Seda is a Lifestyle Counselor from Uchee Pines 18:23 and one of my long-time helpers... Lidia 18:26 Thank you Dr. Agatha. 18:28 What is here... we have tomato soup and a potato 18:33 baked potato with a sour cream and some crackers. 18:37 Now one of the key things about this... 18:40 is that this is not necessarily one meal... 18:43 Actually, this is 2 meals. 18:45 And this is what many of us should be having... 18:48 ...is a light 3rd meal and this is a great sleep-inducer... Why? 18:52 Because it will digest easily and it will not 18:57 stay in the stomach while we're sleeping. 18:59 It's very important not to have food in the stomach 19:02 while we sleep. 19:04 There have been studies that show that individuals 19:06 that do have any food in the stomach while they're sleeping 19:10 ...while the food is being digested, passing from the 19:14 stomach to the intestines, that they have a tendency of 19:17 turning... they are more restless, 19:19 so they don't have a restful sleep. 19:21 So it's very important, Dr. Agatha, to have your food 19:24 digested and to just be able to go to sleep and have a 19:28 restful, peaceful sleep. 19:30 So that when you lie down, your stomach is resting also. 19:33 Exactly! That's a good way to put it. 19:36 And, another factor we have to remember is that 19:39 it would be even better not to have a 3rd meal at all. 19:43 But you might be saying... "Well Lidia, I'm not used to 19:46 NOT having a 3rd meal. 19:48 So at least this is a way of meeting you where you may be 19:52 at this time. 19:53 But the ideal is to try not to have a 3rd meal at all... 19:57 And if you want to have even something lighter 19:59 than what we've shown you here, 20:02 you can have a fruit meal which actually digests itself 20:05 in about 2 to 3 hours... 20:07 And this way, you are assured that you will have NOTHING 20:10 in the stomach to disrupt your sleep. 20:13 Another important factor to keep in mind is that fasting 20:17 ...if you do plan NOT to have that 3rd meal, 20:19 actually helps with melatonin production. 20:22 It has been shown that individuals who do fast 20:26 ...or, let's say, not have a 3rd meal 20:28 because that's actually a fast until the morning, 20:30 that they will have a more youthful melatonin production. 20:35 It will last much longer throughout their lifetime. 20:38 They're individuals, as they enter their golden years, 20:41 who are not able to sleep as well. 20:44 So, if you're not there yet, think about that. 20:47 You want to be able to have a better and a more restful sleep 20:50 And if you already are in your golden years, 20:52 try fasting and see if that doesn't help 20:55 your melatonin production. 20:57 What do you think, Dr. Agatha? 20:58 Well, I think I'm one of those in the golden years... 21:02 And certainly it is best for me that I haven't eaten suppers 21:06 for MANY years... even before I reached the golden years, 21:10 I found I did much better on just 2 meals a day... 21:14 and that has been my long-time practice. 21:18 Now, I'm very interested in THIS dish... and in that one! 21:22 Which one is it that smells SO WONDERFUL? 21:25 Well I think it's a combination of both... at this point. 21:28 But this way, since I'm sure all of you would 21:31 also like to know how you may be able to have these meals 21:35 ...Let us show you what the ingredients are. 21:38 For the first one, which is the Supper Soup... 21:44 It's basically a tomato soup... and what you need is: 22:08 Well I can say that this nice combination of herbs and 22:14 tomato REALLY smells good! 22:16 I'm sure it would be a delightful thing and 22:18 anyone eating it... in place of a big supper 22:21 should sleep well. 22:23 Now I notice here that you have a cream on this potato... 22:27 I'd like to know how you made that? 22:29 Do you have a list of ingredients on that one? 22:32 Yes, I do, Dr. Agatha. It's very simple... 22:34 The ingredients are: 22:51 And you place them in a blender, blend them up... 22:54 and you have your sour cream for your potatoes. 22:57 Do you have to heat it together or is it ready to put on... 23:01 It's ready to go... Ready to go! 23:04 Simple enough! 23:05 That's what I like... quick and easy! 23:08 Yes, that's right. 23:09 Well thank you so much, Lidia 23:11 I really appreciate that and I know that it's 23:13 going to be a benefit. 23:14 Now, we have also a variety of things that we can do 23:20 that we might call sleep hygiene. 23:23 And I have asked Don Miller to present some things to you 23:28 that will be helpful in the way of what is good to 23:33 do and NOT to do just before you try to sleep... 