Will a God of
love finally take those
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who don't believe in Him
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and throw them into hell
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where they will
burn forever and ever?
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Is this a
biblical fact, or a myth,
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we're about to find
out on His Voice Today.
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Welcome to
another His Voice Today
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with Steve Wohlberg.
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Welcome to the hot
topic of hell part two.
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Let me just quickly
review some of the things
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we talked about in part one.
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We're discussing
what the Bible says
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and doesn't say about hell.
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And we looked at Matthew 13:40,
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where Jesus clarified
that there is real fire,
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but that it will burn
at the end of the world.
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We also looked up 2 Peter 3:7
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where Peter said the same thing
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that the atmosphere
and the earth itself
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will burn up on
the Day of Judgment
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at the end of the world.
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And we also looked at
the Book of Revelation 20,
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that describes the
thousand year period
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and in verses 11-15,
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John saw in vision
the lost being resurrected
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at the end of the millennium
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and then they are judged
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and then they are
thrown into the lake of fire
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for their punishment.
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And all of these
verses tell us that
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there is a real fire,
but it's not burning now,
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it's coming in the future
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on the Day of Judgment
and at the end of the world.
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Now, most people when
they think about hell,
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that's really
not what they think.
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They imagine or believe
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that hell is a
fiery place way down
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under the ground
somewhere down below our feet,
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where the lost
are burning right now.
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And where the lost souls
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of those that
don't believe in God,
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they go down there at
the point of death to suffer.
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Some believe that
the devil's down there,
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that his demons are down there
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and that they are
literally torturing people
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with some kind of
instruments like pitchforks.
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But the fact is
that there really is
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no verse in the New
Testament except for one
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which we'll look at in a moment
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that really teaches this or
seems to teach this concept.
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It's not in the Book of Matthew,
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it's not in the Book of Mark,
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it's not in the Book of John,
it's not in the Book of Acts,
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it's not in all
the writings of Paul,
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the Apostle Paul who
wrote most of the New Testament
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never taught anywhere
that the soul of a lost person
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who dies goes under the
ground to place of burning.
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That concept is totally foreign
to the teachings of Paul.
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It's not in the Book of Jude,
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it's not in the Book of James,
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it's not in 1 and 2 Peter,
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and it's not in
the Book of Revelation,
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and that is something to ponder.
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There is one place
however which is in Luke 16,
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which is the main
passage that people interpret
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to mean that a lost
soul goes under the ground,
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leaves his body and goes down
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at the point of death to suffer.
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So let's examine
this, it's in Luke 16,
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and it starts in verse 19.
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Jesus said, "There
was a certain rich man
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who was clothed in
purple and fine linen
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and he fared
sumptuously every day."
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Verse 20, "There was a
certain beggar named Lazarus,
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who was laid at his
gate, full of sores."
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And Jesus continues and
says eventually in verse 22,
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"That it came to pass,
that when the beggar died,
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he was carried by the
angels into Abraham's bosom.
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And the rich man also
died and he was buried."
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In verse 23, "In hell the
rich man lifted up his eyes,
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and being in torments,
he saw Abraham afar off,
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and Lazarus in his bosom.
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And he cried and
said, 'Father Abraham,
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have mercy on
me, and send Lazarus
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that he may dip the
tip of his finger in water
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and cool my tongue,
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for I am
tormented in this flame.'
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" This is the
passage that is quoted
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from the pulpits of the land,
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it's referred to in many books,
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it's talked about
by radio preachers
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and it's on television.
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This is the main verse,
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passage that is
being used to support
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the teaching of a hell
which is under the ground
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where people are
suffering right now.
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Now, I'm gonna give
you seven reasons why,
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and I think
they're good reasons.
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Now, obviously you can
take them or leave them,
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but at least think about them.
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I'm gonna give you
seven reasons why I believe
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and a lot of
other people believe
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that this section
in Luke 16 is actually
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what the Bible
refers to as a parable
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and that not every detail
was meant to be taken literally.
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Reason number one is that
it starts just like a parable.
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In Luke 16:19,
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Jesus said, there
was a certain rich man.
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Now when you
read the Book of Luke,
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when you read in
chapter 12 verse 16,
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chapter 13 verse 6,
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chapter 16 verse 1,
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chapter 19 verse 11 and 12,
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chapter 20 verse 9,
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all of these
verses clearly say that
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Jesus told parables and stories
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that often started
out with phrases like this
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there was a certain rich man.
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I'll just show you one of them
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in Luke 19:11 and 12,
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so you can actually
hear it right from the Bible.
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Luke 19:11 and 12,
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the Bible says that...
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Jesus spoke a
parable in verse 11.
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And in verse 12 he said,
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"Therefore a certain nobleman
went into a far country."
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So there it's a parable
in verse 11 and in verse 12,
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it's a certain nobleman.
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And you'll find
where Jesus told parables
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where he said a certain
rich man did this or that.
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In addition to
what we find in Luke 16,
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so that's reason number
one, it starts like a parable.
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Reason number
two, back to verse 22,
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there are things in this story
that are obviously symbolic.
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When the beggar died,
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it says that he was
carried by the angels
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into Abraham's bosom.
