The following
program presents principles
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designed to promote
good health and is not
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intended to take the place of
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personalized professional care.
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The opinions and
ideas expressed are those
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of the speaker.
Viewers are encouraged to
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draw their own conclusions
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about the information presented.
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Hello and
welcome to Health For A
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Lifetime. I'm your
host Don Mackintosh and
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today we are gonna
be talking about an
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important and troubling
subject eating disorders
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and joining us in
the studio today to talk
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about this is
Jennifer Schwirzer. She has a
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webpage, jenniferjill.org,
and she has done a
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very important book
"Dying to Be Beautiful"
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and I highly
recommend the book and
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we are glad that
you are with us today.
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It's good to be here.
The reason I liked the
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book is the
research, the team you pull
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together and then the
fact that you are writing
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it from, you know,
perspective of a survivor.
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Some of who has been through it.
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Survivor. Many times you've got
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people that right books
about this never had the
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problem and they just
don't have that you know
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the warmth that
comes from the different
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stories. You said
there is about 10 different
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testimonies in the book
and then the information.
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I'm talking about
eating disorders. We were
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talking about
anorexia and bulimia, bulimia.
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And just a quick
definition of what those
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are. Okay,
anorexia is characterized by
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obsession with
thinness and anorexics limit the
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amount of foods so
there, it's basically
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self-starvation.
Bulimia in contrast is a binging
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and purging
disease consuming large
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quantities of foods
typically high calorie
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foods and then finding
some way of eliminating
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them through vomiting
or laxatives or exercise.
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You know, in your
book you talk about how
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we got here as a
culture. Yeah. We talked
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about the social
factors, the biological factors,
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the physiological
factor, all these different
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things. We talked
about how the culture is
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changed from being fat
is in or fats, where it's
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at, thin is in, and
how models get thinner,
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but people are in
reality getting fatter and that
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disparity. We
talked about all different
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things and by the
way you know, I'm glad
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you have the webpage
and you have a lot of
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this information
for people who want to
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review that, but in
this program you really
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wanna talk about
how to help someone that
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has an eating
disorder. Yeah, I'm assuming
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that some of the
people listening have a loved
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one or friend that
they suspect might have
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either anorexia or
bulimia and they wanna
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help that individual,
so I wanna go over some
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techniques and something σσσσσ.
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So what are some
of those techniques?
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Well, I want to start
out by saying that helping.
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Well, let's just sort
of given overview here with
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this next
graphic. We wanna, we wanna
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encompass three steps
in our helping attempts.
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One is disclosure,
then decision, and then
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connection. What I
mean by disclosure is you
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want to get the
person to admit that they are
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having this
problem or that they are
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struggling with this problem.
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Sometimes as real hard.
That's very difficult and
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in a couple of
minute I'm gonna talk about
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how to, how to make
that approach and then,
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okay, so you want them
to disclose. You want to
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say, yes, you're right.
You know, your suspicions
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are confirmed. I am
struggling and that's the
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entering point and
then you wanna bring them to
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decision to do
something about it because just
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disclosing isn't
enough. You want them to come
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to the place,
where they are like okay,
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you're right, I need
to get help because this
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is a dangerous
situation and then finally you
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want to connect them
with the people that are
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gonna be able to help
them and that involves
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you doing some
legwork. You doing some
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reading up on these
disorders, a good place
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to start is the book,
but there is very, very
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many resources out
there. There is couple of
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websites that you
can look at. There is one
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called somethingfishy.org,
oh, I don't why it's
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called that, but it
has a lot of about eating
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disorders or you can
just do a Google search
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and you need to
start reading up and start
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understanding some
of these things and then
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look into your local
area and try to find resource
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that you can connect
that person to, so that you
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have those options
right there. You want them
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to engage their own
will in seeking help because
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they are not really
gonna be helped unless they
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are involved in
the process, however,
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you want to make it
easy for them as possible.
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So disclosure.
Disclosure, decision,
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connection.
Decision, connects like that.
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Okay, so the first
part is often the hardest.
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That's the
disclosure getting them to admit
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that they really do
have a problem, so I wanna
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talk about that for a
moment here. Let's look
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at the next graphic.
Your initial approach is
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gonna weigh heavily in
terms of your success or
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failure at this.
You've got to be very careful
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with what you say to
a person with an eating
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disorder because
remember they are obsessed
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with the way that they
look. They are obsessed
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with food. This is on
their mind constantly.
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This is kind of their world.
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So, if you say "You
look so thin!" that's bad
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because they
think they are failure.
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That's right. They are
translating that "You're
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a failure!" If you
say, "It looks as though
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you're gaining weight!"
they translate it "You're
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fat!" If you say,
"Boy, you sure ate a lot"
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they translate it "Time
to purge pig!" You know,
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so there you have a
cognitive distortion
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going on and they are
gonna read into what you
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are saying. You are
gonna try to encourage them,
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they are gonna read it
wrong, so you have to be
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very careful how
you approach them.
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Oh! Well, that's
interesting. So they
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really have some
distortions and you could
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just feed into
it. You have to have a
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lot of tact and you
have to, you have to pray,
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I think it's time for
prayer when you're facing
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life or death issue like that.
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Okay, so what's the next step?
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Okay, so then you
wanna connect them with some
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helping resources in
their community or whoever.
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There are some online
resources, but I always
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think it's better to
first try to find someone,
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right, that they can
help, get help from face to
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face. Umm! Umm!
So I wanna look at
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some of the options for therapy.
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Let's look at that
behavioral therapy you
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are gonna talk about.