23:37 Don Miller, a Lifestyle Counselor at Uchee Pines. 23:40 Thank you, Dr. Thrash 23:41 There are a number of things we can do along the lines of 23:44 sleep hygiene and the term hygiene you might think 23:48 we're talking about... make sure you have clean sheets 23:50 and, indeed, that is important that we have clean sheets, 23:52 but there are other things in our lives that we can do 23:56 or NOT do that will either give us good sleep 23:59 or interfere with the possibility of having good sleep 24:02 And the first thing is regularity. 24:03 Our sleep should be as regular as clockwork. 24:06 We should go to bed at the same time every day 24:08 and get up at the same time every day 24:10 And we don't sit there and sleep in on Sundays... 24:12 It's every day exactly the same time. 24:16 It's already been mentioned that exercise is a good thing 24:18 that we can do to make us tired at night 24:20 but it's only exercise during the day. 24:23 We should do nothing stimulating for about 2 hours 24:26 prior to going to bed... 24:28 We don't exercise. We don't read anything stimulating. 24:30 We don't do anything along these lines. 24:32 It's already been mentioned that coffee 24:35 is going to interfere with our sleep... 24:36 But tobacco and alcohol also will interfere with our sleep. 24:42 We should watch taking naps during the daytime. 24:44 I've known people who say, "I can't sleep at night" 24:47 But all day long, you see them out there sleeping... 24:49 and say, "Well, don't sleep"... He said, "Oh, I'm tired. " 24:51 Go to bed earlier. "I can't sleep at night. " 24:53 I say, "Try this one thing" 24:55 Get up tomorrow morning at 4 o'clock and take no naps. 24:58 I can pretty much guarantee you'll go to sleep. 25:00 There are other things we should do... 25:02 Make sure our rooms are cool... They're quiet... 25:05 and they're dark at night. 25:06 And I like to take along with me, some places, 25:08 little ear plugs. 25:09 The ear plug in your ear... the most disturbing sound 25:13 I know of when you're trying to sleep, is that little... 25:16 mosquito sound. 25:17 A couple of ear plugs... let them have their drink 25:19 ...they'll go off someplace else 25:21 and you'll be able to get some good sleep... 25:23 And so, rather simple, Dr. Thrash, but if we do 25:26 these simple things, I think we might get a better 25:27 night's rest... I'm sure. 25:29 You know, there is another thing, too, that one can do 25:33 but it requires a helper 25:34 and I've asked Shannon Jenkins and Melissa Thrash if they 25:38 will demonstrate this for you. 25:40 It's a simple massage thing and this is Shannon Jenkins 25:43 and this is Melissa Thrash, my granddaughter. 25:46 So Shannon, show us this nice little thing... 25:49 So Melissa, would you hop up here on our table 25:53 and let us have your back and this can be done 25:58 with the bare skin but it can also be done just 26:01 with the clothing on. 26:02 So, this is called "raking"... 26:04 What Shannon is doing is taking one hand and bringing 26:08 her hand down, then the other hand. 26:09 It's a hand-over-hand VERY slow, very light... 26:14 It doesn't have to be hard. 26:16 If the person feels that a harder rake would be relaxing, 26:21 then do it hand-over-hand, a very regular pattern 26:26 constantly raking down 200 strokes... 26:31 and so you can count those 200 strokes down the spine 26:35 in this way... rather gentle toward the end 26:39 But can be firm at first if a person really wants it firm. 26:43 Now after the person has had that, 26:45 of course it is going to be stimulating and soothing... 26:49 At first, it stimulates and then it soothes, 26:52 and relaxes the muscles beside the spine. 26:56 And with this, I can almost guarantee that you will sleep. 27:00 In fact, as I watch Shannon doing this very nice 27:04 raking massage on Melissa's back, 27:07 I could almost sleep right now. 27:10 The interesting thing about the nerves is that they 27:14 send impulses up to the brain through a little window 27:20 or gate at the base of the brain. 27:24 This sending up of impulses at that time shuts out 27:29 other impulses... things that we might feel 27:33 from other parts of the body... 27:34 perhaps a little pain here or there, 27:37 or perhaps a tingle or a tickle that we might feel. 27:41 ...And the raking tends to crowd out these other impulses, 27:48 and in this way, make it possible for us to be able to 27:51 say that our Heavenly Father 27:53 giveth His beloved sleep! |
Revised 2014-12-17