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Now you can't
take this literally,
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because if you
take this literally,
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that means that the
angels took this poor man
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and deposited him
into the chest of Abraham,
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they put him
into Abraham's bosom.
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Now obviously
that can't be literal
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or Abraham would
have to have a huge bosom,
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and why would this man
want to be there anyway.
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So reason number two,
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symbolic language
is used in verse 22.
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Reason number three
is that the rich man
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when he goes down to
hell, and he's suffering,
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he is described as
being not a disembodied soul,
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but he is described
as being in the body
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with eyes and a tongue.
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It says in verse 23
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that in hell he
lifted up his eyes,
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so he had eyes.
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And then in verse 24,
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he pleaded with
Abraham to send Lazarus
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to take his finger
and dip it in water
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and touch his tongue,
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because he was being
tormented in this flame,
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so he is
represented as a having eyes
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and having a tongue
down there in the fire.
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Reason number four is a person
can't literally talk in fire.
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And if you don't believe this,
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just take your finger
and put it on a hot stove
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and try to carry on
any kind of conversation,
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it's really
impossible for a person
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to carry on a
normal conversation
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while he is burning in
any kind of fire or flames.
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So that's reason number four
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why there is lot of
symbolism in this passage.
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Reason number
five is his request.
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He asked Abraham to send Lazarus
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and to take his
finger and dip it in water
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and touch his tongue
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because he was being
tormented in this fire.
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Now can you imagine if somebody
is literally being burned,
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if his whole body
is burning in fire,
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why would he request
just a little bit of water
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to touch his tongue?
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You know, if you're
really burning in fire,
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you would say
father Abraham said Lazarus
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and have him take a
bucket and put it all over me.
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Dump the water all over my body,
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because I'm being tormented.
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Now there is a reason why
Jesus pinpointed the tongue
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which I'll explain
to you in a minute.
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So that's reason number five.
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Reason number six is that
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Abraham starts
talking to the rich man
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and the rich man talks back
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and they have this conversation.
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Now can we literally
believe that people in heaven
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and people in hell can
carry on a normal conversation?
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You know, that's
just not something
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that anybody can or
hardly anybody can actually
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believe can really happen.
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Now reason number seven is
that the rest of the Bible,
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the rest of the New
Testament except for Luke 16,
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teaches that the fire
occurs at the end of the world,
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that's what Jesus
taught in Matthew 13:40,
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that's what Peter
taught in 2 Peter 3:7,
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that's what Malachi
teaches in Malachi 4:1,
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which we'll look at,
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that's what the Book
of Revelation teaches
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in Revelation 20:11-15,
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and there are many, many
other verses that say this.
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There is only one place
that teaches or appears to teach
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that people go to hell and
burn at the moment of death
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and that's the story of
the rich man and Lazarus
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and when you put
the pieces together,
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all the evidence
points to it being a parable
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and you shouldn't
build the whole doctrine,
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especially if the
doctrine is different
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from the rest of
the Bible on one story,
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it just doesn't make sense.
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Now, if it is a
parable then is it
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a meaningless parable.
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Once we say it's a
parable does that mean that
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it has no lessons for us today?
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Not at all.
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When you look at
the context in Luke 16,
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and you look at verse 14,
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here's the context 13-14,
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Jesus was talking
to a group of Pharisees
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about how you can't serve
God and money at the same time.
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You just can't do it.
00:10:07.87\00:10:09.20
And in verse 14, the Bible says,
00:10:09.24\00:10:11.54
"That the Pharisees
also, who were covetous,
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they loved money,
they heard these things,
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and they mocked Him,
00:10:15.84\00:10:17.51
they mocked Jesus
with their tongues."
00:10:17.55\00:10:20.42
And then in verse 15,
00:10:20.45\00:10:23.79
the Bible says
that, Jesus said to them,
00:10:23.82\00:10:26.89
He was talking to rich Pharisees
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who loved money,
00:10:28.39\00:10:29.72
who were mocking
him with their tongues
00:10:29.76\00:10:31.59
and who also believe
that because they are rich,
00:10:31.63\00:10:33.50
they were
definitely going to heaven
00:10:33.53\00:10:35.03
and because you know,
00:10:35.06\00:10:36.40
poor people
didn't have any money,
00:10:36.43\00:10:37.77
they would probably go in hell.
00:10:37.80\00:10:39.13
And so Jesus told
this story to them
00:10:39.17\00:10:41.77
about a certain
rich man who went down,
00:10:41.80\00:10:44.01
the poor man went up,
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he reversed what
they previously thought,
00:10:45.41\00:10:47.98
and then the rich man
who was in the fire looked up
00:10:48.01\00:10:50.48
and asked
Abraham to send Lazarus
00:10:50.51\00:10:53.42
to take his
finger and dip in a water
00:10:53.45\00:10:55.25
and touch his tongue,
00:10:55.28\00:10:56.89
because he was being
tormented in this fire.
00:10:56.92\00:10:59.09
And Jesus was
talking to the rich Pharisees
00:10:59.12\00:11:00.92
who were mocking
him with their tongues
00:11:00.96\00:11:02.79
basically trying to
give them a solemn warning
00:11:02.82\00:11:05.09
that their tongues
were going to lead them
00:11:05.13\00:11:07.30
into the fire if
they weren't careful
00:11:07.33\00:11:09.73
and didn't come
to believe in Him
00:11:09.76\00:11:11.57
and in His true teachings.