Okay, let's look at this
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graphic. Behavioral
therapy is one of the
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therapy sits out
there for treating eating
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disorders not
involves a technique called
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desensitization. I
wanna develop this for a
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moment here.
Desensitization is simply
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pairing deep
relaxation with imagining or
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envisioning whatever
is you afraid of and so
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often with for instance
anorexia there is a food
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phobia, you are afraid
of food, you are afraid
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to eat. So, pairing deep
relaxation with visioning
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food can often take
the edge off of that fear
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and some people might
have an issue with that
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they might think it's
too new age. I believe that
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prayer accomplishes
the same thing. When you
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have a stressful
situation and you pray
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about it, what you
doing is you are affectively
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bringing that situation,
bring yourself face to
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face with that situation
in the presence of God,
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and you. Hence
confection of the Holy
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Spirit what's right,
what's wrong, and the
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fact that it
matters, right. That's right,
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but you are also, you
are also taking a place
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for your safe, which
is in God's presence, umm!
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umm! and you are
bringing that issue into God's
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presence and so it
takes the sting out of it,
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so then you are
prepared. Have you ever had that
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experience, where
you afraid of something,
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you are anxious, you
are concerned, you pray
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about it, and you
are able to face it with
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curse, so I think the
same thing is accomplished
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with prayer as this
is accomplished with
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desensitization. Let's
go back to that graphic.
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Another.
Behavioral Modification.
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Another proponent of
behavioral therapy is
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behavioral wise just
rewarding good behavior,
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punishing bad behavior.
The point of behavioral
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therapy is
arresting behavior, which is
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important particularly
in the case of anorexia,
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where there is
malnutrition because
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the brain is physical
organ. It's not properly
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nourished and you
are not gonna be able to
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change the thought patterns.
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All we need to stop
it. So you need to arrest
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the behavior. The
problem with behavioral
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therapy is that there
is a high relapse rate
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because you don't
deal with the root problem.
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So usually
behavioral therapy needs to be
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combined with
something else and that
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cognitive therapy, so
then we have cognitive
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behavioral therapy,
which is real big right
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now, coming from
Aaron Beck and Albert Delvis
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studies, different
kinds of cognitive therapy
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they deal with both
behaviors and underlying
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thinking, so you are
arresting the behavior,
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but you are also
dealing with the root cause of
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the behavior. One of
the ways of doing this is
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something I called
"Bibliotherapy" just start
00:08:14.13\00:08:16.17
reading about it. There
are many self-help books
00:08:16.20\00:08:18.52
out there on eating
disorders not all of them
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are valuable as others,
but if you can just start
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cracking the box, so
to speaking getting out
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there and informing
yourself it can take the
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mistake out of something
there is lots of online
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resources. Now you
are saying the people that
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need to read this is
not the people so much
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suffering as those
who are trying to have.
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Both. Both, okay.
Yeah, Bibliotherapy is a type
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of cognitive therapy.
Okay. So, there is lots
00:08:37.23\00:08:39.26
online information and
then there is also talk
00:08:39.51\00:08:41.72
therapy and sometimes
in a counseling situation.
00:08:41.76\00:08:44.25
A counselor can
identify, where that
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persons thoughts
become distorted, become
00:08:46.87\00:08:49.21
catastrophes,
become negative, where they
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don't need to be and
they can help that person
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bring those thoughts
back in line with reality,
00:08:53.09\00:08:54.92
so that's
cognitive behavioral therapy.
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Is that very
affective? And it's, it's quite
00:08:57.21\00:08:59.54
affective, but I'm gonna get to
00:08:59.68\00:09:00.65
effectiveness a little
bit later down the line.
00:09:00.76\00:09:02.98
Okay. It overall it is
a fact of especially with
00:09:03.01\00:09:04.95
depression and
anxiety related disorder.
00:09:05.13\00:09:07.34
Psychodynamic.
Psychodynamic therapy
00:09:07.40\00:09:10.04
is basically
Freudian. It stems from Freudian
00:09:10.35\00:09:13.86
psychoanalysis
dwelling heavily upon the past
00:09:14.09\00:09:16.84
or this is where you
find clients recovering
00:09:17.37\00:09:20.35
memories. The
problem with psychodynamic,
00:09:20.38\00:09:23.18
the psychodynamic
approach is that overall
00:09:23.33\00:09:25.31
it is never really
been proven effective.
00:09:25.52\00:09:27.25
Freudians theories
were never really tested.
00:09:27.82\00:09:30.26
He lived at a time,
where they didn't have much
00:09:30.47\00:09:32.05
empirical testing and
there wasn't as much peer
00:09:32.56\00:09:35.59
pressure within the
psychological community,
00:09:35.89\00:09:37.99
so his theories were
never proven and this has
00:09:38.25\00:09:40.52
not been proven
effective. And then
00:09:40.59\00:09:43.29
you know one thing
you said before is that
00:09:43.32\00:09:45.43
many times people, who
are anorexics also have
00:09:45.71\00:09:48.65
in the past many
times cases of insets, yeah,
00:09:48.76\00:09:53.10
so wouldn't you
wanna go back and discover
00:09:53.61\00:09:56.70
that? Yes, I think
that there is a place for
00:09:56.93\00:09:59.49
understanding the
person. When you have a
00:09:59.69\00:10:01.30
person sitting before
you, you have a history
00:10:01.41\00:10:03.27
sitting before you and
you as a therapist need
00:10:03.35\00:10:05.87
to know something
about that history, so that
00:10:05.93\00:10:08.01
you can help them
connect the dots between what
00:10:08.04\00:10:10.47
happened and who they
are now and also so you
00:10:10.61\00:10:12.59
can build trust
with them. But dwelling
00:10:12.64\00:10:15.18
heavily, there is
a difference between
00:10:15.21\00:10:16.36
understanding the
past and it's impact on the
00:10:16.48\00:10:18.45
present and dwelling
heavily and ruminating
00:10:18.67\00:10:20.93
on the past it reaches
a point with the heavily
00:10:21.08\00:10:23.74
dwelling on the
past, where it becomes
00:10:23.82\00:10:25.29
I think self-destructive.