00:11:11.60\00:11:13.60
So put the pieces together
and I think the evidence,
00:11:13.64\00:11:17.17
I believe I'm certain,
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I just take my life on it
that the evidence is there
00:11:19.57\00:11:22.98
that this story is a parable
00:11:23.01\00:11:25.28
and again let's look
at the rest of the Bible,
00:11:25.31\00:11:27.28
and see what the
rest of the Bible teaches
00:11:27.32\00:11:29.12
about the hot topic of hell.
00:11:29.15\00:11:32.85
Let's look at some other verses,
00:11:32.89\00:11:34.49
let's go back to Revelation 20,
00:11:34.52\00:11:36.32
which we've
looked at in part one.
00:11:36.36\00:11:39.46
Revelation 20 again
describes the events
00:11:39.49\00:11:42.33
that occur at the
end of the millennium,
00:11:42.36\00:11:44.97
the end of the thousand years
00:11:45.00\00:11:46.37
and it tells us what
will happen to the lost,
00:11:46.40\00:11:49.00
how they will eventually
be cast into the lake of fire.
00:11:49.04\00:11:53.54
And let's look at
where the fire takes place.
00:11:53.58\00:11:56.88
In Revelation
20:7, the Bible says,
00:11:56.91\00:11:59.38
"When the
thousand years are expired,
00:11:59.41\00:12:01.45
so this is the
end of the millennium,
00:12:01.48\00:12:03.22
Satan shall be
loosed out of his prison,
00:12:03.25\00:12:05.52
he will go out to
deceive the nations
00:12:05.55\00:12:07.12
which were in the
four quarters of the earth,
00:12:07.16\00:12:09.06
Gog, and Magog to
gather them together to battle,
00:12:09.09\00:12:11.76
the number of whom is
as the sand of the sea."
00:12:11.79\00:12:13.83
This is all the lost at
the end of the millennium
00:12:13.86\00:12:16.73
who are being led by the devil
to try to fight against God.
00:12:16.77\00:12:20.80
Verse 9 says, "They went up
on the breadth of the earth..."
00:12:20.84\00:12:24.27
So they are on the
earth and we've already...
00:12:24.31\00:12:26.64
Well, we didn't read this today
00:12:26.68\00:12:28.54
but in the
precious program we did that
00:12:28.58\00:12:31.48
the end of the chapter reveals
00:12:31.51\00:12:33.08
that they've been resurrected
00:12:33.11\00:12:34.58
and it also says the
same thing in verse 5,
00:12:34.62\00:12:36.69
the rest of the
dead did not live again
00:12:36.72\00:12:38.62
until the thousand
years were finished,
00:12:38.65\00:12:40.26
so all these
people are resurrected
00:12:40.29\00:12:41.66
they are on the earth.
00:12:41.69\00:12:43.49
And verse 9 says,
"They are going up,
00:12:43.53\00:12:45.59
up on the breadth of the earth
00:12:45.63\00:12:47.30
and they surround the
camp of the saints about,
00:12:47.33\00:12:49.63
which is the New Jerusalem
called the beloved city.
00:12:49.66\00:12:52.23
And then it says that
fire came down from God
00:12:52.27\00:12:54.60
out of heaven
and devoured them."
00:12:54.64\00:12:55.97
So the question
is where are they
00:12:56.00\00:13:00.28
when the fire
comes down upon them
00:13:00.31\00:13:03.51
and they are punished?
00:13:03.55\00:13:05.01
And the answer is
they are upon the earth,
00:13:05.05\00:13:08.45
that's what verse 9 says,
00:13:08.48\00:13:09.82
they went up on the
breadth of the earth,
00:13:09.85\00:13:11.89
so they are not under the earth,
00:13:11.92\00:13:13.36
they are on the
earth when the fire falls.
00:13:13.39\00:13:15.99
Another point is that
00:13:16.02\00:13:17.36
the fire comes down
from God out of heaven,
00:13:17.39\00:13:21.86
and verse 9 says
that fire devours them.
00:13:21.90\00:13:26.27
Look up the word
devoured in dictionary
00:13:26.30\00:13:28.60
and it's pretty clear that
it's a complete destruction.
00:13:28.64\00:13:32.07
So this is the end
of the thousand years,
00:13:32.11\00:13:34.08
they're on the earth,
00:13:34.11\00:13:35.74
the fire comes down
from God out of heaven
00:13:35.78\00:13:38.11
and it devours them.
00:13:38.15\00:13:40.82
Now to be fair and I
always want to be fair,
00:13:40.85\00:13:43.79
verse 10 seems to
say something different.
00:13:43.82\00:13:46.79
Verse 10 says,
00:13:46.82\00:13:48.16
"And the devil
that deceived them
00:13:48.19\00:13:49.52
was cast into the
lake of fire and brimstone,
00:13:49.56\00:13:51.83
where the beast and
the false prophet are,
00:13:51.86\00:13:53.80
and they will be tormented
day and night forever and ever."