So, we've talked about
00:10:25.49\00:10:27.53
behavioral
cognitive psychoanalysis or
00:10:27.64\00:10:30.76
psychoanalytical
dynamic in family.
00:10:31.00\00:10:33.68
Family therapy. Okay,
we will look at the next
00:10:33.90\00:10:35.44
graphic here. It
used to be that they would
00:10:35.57\00:10:37.33
do what's called a
parentectomy for someone
00:10:37.36\00:10:39.04
with an eating disorder.
They felt they needed to
00:10:39.30\00:10:41.09
be taken out of
their family system because
00:10:41.25\00:10:42.69
often it was dynamics
within the family system
00:10:42.91\00:10:44.64
that was predisposing
a person to the eating
00:10:44.76\00:10:47.11
disorder and in
fact feeling that eating
00:10:47.26\00:10:49.35
disorder they take
him out and they move the
00:10:49.38\00:10:51.64
parents out of the
picture, but they don't
00:10:51.77\00:10:53.29
do it anymore. They
recognize that because
00:10:53.41\00:10:55.71
the person when go
back into the family system
00:10:55.83\00:10:57.59
and they relapse, so now
they deal with the entire
00:10:57.71\00:10:59.94
family system.
And sometime a family
00:11:00.45\00:11:02.74
system can support a
disorder, but it can work
00:11:02.91\00:11:05.87
in the positive as
well. The family system
00:11:06.06\00:11:08.05
can be taught to
support recovery from the
00:11:08.21\00:11:10.62
disorder. Good, yeah
family system therapy.
00:11:10.73\00:11:13.48
So you work with the
family. Often you know
00:11:13.51\00:11:14.48
when you are doing
individual counseling
00:11:14.49\00:11:15.46
then you will
eventually bring the family in.
00:11:15.49\00:11:16.84
Support groups.
Okay, support groups
00:11:17.43\00:11:19.24
are valuable for
bringing people out of isolation
00:11:19.27\00:11:22.66
one of the great, the
motivators in any given
00:11:22.85\00:11:26.67
addiction can be the
sense of isolation you
00:11:26.99\00:11:28.89
like you are the only
person with this problem
00:11:29.16\00:11:30.46
and sometimes coming
out of isolation can be a
00:11:30.60\00:11:33.23
positive move. Those
include reading groups,
00:11:33.41\00:11:35.74
talking or rap
groups, not as in rap music,
00:11:36.47\00:11:38.53
but talking, on
online chat. The caution with
00:11:38.71\00:11:42.28
support groups is
sometimes people relive
00:11:42.44\00:11:45.22
their falls, so to
speak of their temptations.
00:11:45.88\00:11:48.99
This is true of alcoholic
synonyms, they will not
00:11:49.51\00:11:51.43
allow a person in a
group, but good group
00:11:51.46\00:11:54.28
will not allow them
to recount in detail they
00:11:54.58\00:11:57.21
are drunken binges.
They can say I messed up,
00:11:57.24\00:11:59.35
but they can't go
into detail because the
00:11:59.44\00:12:01.23
experience once
called the dry drunk.
00:12:01.42\00:12:03.04
The experience
again is the second time.
00:12:03.60\00:12:05.18
So the same thing
can happen with any
00:12:05.27\00:12:06.46
addiction, so you
need to be cautious that it
00:12:06.63\00:12:08.71
doesn't become just
a way of ruminating in
00:12:08.91\00:12:11.08
your problem
that you are actually
00:12:11.11\00:12:12.23
working towards solving it.
00:12:12.50\00:12:13.50
Is there
medication? And medications have
00:12:13.80\00:12:15.87
proven, have been
helpful I should say
00:12:16.28\00:12:19.10
especially in bulimia
because of it's genetic
00:12:19.82\00:12:22.55
connection to
major affective disorder,
00:12:22.74\00:12:25.26
so that which works
on depression can also
00:12:25.65\00:12:29.12
work sometimes on
bulimia less often on
00:12:29.21\00:12:31.74
anorexia, so
that has been helpful.
00:12:31.85\00:12:34.13
Some of those
serotonin reuptake inhibitors
00:12:34.16\00:12:36.23
and all those
different Paxil and all those
00:12:36.35\00:12:38.03
different kind of
things, sometimes in the
00:12:38.27\00:12:39.88
short-term or
whatever that doctor says can
00:12:40.14\00:12:42.58
be addressing
the underlying issue.
00:12:42.78\00:12:44.84
You know, I wanna
say something at this
00:12:44.89\00:12:46.04
point and that is I
struggled with depression
00:12:46.17\00:12:47.95
and I have found it
taking a while, I did
00:12:48.95\00:12:50.35
some reading,
σσσσ and some other
00:12:50.38\00:12:52.26
things and I read
about sunlight and I decided
00:12:52.47\00:12:57.53
to start walking in
the morning and it's made
00:12:57.56\00:12:58.82
a big difference
because I think it
00:12:58.85\00:13:01.24
increases
serotonin in the system.
00:13:01.35\00:13:02.93
So these clinical
treatments that you've
00:13:03.49\00:13:05.18
mentioned, I mean if
we click through a lot
00:13:05.37\00:13:06.70
of them have they,
no one of them may be as
00:13:06.73\00:13:12.23
that helpful, but
are they helpful taken
00:13:12.26\00:13:14.10
altogether? You know,
not really. Let's look at
00:13:14.35\00:13:18.73
the next graphic here.
The clinical treatments
00:13:18.76\00:13:21.86
do not have a high success rate
00:13:21.89\00:13:23.67
unfortunately. And
that's been documented
00:13:23.92\00:13:26.46
by scientific literature.
According to the reading
00:13:26.49\00:13:28.63
I've done in the
scientific literature
00:13:28.74\00:13:30.30
there has, there is
not the magic bullet hasn't
00:13:30.56\00:13:32.79
been discovered yet.
Now you are a survivor.
00:13:32.82\00:13:34.82
You got through
it, hopefully when we
00:13:35.32\00:13:36.44
comeback we will
learn more about what is
00:13:36.54\00:13:39.04
effective That's
right. And we will look at
00:13:39.33\00:13:40.88
that. We have been
talking with Jennifer
00:13:40.91\00:13:43.28
Schwirzer. She
has written a book :
00:13:43.55\00:13:44.52
"Dying to Be
Beautiful", excellent book you
00:13:44.71\00:13:46.45
can find more
information about it on her
00:13:46.48\00:13:48.81
website at
jenniferjill.org and when
00:13:48.84\00:13:53.23
we come back we
will look at how she got
00:13:53.26\00:13:55.51
through it? Maybe you
will find things I know
00:13:55.60\00:13:57.75
you will find things
that can help you join
00:13:57.78\00:13:59.57
us when we come back.
00:13:59.60\00:14:00.57
Have you found
yourself wishing that you could
00:14:02.12\00:14:03.62
shed a few pounds,
have you been on a diet for
00:14:03.65\00:14:06.28
most of your life,
but not found anything
00:14:06.54\00:14:08.61
that will really keep
the weight off, if you
00:14:08.64\00:14:11.01
have answered yes to
any of these questions
00:14:11.04\00:14:13.05
then we have a
solution for you that works.
00:14:13.49\00:14:15.56
Dr. Hans Diehl and
Dr. Aileen Ludington have
00:14:16.42\00:14:19.24
written a marvelous
booklet called Reversing
00:14:19.42\00:14:21.73
Obesity Naturally
and we would like to send
00:14:22.18\00:14:24.08
it to you free of
charge. Here's a medically
00:14:24.11\00:14:26.94
sound approach,
successfully used by
00:14:26.97\00:14:28.88
thousands, who were
able to eat more and lose
00:14:29.01\00:14:31.53
weight permanently
without feeling guilty or
00:14:31.63\00:14:34.16
hungry through lifestyle
medicine. Dr. Diehl and
00:14:34.19\00:14:37.40
Dr. Ludington have
been featured on 3ABN
00:14:37.43\00:14:39.90
and in this booklet
they present a sensible
00:14:40.32\00:14:42.40
approach to eating
nutrition and lifestyle
00:14:42.70\00:14:44.95
changes that can
help you prevent heart
00:14:45.12\00:14:46.75
disease,
diabetes and even cancer.
00:14:46.78\00:14:48.99
Call or write today
for your free copy of
00:14:49.88\00:14:51.40
Reversing Obesity
Natural and you could be
00:14:51.54\00:14:53.93
on your way to a
healthier, happier you,
00:14:54.19\00:14:56.14
it's absolutely free of charge,
00:14:56.68\00:14:58.32
so call or write today.
00:14:58.82\00:14:59.79
Welcome back,
we've been talking with
00:15:02.44\00:15:03.99
Jennifer Schwirzer.
She has written a book
00:15:04.17\00:15:05.65
"Dying to Be
Beautiful" and it deals with
00:15:05.95\00:15:08.60
anorexia and
bulimia, very important and
00:15:08.63\00:15:11.70
troubling subject
for that percentage of
00:15:12.44\00:15:14.74
people that really get
caught within its grip.
00:15:14.93\00:15:18.09
In this section,
when we were talking with
00:15:18.58\00:15:19.75
you about what
happened to you? How you kind
00:15:19.84\00:15:21.96
a overcame this? And
you know, there is hope,
00:15:21.99\00:15:26.19
there is hope,
there is happiness at the
00:15:26.22\00:15:27.87
end of the tunnel,
right. That's right. I was
00:15:28.05\00:15:29.90
saying before that the
clinical treatments don't
00:15:29.96\00:15:32.15
have a high success
rate, but I wanna clarify
00:15:32.21\00:15:34.24
that you should try
everything available,
00:15:34.27\00:15:36.90
you should, you should
bring everything to the
00:15:37.14\00:15:38.54
table because this is
a life or death issue for
00:15:38.75\00:15:40.54
some people. And so
I'm not saying that it
00:15:40.63\00:15:42.95
never helps because
often you know the thing
00:15:43.10\00:15:45.35
that, that has a
high success rate is the
00:15:45.51\00:15:47.77
grace of God. Every
person that I talk to,
00:15:47.86\00:15:50.62
interviewed from
my book was in some
00:15:50.91\00:15:53.51
way shaper form
health by the grace of God
00:15:53.54\00:15:55.70
through their
problem, umm! and had some
00:15:55.97\00:15:58.25
kind of spiritual
testimony to give.