00:13:53.83\00:13:56.70
And here's one of
those forever and ever
00:13:56.73\00:13:58.47
text that people look up,
00:13:58.50\00:13:59.83
they look at
verse 10 they say Steve,
00:13:59.87\00:14:01.80
don't you
understand the Bible says
00:14:01.84\00:14:03.17
that the lost will
burn forever and ever,
00:14:03.20\00:14:05.87
that's what verse 10 says.
00:14:05.91\00:14:08.04
Now we really have dilemma here
00:14:08.08\00:14:11.38
that we need to explore
00:14:11.41\00:14:12.75
and try to
unpack and understand.
00:14:12.78\00:14:14.98
In verse 9
00:14:15.02\00:14:16.99
John wrote that fire came
down from God out of heaven
00:14:17.02\00:14:20.09
and devoured them.
00:14:20.12\00:14:21.92
And then verse 10
talks about them being
00:14:21.96\00:14:26.56
or at least the
beast and the false prophet
00:14:26.59\00:14:29.70
being tormented day
and night forever and ever.
00:14:29.73\00:14:32.20
So now let's move
into the consequences
00:14:32.23\00:14:38.07
and how long this fire burns.
00:14:38.11\00:14:40.08
Does it devour them
and so they're gone,
00:14:40.11\00:14:43.98
or does it burn forever and ever
00:14:44.01\00:14:47.48
and they are tormented in
this fire for ever and ever.
00:14:47.52\00:14:50.89
Which one's right?
Verse 9 or verse 10.
00:14:50.92\00:14:53.76
And there are some
pastors that believe in verse 9
00:14:53.79\00:14:55.42
and they say no,
00:14:55.46\00:14:56.79
God's gonna just devour
them and they are gonna be gone
00:14:56.83\00:14:58.29
and that's it.
00:14:58.33\00:14:59.66
And other pastors look
at verse 10 and they say no,
00:14:59.69\00:15:02.00
they're gonna be tormented
day and night forever and ever.
00:15:02.03\00:15:04.80
So a lot of people
sometimes debate the subject
00:15:04.83\00:15:07.64
which really is
what we we're doing,
00:15:07.67\00:15:09.30
we're looking at both
sides trying to figure out
00:15:09.34\00:15:11.17
which view is right.
00:15:11.21\00:15:12.87
So which view is right?
00:15:12.91\00:15:14.44
Well, let me say that I
believe in the whole Bible,
00:15:14.48\00:15:16.98
I don't believe
one verse is wrong
00:15:17.01\00:15:18.35
and one verse is right,
00:15:18.38\00:15:19.71
I believe both verses are right.
00:15:19.75\00:15:22.28
And let me, before I
give you my opinion on this
00:15:22.32\00:15:24.42
and take a close look,
00:15:24.45\00:15:25.85
let me ask you which
verse do you like better?
00:15:25.89\00:15:28.09
Which concept
do you like better?
00:15:28.12\00:15:29.66
Do you like the idea
00:15:29.69\00:15:31.03
that the lost
will eventually be gone
00:15:31.06\00:15:32.63
that they will be
devoured, burned up
00:15:32.66\00:15:34.00
and they won't suffer for ever,
00:15:34.03\00:15:35.83
or do you like the fact
00:15:35.86\00:15:37.20
that they will be
tormented forever and ever.
00:15:37.23\00:15:40.04
You know, think
about your relatives,
00:15:40.07\00:15:41.40
think about those, you
know, that don't know Jesus,
00:15:41.44\00:15:43.00
think about the
masses of humanity,
00:15:43.04\00:15:46.04
and would you rather have them
00:15:46.07\00:15:47.91
just be gone at
the end of the world,
00:15:47.94\00:15:49.64
because they didn't love God
00:15:49.68\00:15:51.01
and God just pulls the
plug on their existence
00:15:51.05\00:15:52.78
and it's over,
00:15:52.81\00:15:54.15
or would you rather have
them suffering for all eternity.
00:15:54.18\00:15:57.55
Well, I would
hope that our humanity
00:15:57.59\00:16:00.69
would say that we really would
like it to be the first option
00:16:00.72\00:16:05.99
that those who
don't believe in Jesus
00:16:06.03\00:16:07.66
that eventually God does
what only a loving God can do,
00:16:07.70\00:16:10.93
He just finally lets
the punishment fall on them
00:16:10.97\00:16:14.14
according to what they
deserve and then that's it,
00:16:14.17\00:16:17.34
it's over and they are gone.
00:16:17.37\00:16:20.11
But we really
can't base a doctrine
00:16:20.14\00:16:24.51
on what we like
better obviously, you know,
00:16:24.55\00:16:27.08
if I like the idea that
they're going to be gone,
00:16:27.12\00:16:31.32
but that's not true,
00:16:31.35\00:16:32.69
then I need to follow the
Bible not just what I like.
00:16:32.72\00:16:35.46
And on the other hand
if you like the fact that
00:16:35.49\00:16:38.26
or believe that people
are gonna burn for ever,
00:16:38.29\00:16:40.83
but that's really not
what the Bible really says
00:16:40.86\00:16:42.80
when you look
at the whole Bible,
00:16:42.83\00:16:44.90
then you need to
adjust your course
00:16:44.93\00:16:47.64
and stick with
scripture as well.