00:15:58.29\00:16:00.11
So sometimes God
uses, however, various
00:16:00.72\00:16:04.50
channels and
sometimes he uses therapist or
00:16:04.79\00:16:07.59
he might use a
doctor or he might use a
00:16:07.62\00:16:09.49
support group, so
we need to leave those
00:16:09.52\00:16:11.49
channels open
because his grace can move
00:16:11.63\00:16:13.44
through them as
well. Right and grace,
00:16:13.47\00:16:15.37
of course, you know
the grace of God teaches
00:16:15.54\00:16:18.76
us that denying this or
doing this or doing that.
00:16:18.79\00:16:21.59
Right. Grace has
many different things.
00:16:21.75\00:16:23.12
That's right. The
grace of God can change
00:16:23.15\00:16:25.63
distorted ideas it's
cognitively behavioral,
00:16:25.89\00:16:29.36
your thinking can
change as a result of grace.
00:16:29.39\00:16:33.15
So, lot of these
things can have elements of
00:16:33.41\00:16:34.87
grace in them, but
tell us about your story
00:16:35.00\00:16:37.57
what happened?
Yeah. How do the grace of
00:16:37.72\00:16:38.89
God take you from
being you know what
00:16:39.19\00:16:42.90
you were to what you are?
Pretty sick to being well,
00:16:42.97\00:16:45.95
it was actually the
love of an individual and
00:16:46.77\00:16:49.19
God's love working
through that individual.
00:16:49.44\00:16:51.34
I mentioned before
that my husband had dealt
00:16:51.95\00:16:54.29
with the certain
type of anorexia himself.
00:16:54.32\00:16:56.59
It was what you would
call spiritual anorexia,
00:16:56.75\00:16:58.72
as I mentioned before
there are two types one
00:16:58.88\00:17:01.00
is diet and
fashion related. The other
00:17:01.03\00:17:03.52
is related to
religious exercises. A person
00:17:03.55\00:17:06.64
trying to become
more holy versus becoming
00:17:06.81\00:17:08.87
more fashionable,
and he was involved in
00:17:08.98\00:17:10.90
some alternate
religion and he ended up
00:17:11.19\00:17:14.58
starving himself
down to a very low weight,
00:17:15.11\00:17:16.65
but survive the experience.
00:17:16.91\00:17:18.11
Was this, was this a
tenant of the religion to
00:17:18.14\00:17:19.55
to starve yourself
down? What it was, was
00:17:19.58\00:17:21.17
macrobiotic diet
and, okay, they had very
00:17:21.38\00:17:24.48
strict ideas of
what kinds of things you
00:17:24.77\00:17:26.50
couldn't, couldn't
eat and portion control,
00:17:26.78\00:17:28.18
but everybody else
was binging and he wasn't
00:17:28.52\00:17:30.81
because he was
very consciousness,
00:17:30.99\00:17:32.32
so he ended up
following the diet and almost
00:17:32.70\00:17:35.00
dying from it. So
because he had recovered,
00:17:35.17\00:17:37.71
he was living in a
community and he saw
00:17:38.39\00:17:41.30
the leader of the
community levitate off
00:17:41.75\00:17:43.26
the ground. He said,
I'm getting out of here.
00:17:43.29\00:17:44.88
So that was it for him
and he ended up renting
00:17:45.59\00:17:47.48
an apartment, σσσ
on the floor, girl that
00:17:47.51\00:17:49.40
he met him came and
she nourished him with
00:17:49.44\00:17:51.77
the chicken broth. He
came back to health and
00:17:51.93\00:17:53.64
to life anyway and he
was able to start eating
00:17:54.07\00:17:55.84
was able to start
eating again. So he had
00:17:55.87\00:17:57.04
survived that
experience and then he met me
00:17:57.20\00:17:58.90
and he could see me
struggling with some of
00:17:59.21\00:18:00.53
the same things and it
was through his love for
00:18:00.56\00:18:03.44
me. His really is
unconditional love for me
00:18:03.57\00:18:05.37
then I was able to see
Gods unconditional love
00:18:06.02\00:18:08.11
and feel secure
enough to overcome this
00:18:08.14\00:18:10.18
problem. The way it
all penned out was he and
00:18:10.42\00:18:14.82
I were actually in a
relationship, umm! umm!
00:18:14.85\00:18:17.13
And he would warn
me that I was heading
00:18:17.19\00:18:19.38
down a very
unhealthy path. He would say I
00:18:19.52\00:18:21.97
have been through
that and you need to eat
00:18:22.00\00:18:23.86
more and I would
brush it off, you know,
00:18:24.02\00:18:26.33
and as I did with
just about everyone.
00:18:26.55\00:18:28.09
And I was hovering
around 95 pounds all
00:18:28.78\00:18:31.78
the time and that
isn't like a severe anorexic.
00:18:31.81\00:18:34.15
A really severe
anorexics will continue
00:18:35.03\00:18:36.60
to lose weight and
finally die starvation,
00:18:36.69\00:18:38.39
but I was, I wanted to stay.
00:18:38.58\00:18:39.74
And you were how
tall? 5 feet 6 inches.