00:16:47.67\00:16:49.84
So back to the text,
00:16:49.87\00:16:52.24
how do we
interpret these verses?
00:16:52.27\00:16:54.08
Well, let me make a
very important observation
00:16:54.11\00:16:57.35
which you can
find in your own Bible
00:16:57.38\00:16:58.71
and that is in verse 9,
00:16:58.75\00:17:00.38
there is absolutely
no symbolism in the text.
00:17:00.42\00:17:02.75
Verse 9 simply says
00:17:02.78\00:17:04.12
they surrounded
the New Jerusalem,
00:17:04.15\00:17:05.75
fire came down
from God out of heaven
00:17:05.79\00:17:07.62
and devoured them, no symbolism.
00:17:07.66\00:17:09.82
Verse 10 talks about the beast
00:17:09.86\00:17:12.59
which has seven
heads and ten horns
00:17:12.63\00:17:14.66
and the false prophet
and they are tormented
00:17:14.70\00:17:16.50
day and night for ever and ever.
00:17:16.53\00:17:17.87
So bottom-line
verse 9 has no symbolism,
00:17:17.90\00:17:20.10
verse 10 clearly does.
00:17:20.14\00:17:22.14
And to me it's significant that
00:17:22.17\00:17:24.71
every passage in
the Book of Revelation
00:17:24.74\00:17:27.08
that describes torment day
and night for ever and ever,
00:17:27.11\00:17:29.94
they always have symbolism.
00:17:29.98\00:17:31.95
Couple of quick examples.
00:17:31.98\00:17:34.12
talks about the beast
00:17:34.15\00:17:37.49
and people being tormented
day and night for ever and ever,
00:17:37.52\00:17:39.95
same thing symbolism.
00:17:39.99\00:17:41.39
Revelation 19:2 and 3
talks about the harlot
00:17:41.42\00:17:45.56
and this is a woman
named mystery Babylon
00:17:45.59\00:17:47.40
described in Revelation 17.
00:17:47.43\00:17:48.86
She's riding a seven
headed ten horn beast
00:17:48.90\00:17:52.17
and it says that her
smoke goes up forever and ever,
00:17:52.20\00:17:55.10
which is
obviously again a reference
00:17:55.14\00:17:57.44
to a symbolic woman.
00:17:57.47\00:17:58.81
So my point is
that every reference
00:17:58.84\00:18:00.81
in the Book of Revelation
00:18:00.84\00:18:02.18
whether it's
chapter 20, chapter 14: 11,
00:18:02.21\00:18:05.31
or chapter 19: 2 and 3,
00:18:05.35\00:18:08.48
always tormented day
and night forever and ever
00:18:08.52\00:18:11.92
is connected to symbolism.
00:18:11.95\00:18:13.96
Now, let's take a
look at some other verses
00:18:13.99\00:18:15.49
that have no symbolism
and are very, very clear.
00:18:15.52\00:18:19.16
Malachi 4,
00:18:19.19\00:18:23.53
Malachi is the last
book of the Old Testament
00:18:23.57\00:18:25.93
and notice what Malachi
says about the end of the world.
00:18:25.97\00:18:31.01
Malachi 4 the Bible says,
00:18:31.04\00:18:33.31
"Behold, the day is coming,
00:18:33.34\00:18:36.04
that shall burn as an oven,
00:18:36.08\00:18:37.41
and all the proud,
and all that do wickedly,
00:18:37.45\00:18:39.25
they will be stubble.
00:18:39.28\00:18:40.85
And the day that is
coming will burn them up...
00:18:40.88\00:18:43.42
Saith not Steve Wohlberg
but saith the Lord of hosts
00:18:43.45\00:18:47.72
"That it shall leave
them neither root nor branch."
00:18:47.76\00:18:49.86
So God Himself says
that on the final day
00:18:49.89\00:18:52.66
those who do
wickedly will be burned up,
00:18:52.69\00:18:56.67
that's what He
says and there will be
00:18:56.70\00:18:58.23
no root left or no branch left.
00:18:58.27\00:19:01.57
Now picture a tree or a plant.
00:19:01.60\00:19:04.11
If you burn up the
root and the branches,
00:19:04.14\00:19:06.57
how much of it is left.
00:19:06.61\00:19:07.98
There's nothing
left, nothing at all.
00:19:08.01\00:19:10.08
Verse 3 says that the
wicked will become ashes
00:19:10.11\00:19:13.98
under the feet of the saints
on that day when God does this.
00:19:14.02\00:19:18.32
So here it says
there will be ashes,
00:19:18.35\00:19:19.69
not only that
00:19:19.72\00:19:21.06
but if you go to
the Book of Ezekiel 28,
00:19:21.09\00:19:24.49
it describes the devil.
00:19:24.53\00:19:26.46
Ezekiel 28 is very clear,
00:19:26.49\00:19:28.33
this is talking about
Lucifer it says in verse 15,
00:19:28.36\00:19:33.07
"That he was perfect in his ways
00:19:33.10\00:19:35.20
from the day
that he was created,
00:19:35.24\00:19:36.57
until iniquity
was found in him."