00:18:39.77\00:18:41.43
5 feet 6 inches. I
mean, it's okay to be
00:18:41.46\00:18:42.73
95 pounds, but if
you are 5 feet 6 inches
00:18:43.11\00:18:44.86
that's kind of
thin. That's too thin,
00:18:44.95\00:18:46.35
it's like 20 pounds
off me now, so I was too
00:18:46.42\00:18:48.59
thin, but I didn't
think I needed any body fat
00:18:48.62\00:18:51.47
or anything and I felt
like I could be that way
00:18:51.54\00:18:53.39
and I actually liked
it and that's the real
00:18:53.56\00:18:55.09
thing about
anorexia it's called an
00:18:55.12\00:18:56.90
ego-syntonic
disease, meaning it can sink
00:18:57.09\00:18:59.37
with your ego. You like it.
00:18:59.52\00:19:00.71
Yeah, you feel
better even though no one
00:19:01.25\00:19:02.61
is fighting your
game, you're kind of
00:19:02.91\00:19:04.49
You like it, you
feel self-satisfied.
00:19:05.01\00:19:06.55
Bulimia is the
opposite it's ego-dystonic,
00:19:06.74\00:19:08.82
but I was quite
contempt being 95 pounds.
00:19:09.54\00:19:11.80
I wanted to stay
there, but I got a flu and the
00:19:11.87\00:19:14.96
flu lasted for a
solid week I couldn't eat
00:19:15.21\00:19:16.91
anything, umm! And
so, I went down to 85
00:19:17.27\00:19:19.44
pounds, wow! And I
remembered being 85
00:19:19.67\00:19:22.16
pounds and getting in
the bathtub. And I just
00:19:22.32\00:19:24.73
the bones like
straight against the porcelain
00:19:24.76\00:19:26.91
of the bathtub and
it, that moment I had
00:19:26.94\00:19:29.55
epiphany that I was
sick and then I needed
00:19:29.58\00:19:33.05
to, to gain weight.
And so, began to climb
00:19:33.32\00:19:36.40
back up to a
normal weight, which was
00:19:36.55\00:19:38.10
actually very difficult
and it's hard to conceive
00:19:38.82\00:19:41.20
of that for
people. So, that was where
00:19:41.23\00:19:42.36
disclosure came and
you say may be I am,
00:19:42.61\00:19:44.64
that's right, and
then you made a decision.
00:19:44.67\00:19:47.37
I made a decision,
I was getting married.
00:19:47.72\00:19:49.73
Well, I regain the
weight to my normal 95
00:19:50.29\00:19:52.91
pounds, but then once
I got married I realized
00:19:53.11\00:19:55.60
that I needed to
gain back to a normal
00:19:55.63\00:19:57.82
weight and so because I was in
00:19:57.98\00:20:00.34
the secure relationship
this person who is gonna stick
00:20:00.37\00:20:02.87
with me through thick or
thin, I was able to overcome
00:20:02.90\00:20:05.57
lot of thought
patterns that have been
00:20:05.60\00:20:07.45
sort of an
addiction for a woman.
00:20:07.48\00:20:09.03
Now, were you a
Christian when you married your
00:20:09.06\00:20:11.68
husband Michael, yes I
was, and he was now coming into
00:20:11.71\00:20:14.54
Christianity or he was? He
was already a Christian too.
00:20:14.57\00:20:16.95
But he had been into
some kind of Eastern religion
00:20:16.98\00:20:19.04
stuff, right, and so,
you had, you came together.
00:20:19.07\00:20:22.31
Yeah. Amazingly the minute
you become a Christian all
00:20:22.34\00:20:24.39
your problems starts to
instantly go away, have you
00:20:24.42\00:20:26.98
notice that? Right.
That is amazing. Yes, it is
00:20:27.01\00:20:29.83
amazing. So, I still has
some issues I had to deal with,
00:20:29.86\00:20:32.13
but in the context to my
relationship with him I was
00:20:32.66\00:20:35.45
able to, to deal with
some of the underlying thinking
00:20:35.48\00:20:38.20
and it was difficult for
me to eat a normal amount of
00:20:38.23\00:20:40.95
food when you shrunk
your stomach down and you have
00:20:40.98\00:20:43.48
got into this mindset,
but by the grace of God I was
00:20:43.51\00:20:46.62
back up to whopping 120 you know
00:20:46.65\00:20:49.17
within a few
months of getting married.
00:20:49.20\00:20:50.82
Wow! So, since that
time have you ever had like a
00:20:50.85\00:20:53.98
relapse mentally,
cdid you ever say,
00:20:54.01\00:20:56.33
I'm going back to no food.
00:20:57.08\00:20:58.49
Not at all. I'm the type
of person that if I get really
00:20:58.52\00:21:01.94
depressed about something,
I will like have to remind
00:21:01.97\00:21:04.39
myself to eat. Some
people medicate with food on the
00:21:04.42\00:21:07.39
opposite, I'll just
like flake out and I'll stop
00:21:07.42\00:21:09.30
eating in sleeping. But
I don't want to be skinny,
00:21:09.33\00:21:13.54
I wish I could gain weight
in fact if you know of any
00:21:13.57\00:21:16.25
way that I can I would be
glad to try it because I am
00:21:16.28\00:21:19.58
one of those people, who
is chronically more active
00:21:19.61\00:21:22.80
then the number of calories
I take in, but in mentally
00:21:22.83\00:21:26.55
I'm on a totally different
page. Umm! Umm! I do not
00:21:26.58\00:21:30.09
want to be thin, I do
not want to get any thinner.
00:21:30.12\00:21:32.27
I don't obsess about
food. You are able to eat even
00:21:32.30\00:21:35.38
sometimes laugh about
what happened even though it's
00:21:35.41\00:21:37.59
not really
laughable in some ways.
00:21:37.62\00:21:40.78
I have to laugh about it. Yeah.