00:19:36.60\00:19:38.57
That's when
Lucifer became a devil.
00:19:38.61\00:19:40.81
Verse 17 describes his
heart being lifted up in pride
00:19:40.84\00:19:44.01
and then verses 18 and 19
00:19:44.05\00:19:45.48
describe what God is
finally going to do to Satan.
00:19:45.51\00:19:49.45
Verse 18 says that
00:19:49.48\00:19:51.32
"God will bring a forth a
fire and it will devour you
00:19:51.35\00:19:56.86
and I will bring you
to ashes upon the earth
00:19:56.89\00:20:00.46
in the side of all
those who behold you
00:20:00.50\00:20:04.40
and all those among the people
shall be astonished at you,
00:20:04.43\00:20:07.57
and you will be a terror
00:20:07.60\00:20:08.94
and never shall
you be any more."
00:20:08.97\00:20:11.57
Now think about this,
I mean look at the text.
00:20:11.61\00:20:16.18
It's very clear, God is clearly
talking about Lucifer himself.
00:20:16.21\00:20:19.25
It says the fire
is going to devour him
00:20:19.28\00:20:21.02
and he's going to become ashes
00:20:21.05\00:20:23.32
and never will he be any
more, he'll be gone forever.
00:20:23.35\00:20:26.99
And I feel like saying
and all the people said
00:20:27.02\00:20:29.72
and I would like
to hear a big amen.
00:20:29.76\00:20:32.53
One of these days the Bible says
00:20:32.56\00:20:33.96
Lucifer himself
is gonna be gone.
00:20:34.00\00:20:35.96
He's gonna be consumed by
fire and he'll become ashes
00:20:36.00\00:20:39.77
just like Malachi
says in chapter 4:1 and 3.
00:20:39.80\00:20:44.27
There are may other
verses that teach this.
00:20:44.31\00:20:46.47
Let's look at Jude
7 or actually verse 7,
00:20:46.51\00:20:50.48
there's only one
chapter in the Book of Jude.
00:20:50.51\00:20:53.11
Jude 7 describes the
suffering of the lost
00:20:53.15\00:20:59.05
at the end of the world
00:20:59.09\00:21:00.42
and parallels it
to Sodom and Gomorrah.
00:21:00.46\00:21:02.76
Jude verse 7 says,
"Even as Sodom and Gomorrah
00:21:02.79\00:21:06.26
and the cities
about them in like manner,
00:21:06.29\00:21:08.40
giving themselves
over to fornication
00:21:08.43\00:21:10.10
and going after strange flesh,
00:21:10.13\00:21:11.93
they are set
forth for an example,
00:21:11.97\00:21:14.24
suffering the
vengeance of eternal fire."
00:21:14.27\00:21:16.00
And some people say, look Steve,
00:21:16.04\00:21:18.07
it says eternal
fire and my response is,
00:21:18.11\00:21:20.48
but look closer,
00:21:20.51\00:21:21.84
the context is
Sodom and Gomorrah,
00:21:21.88\00:21:23.24
and the Bible
says Sodom and Gomorrah
00:21:23.28\00:21:24.61
were burned in
fire with eternal fire.
00:21:24.65\00:21:27.88
But there are other
verses in 2 Peter 2:6
00:21:27.92\00:21:32.15
it says that Sodom and Gomorrah
00:21:32.19\00:21:33.52
were turned into
ashes by that fire.
00:21:33.56\00:21:36.26
When the Bible says
it was eternal fire,
00:21:36.29\00:21:38.13
it doesn't mean
that it burns forever,
00:21:38.16\00:21:40.36
because Sodom and
Gomorrah aren't burning today,
00:21:40.40\00:21:42.56
but it simply means
there was a fire from God
00:21:42.60\00:21:44.83
that did an eternal job
and it burned those cities
00:21:44.87\00:21:48.10
to ashes and they are done.
00:21:48.14\00:21:50.51
And verse 7 says
that this is an example
00:21:50.54\00:21:53.21
of what is going
to happen to the lost.
00:21:53.24\00:21:56.95
Let's go back to Revelation.
00:21:56.98\00:21:59.18
In Revelation 20
00:21:59.21\00:22:01.32
we already read that
there is a final resurrection,
00:22:01.35\00:22:04.62
there is a day of judgment
00:22:04.65\00:22:06.69
and then the lost will be
thrown into the lake of fire
00:22:06.72\00:22:10.26
for their
punishment at the end of time.
00:22:10.29\00:22:13.53
Verse 15, 20:15 says,
00:22:13.56\00:22:16.70
"Whoever was not found
written in the book of life
00:22:16.73\00:22:19.30
was cast into the lake of fire."
00:22:19.33\00:22:21.17
Now the very next verse says,
00:22:21.20\00:22:23.41
"I saw a new
heaven and a new earth,
00:22:23.44\00:22:25.61
for the first heaven
00:22:25.64\00:22:26.98
and the first
earth had passed away,
00:22:27.01\00:22:28.58
and there was no more sea."