00:21:40.81\00:21:42.26
I mean, I used to make
all kinds of foods that
00:21:42.29\00:21:44.40
typically anorexics will
make food for other people
00:21:44.43\00:21:46.70
they won't eat it. Some
of them will wash there hands
00:21:46.73\00:21:48.58
repeatedly, so they
don't absorb calories through
00:21:48.61\00:21:50.41
their skin. I wasn't that
bad. But I make all kinds of
00:21:50.44\00:21:53.38
food for him and he would
eat it, but now I make food
00:21:53.41\00:21:56.07
for me like. I've been
making fudge, trying to
00:21:56.10\00:21:57.75
perfect this, this
fudge recipe, you know, and I,
00:21:57.78\00:22:00.39
I eat it. You have,
you actually these is kind
00:22:00.42\00:22:03.38
a ironic, but you move
from, from I guess what you just
00:22:03.41\00:22:07.67
said might make this
little different, but you move
00:22:07.70\00:22:09.53
from like not eating
food, and now you are having a
00:22:09.56\00:22:11.73
restaurant, yeah, eating
food yourself and serving it
00:22:11.76\00:22:15.58
to other people,
serving it to other people.
00:22:15.61\00:22:16.80
But like I said anorexic
will, anorexics will often
00:22:16.83\00:22:20.79
really cook a lot of food
for other people, but they
00:22:20.82\00:22:22.61
won't eat it themselves,
but yeah I had this restaurant
00:22:22.64\00:22:25.02
for three years and
developed the menu and
00:22:25.05\00:22:27.80
prioritized that the
food had to taste good, yeah,
00:22:27.83\00:22:31.06
you know. So, but I wanna,
I wanna just highlight one
00:22:31.09\00:22:34.49
individual that I
interviewed in the process
00:22:34.52\00:22:36.83
of doing research for
the book, her name was Lacey
00:22:36.86\00:22:39.49
and she went down to, she
went to down to 57 pounds.
00:22:39.52\00:22:44.05
57, how tall was she?
She is 5.4 so, she was little
00:22:44.08\00:22:46.93
short. She had moved away
from her home of origin to a
00:22:46.96\00:22:52.00
place, where she was
not able to connect socially
00:22:52.03\00:22:54.04
when she was an adolescent.
Umm! Umm! And because
00:22:54.07\00:22:56.14
she had a difficult
time connecting she was very
00:22:56.17\00:22:58.34
lonely, finally she got
in with the group of girls,
00:22:58.37\00:23:00.89
who were pathological
dieters and she said Ah!
00:23:00.92\00:23:03.71
This is the key to
acceptance is being thin.
00:23:03.74\00:23:07.40
She looked at them they
were thin, she started to
00:23:07.43\00:23:09.26
become thin and to make
a long story short she went
00:23:09.29\00:23:12.28
down over a several months
to extremely dangerous way
00:23:12.31\00:23:16.23
and finally one week nothing
seem to be helping she went
00:23:16.26\00:23:20.57
in for her weekly way and
it was found that she weighed
00:23:20.60\00:23:23.21
57 pounds. You know,
just that the family was
00:23:23.24\00:23:26.74
traumatized, the mother
and daughter were just crying
00:23:26.77\00:23:29.52
in each other arms,
they wanted to sent her to
00:23:29.55\00:23:33.23
another facility, where
she could live in, but the
00:23:33.26\00:23:37.08
mother didn't feel the
girl would survive the trip the
00:23:37.11\00:23:39.89
plane flight. So, they
made this disparate decision
00:23:39.92\00:23:42.31
and this is so interesting
to me they decided that they
00:23:42.34\00:23:45.07
would go back to where
she was healthy, so they went
00:23:45.10\00:23:47.82
back to her home town that
she had moved from when all
00:23:47.85\00:23:50.87
this began. And in route
to the town, a medical miracle
00:23:50.90\00:23:55.90
took place and they pulled
over to the side of the road
00:23:55.93\00:23:58.78
and she ordered a sandwich and
00:23:58.81\00:24:00.08
ate a full meal for
the first time in years.
00:24:00.11\00:24:02.75
Wow! Was that dangerous to eat a
00:24:02.78\00:24:04.55
big meal once in
a while, well, yeah.
00:24:04.58\00:24:06.13
I mean you can, you can overeat
00:24:06.16\00:24:07.77
you know and
you've got to gradually.
00:24:07.80\00:24:09.72
But the change in the mind
just because of the location
00:24:09.75\00:24:12.53
of going back to a
place, where she was healthy
00:24:12.56\00:24:15.76
and then once she got
there she met her family and her
00:24:15.79\00:24:18.04
friends at a restaurant
ate again. And that began her
00:24:18.07\00:24:20.85
road to recovery and to
me the thing that is, that is
00:24:20.88\00:24:23.60
made obvious in that story
is the fact that love heals
00:24:23.63\00:24:26.27
people. Is what happened
to me, you know, somebody
00:24:26.30\00:24:28.32
loved me and in the context
of that security I was able
00:24:28.35\00:24:32.09
to overcome, I was able
value myself enough to feed
00:24:32.12\00:24:35.15
myself basically and the
same thing was true of her
00:24:35.18\00:24:38.84
she, she was suddenly had
a reason to live. Well, this
00:24:38.87\00:24:42.74
book again weaves all the
stories together Dying to be
00:24:42.77\00:24:46.04
Beautiful, that's
right, and now you are living
00:24:46.07\00:24:48.71
because you are
beautiful. Well, I <24:51>.