00:22:28.61\00:22:30.65
So right after
the wicked are seen
00:22:30.68\00:22:32.95
going into the lake of fire,
00:22:32.98\00:22:34.32
then there is a scene
change, there is a new heaven,
00:22:34.35\00:22:36.58
there is a new earth
and everything changes,
00:22:36.62\00:22:40.36
everything passes away.
00:22:40.39\00:22:41.72
Verse 4 says, "God shall wipe
away all tears from their eyes,
00:22:41.76\00:22:45.33
and there will be no more death,
00:22:45.36\00:22:46.90
neither sorrow, nor crying,
00:22:46.93\00:22:48.73
neither shall
there be any more pain,
00:22:48.76\00:22:50.73
for the former
things have passed away."
00:22:50.77\00:22:53.20
Verse 5 says, "He that
sat upon the throne said,
00:22:53.23\00:22:55.30
'Behold, I make all things new.'
00:22:55.34\00:22:58.37
And He said to me, 'Write:
00:22:58.41\00:22:59.74
for these words
are true and faithful."
00:22:59.77\00:23:02.74
' Now think about it.
00:23:02.78\00:23:04.15
If those who are
thrown into the lake of fire
00:23:04.18\00:23:08.55
burn forever and ever and ever,
00:23:08.58\00:23:10.82
then chapter 21 verse
4 can never come true.
00:23:10.85\00:23:13.69
There will
always be pain, sorrow,
00:23:13.72\00:23:16.49
suffering and crying
somewhere in God's universe,
00:23:16.52\00:23:19.56
but the Bible says
it's not gonna happen,
00:23:19.59\00:23:21.66
that after Satan,
00:23:21.70\00:23:23.23
the lost and his evil
angels are all consumed
00:23:23.26\00:23:26.74
and become ashes
in the lake of fire,
00:23:26.77\00:23:29.94
then there will be a
new heaven, a new earth,
00:23:29.97\00:23:32.34
and all sin will
be behind us forever,
00:23:32.37\00:23:34.58
then there will be no
more pain in God's universe,
00:23:34.61\00:23:36.91
no more suffering
in God's universe,
00:23:36.95\00:23:38.58
no more crying
in God's universe,
00:23:38.61\00:23:41.08
no more sorrow at
all, it will all be over.
00:23:41.12\00:23:44.42
And God himself
sitting on the throne said,
00:23:44.45\00:23:47.49
"Behold I make everything new."
00:23:47.52\00:23:51.33
I was once in New Jersey,
00:23:51.36\00:23:53.80
holding a Bible
seminar teaching on this topic,
00:23:53.83\00:23:57.00
and there was the
young man named Corey.
00:23:57.03\00:24:00.17
A Jewish man who was
coming to the meetings,
00:24:00.20\00:24:02.10
and he came to one of my
talks on the hot topic of hell
00:24:02.14\00:24:05.71
and I went through these verses.
00:24:05.74\00:24:07.08
I showed clearly and I
showed John 3: 6 it says,
00:24:07.11\00:24:10.38
"For God so love the world
00:24:10.41\00:24:11.75
that He gave His
only begotten Son
00:24:11.78\00:24:13.55
that whoever believes
in Him shall not perish,
00:24:13.58\00:24:16.38
perish but have
everlasting life."
00:24:16.42\00:24:18.69
And I quoted also
Romans 6:23 that says,
00:24:18.72\00:24:22.09
"The wages of sin is death,
00:24:22.12\00:24:24.13
but the gift of
God is eternal life
00:24:24.16\00:24:25.53
through Jesus Christ."
00:24:25.56\00:24:26.90
And I showed
him all these verses
00:24:26.93\00:24:28.26
that those that
don't want Jesus,
00:24:28.30\00:24:30.17
and don't want God
00:24:30.20\00:24:31.53
and don't have
their sins forgiven
00:24:31.57\00:24:32.90
that eventually
they will be gone,
00:24:32.93\00:24:35.64
they will be
punished appropriately
00:24:35.67\00:24:37.91
according to their sins,
00:24:37.94\00:24:39.41
and then they will become ashes
00:24:39.44\00:24:41.31
and then God will remake
the heavens and the earth
00:24:41.34\00:24:43.55
and everything will be
perfect in full of love
00:24:43.58\00:24:46.01
and goodness just like
in the beginning of time.
00:24:46.05\00:24:49.05
And Corey sat in the audience
and when that meeting was over,
00:24:49.08\00:24:51.85
he came up to me, and
his face was just glowing
00:24:51.89\00:24:54.89
and he grabbed my
hand, then he said,
00:24:54.92\00:24:56.26
"Steve, Steve, he said now,
00:24:56.29\00:24:59.09
now I can believe, I can
believe in a loving God."
00:24:59.13\00:25:03.97
And then he went
home and the next night
00:25:04.00\00:25:06.50
he came back to the meeting
00:25:06.53\00:25:07.87
and his face was
again glowing and he said,
00:25:07.90\00:25:09.90
"Steve, he said last
night I got on my knees
00:25:09.94\00:25:12.51
and I accepted Jesus
Christ as my personal savior.
00:25:12.54\00:25:16.28
And I opened my heart to him."
00:25:16.31\00:25:17.95
And then he said, he said,
00:25:17.98\00:25:19.31
"Steve, praise
God I'm born again.
00:25:19.35\00:25:21.55
I'm born again."
00:25:21.58\00:25:23.25
And I was so excited
at the end of that meeting
00:25:23.28\00:25:24.95
he was baptized and
his Jewish mother was there
00:25:24.99\00:25:27.52
and she said, I don't
know what's happened to Corey,
00:25:27.56\00:25:30.03
to my son, but I can
tell it's a good thing.
00:25:30.06\00:25:34.30
It's a good thing.
00:25:34.33\00:25:35.66
And the doubt and barriers
were removed from Corey's mind
00:25:35.70\00:25:38.93
once he knew the
truth about hell,
00:25:38.97\00:25:41.17
the truth about the fire,
00:25:41.20\00:25:42.54
the truth about
what God's gonna do
00:25:42.57\00:25:44.27
at the end of the world,
00:25:44.31\00:25:45.77
and how one of
these days all sin
00:25:45.81\00:25:47.38
and suffering, and sorrow
00:25:47.41\00:25:48.74
and pain will be gone forever.
00:25:48.78\00:25:50.38
And Corey became a believer
in Jesus because of that.
00:25:50.41\00:25:54.38
Dear friend, I
hope that you will
00:25:54.42\00:25:56.58
take a close look at your Bible
00:25:56.62\00:25:58.05
and discover the
truth about our loving God,
00:25:58.09\00:26:00.46
about our Heavenly
Father, about our Savior Jesus
00:26:00.49\00:26:03.32
who loved the world so
much that He gave His own life
00:26:03.36\00:26:05.99
on the cross to
save us from sin.
00:26:06.03\00:26:08.06
And those who
don't believe in Him,
00:26:08.10\00:26:09.56
who continue to reject Him
eventually they will perish,
00:26:09.60\00:26:14.27
and they'll be gone and
they won't have eternal life,
00:26:14.30\00:26:17.07
but those that
love Jesus and love God
00:26:17.11\00:26:19.01
because He's good
and loving and kind
00:26:19.04\00:26:21.21
and just and perfect,
00:26:21.24\00:26:23.91
they will live with Him forever.
00:26:23.95\00:26:25.98
The Bible says
in Revelation 20:5
00:26:26.01\00:26:29.12
that God says, "Behold,
00:26:29.15\00:26:30.69
one of these days
he will say behold,
00:26:30.72\00:26:32.49
I make all things new."
00:26:32.52\00:26:34.96
And he said to me right,
00:26:34.99\00:26:36.93
"For these words
are true and faithful."
00:26:36.96\00:26:40.70
You have just
heard His Voice Today.
00:26:40.73\00:26:44.50
We hope you've
enjoyed this timely message
00:26:44.53\00:26:46.67
from Pastor Steve Wohlberg
00:26:46.70\00:26:48.34
and we want you to know that
00:26:48.37\00:26:49.74
White Horse Media
is deeply committed
00:26:49.77\00:26:51.77
to bringing you
many more simple messages
00:26:51.81\00:26:54.48
straight from the Bible,
00:26:54.51\00:26:55.84
designed to educate the
mind, inspire the heart,
00:26:55.88\00:26:58.58
and helping our
viewers and their families
00:26:58.61\00:27:00.45
closer to God.
00:27:00.48\00:27:02.28
To learn more
about White Horse Media
00:27:02.32\00:27:04.29
or to watch more
of Pastor Steve's
00:27:04.32\00:27:05.99
television programs online
00:27:06.02\00:27:07.92
including his powerful new
series of two minute talks,
00:27:07.96\00:27:11.09
visit hisvoicetoday.com,
00:27:11.13\00:27:13.53
that's hisvoicetoday.com.
00:27:13.56\00:27:16.36
If you have any prayer requests,
00:27:16.40\00:27:17.83
you can email them to us at
prayrequests@hisvoicetoday.com.
00:27:17.87\00:27:23.00
If you would like a free copy
of Steve Wohlberg's audio CD,
00:27:23.04\00:27:26.11
Behold A White Horse,
00:27:26.14\00:27:27.81
you can call us
at 1.800.78.BIBLE.
00:27:27.84\00:27:31.15
That's 1.800.78.BIBLE.
00:27:31.18\00:27:34.68
We hope you'll join us next time
00:27:34.72\00:27:36.69
for another inspiring
His Voice Today presentation
00:27:36.72\00:27:39.49
with Steve Wohlberg.
00:27:39.52\00:27:40.92
The Bible teaches
that hell is real,
00:27:40.96\00:27:43.46
but is it burning now,
00:27:43.49\00:27:44.89
or its flames crackling
somewhere beneath our feet?
00:27:44.93\00:27:48.03
Steve Wohlberg's
pocketbook the hot topic of hell
00:27:48.06\00:27:50.97
separates biblical
truth from popular myths.
00:27:51.00\00:27:53.90
To request your free
copy, call us at 1.800.782.4253.
00:27:53.94\00:28:00.31
You may also write to us at
White Horse Media, PO Box 130,
00:28:00.34\00:28:05.21
Priest River, ID 83856
00:28:05.25\00:28:08.42
or online at
whitehorsemedia.com.
00:28:08.45\00:28:11.45