00:24:48.74\00:24:51.12
And because you are.
What would that I mean.
00:24:51.15\00:24:52.81
What I mean is that you
see yourself as beautiful in
00:24:52.84\00:24:55.37
God's eye because you
see yourself as he sees you
00:24:55.40\00:24:58.43
and that is a
personal value. That's right.
00:24:58.46\00:25:02.17
It's not based so much on
anything in me done as it's
00:25:02.20\00:25:05.67
based on the value that
he placed on me and I think
00:25:05.70\00:25:08.43
that's a crucial point
because as soon as people
00:25:08.46\00:25:10.67
turn to themselves to
say I'm good, I'm beautiful,
00:25:10.70\00:25:13.73
high self-esteem because
I have all these qualities.
00:25:13.76\00:25:16.24
You know those things
are very fragile and often
00:25:16.57\00:25:19.05
they are based on being
better then someone else and
00:25:19.08\00:25:21.23
so it's very fragile
situation, but if you base
00:25:21.26\00:25:23.90
yourself-forth on, on
the price that Jesus paid for
00:25:23.93\00:25:26.28
you on the cross and also
on the difference that you
00:25:26.31\00:25:28.82
can make in the
world serving others and
00:25:28.85\00:25:31.38
blessing others that
is a solid foundation.
00:25:31.41\00:25:34.29
What would you say to the
person watching right now,
00:25:34.32\00:25:36.51
maybe a family member or
actually someone struggling
00:25:36.54\00:25:38.85
with anorexia or
bulimia? What would you say,
00:25:38.88\00:25:41.64
what are the steps
you would take right now
00:25:41.67\00:25:43.82
as you are watching
this program you know within
00:25:44.09\00:25:46.95
the spiritual context as
well? Well, I would first of
00:25:46.98\00:25:49.61
all get on your knees
and pray. This person has a
00:25:49.64\00:25:53.30
disorder or possibly
has a disorder that could,
00:25:53.33\00:25:56.02
could lead to you
know permanent problems are
00:25:56.05\00:25:59.15
ultimately death, serious
situation. Not only that,
00:25:59.18\00:26:03.35
but they are totally
engrossed in something
00:26:03.38\00:26:05.10
that's taking their eyes
off what's really important
00:26:05.13\00:26:07.00
that is their soul salvation
and their mission in life
00:26:07.03\00:26:10.30
and so they are consumed
with something that's taking
00:26:10.33\00:26:12.81
him off the path. So, get
on your knees and pray that
00:26:12.84\00:26:15.81
this person becomes all
that they can be in Christ and
00:26:15.84\00:26:19.20
then approach that person
once you've prayed and try
00:26:19.23\00:26:22.17
to get them to be honest
with you about their problem
00:26:22.20\00:26:24.73
if they have it. To disclose
it. Disclose, that's right.
00:26:24.76\00:26:27.06
And, but before you do any
of that actually let's back
00:26:27.09\00:26:29.74
up a minute, just do some
research, do some reading.
00:26:29.77\00:26:32.01
Go to your website
jenniferjill.org, get your
00:26:32.41\00:26:35.54
book Dying to be
Beautiful is a good start,
00:26:35.57\00:26:37.36
but there is many
other resources. Many other
00:26:37.39\00:26:38.78
resources, which I
list in the book as well.
00:26:38.81\00:26:40.78
So become informed and
then once you go to the person
00:26:40.81\00:26:44.81
if you can get them to
the place, where they are
00:26:44.84\00:26:46.57
willing to admit their
struggling then you can
00:26:46.60\00:26:48.76
connect them. Then you
can lead them to a decision to
00:26:48.79\00:26:51.49
do something and you
can give them some options,
00:26:51.52\00:26:53.38
as to how they can do
something and that's just
00:26:53.41\00:26:55.18
beginning. It maybe the
one facility doesn't help,
00:26:55.21\00:26:58.24
one counselor doesn't
help, but they can keep trying
00:26:58.27\00:27:00.49
give him a sense that
there is hope and that they can
00:27:00.83\00:27:03.52
change because it's,
it's true that they can.
00:27:03.55\00:27:06.30
Thank you so much for
spending the time Jennifer
00:27:06.33\00:27:08.99
with us and for writing
the book, I mean look, it takes
00:27:09.02\00:27:12.08
a lot of energy to
write a book. I just recently
00:27:12.11\00:27:14.47
worked on one of those
projects. I mean that's,
00:27:14.50\00:27:17.37
that's, that's a big
project. Thank you for the
00:27:17.40\00:27:19.87
research, thank you also
for pulling that team together
00:27:19.90\00:27:23.62
in the book and also
thank you for just being
00:27:23.65\00:27:26.27
completely honest
about your situation
00:27:26.30\00:27:28.70
that's really helpful.
And thank you for watching us
00:27:28.73\00:27:31.05
here today on
Health for a Lifetime.
00:27:31.08\00:27:32.68
You've heard some
excellent information.
00:27:32.71\00:27:34.86
You can again get more
information about this book
00:27:35.43\00:27:37.93
by going to Jennifer's
website. Jenniferjill.org
00:27:37.96\00:27:42.64
and the title of the
book is Dying to be Beautiful,
00:27:42.67\00:27:45.93
as all kinds of resources
on the website and in the book
00:27:45.96\00:27:48.98
and we hope that you will
find things there that would
00:27:49.01\00:27:51.83
just increase the
effectiveness of this program
00:27:51.86\00:27:54.64
information that
you have watched today.
00:27:54.67\00:27:56.79