Welcome to For Guys Only,
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a program that deals with topics
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specifically
geared for the urban man.
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I'm Pastor William Lee,
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and I'm so thankful
that you have joined us
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for another broadcast on today.
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Today we're going to talk
about the norm of hypergamy.
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What is it?
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And how do we go
against this norm?
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Stay tuned as we
go into our broadcast.
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Gentlemen, welcome once again,
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it is a pleasure to see
each one of you all again,
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as we have another
fantastic discussion
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about the norm of hypergamy.
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We have, you know,
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so much
discussion and conversation
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in our society today
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about different
norms that you know
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our society
thinks are acceptable.
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And today we want to
see what does God think
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as we go forward today.
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So, as we go forward,
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let's kind of
introduce ourselves.
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And let's get right
into our discussion by,
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I'll start with Brandon today.
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Yes, my name is Brandon dent,
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I am a retired
auto executive 27 years
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and running my
own marketing company.
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I'm also married 27 years.
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Interesting. coincidence.
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And maybe it's not interesting,
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maybe it'll play
into our subject today.
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But I have raised
two children, teenagers,
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raised two boys
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and have a
teenage daughter at home.
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And I'm happy to be here today.
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Very good.
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My name is Colin King.
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I'm the father of two teenagers.
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My daughter is
18 and my son is 17,
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and I've been
married to the same person
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for the last 21 years.
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By training, I'm a
clinical psychologist.
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But I currently work
as a neuropsychologist
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dealing with
various clinical syndromes,
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substance abuse, brain
injury, personality disorders,
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and so on and so forth.
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And I'm very, very
thrilled to be talking
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about the norm of hypergamy.
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All right.
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My name is Mutu Mwenya,
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and I'm Executive
Director for Elijah3 Ministries,
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married seven years,
seven blissful years,
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with two children,
and I'm happy to be here.
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All right.
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As always, I'm
Pastor William Lee,
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pastor in a Lake
Region Conference
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of Seventh- day Adventist,
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been married for
seven years, two children,
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and I'm excited
about the move of God
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in the days that
we live in today.
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Dr. King, would you
offer a word of prayer for us
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as we go forward today?
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Absolutely.
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Our Father and our God,
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we are so grateful
for this opportunity
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to sit here today.
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And to discuss issues
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and propose
solutions to problems to topics
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that are so
helpful to urban families,
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especially black males,
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we ask your blessings
upon our discussion today.
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In Jesus' name, amen.
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Amen.
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Let's gonna talk about this,
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this word that we've been saying
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a couple of times, hypergamy.
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What is it? What is hypergamy?
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I'm gonna look to you
Brandon to kind of break it down
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as we go forward today.
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Okay, the norm of hypergamy.
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Hypergamy,
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it comes from to two pieces
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hyper meaning up and
gammy, meaning marry.
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And it is a social norm
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that says women should marry up
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in all kinds of
aspects of the term,
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their men should be taller,
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they should be
positioned higher in society,
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you know, the
Bible says her husband,
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he's known at
the gates, you know,
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he should have higher
education and make more money.
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And so, this is an old norm.
It's been around a long time.
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And even though
there have been changes
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in the level of
education and employment
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and income of women,
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this norm is still something
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that is affecting the psyche
of society to this very day.
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Okay. All right.
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So, let's try to
break it down then,
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I think I got it now.
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So, it's really
women marrying up.
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All right, is that right?
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Men and women vary
of whether it means
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whether it's
socially, economically,
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even in statute or
height or whatever, okay.
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It means that, okay, I
got it. All right, good.
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So let's kind of
talk about, you know,
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this norm, so to speak.
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For all guys program,
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do you think that women
are so concerned with this,
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you know,
really today that they,
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they feel that they
had to find you know,
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someone or a
brother who you know,
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has this degree
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and has this social
economic stance, you know.
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Do you think women are
really thinking about you know,
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that today?
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I think so.
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And I think it's becoming
more and more of a challenge.
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And one of the
reasons why I said that
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because we've
noticed that in the 1980s,
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there was a marked
increase in enrollment
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of female college students
over male college students.
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As a matter of fact,
between 1970 and 2000,
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females enrolled in
post-secondary education
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increased by about 136%.
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And in professional
type occupation or studies
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increased by 853%.
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Meanwhile, males have lagged
behind in terms of enrollment.
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For instance, in 2004,
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was about 9.9 million
female college students,
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as opposed to 7.4
million male college students.
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Bottom line,
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more females are
becoming educated,
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more females are earning more.
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So how in the world are
they able to find a mate
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and even marry up?
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That's a problem. Okay.
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That's a huge problem.
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Yeah, and so
it's a bigger problem
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for the urban male,
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for the urban community
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wears a heavy
African-American influence
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or Afro centric influence.
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Because to be honest with you,
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even though that
is a social norm,
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it's a concept.
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But we have always struggled to,
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to live up to it,
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whether we should
be trying to or not,
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we struggle to live up to it,
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because of the unique
African-American experience
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here in this country.
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It's interesting,
that Dr. King's statistics,
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the timeframe 1970s to
about 2000, I think he said,
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I did a little bit
different research,
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and found the impact of
these improvements in education
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and job
opportunities for female.
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And it's interesting,
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they use a very
similar time frame
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1970 to 2002.
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And here's what they said.
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"The United
States understood that
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it would be good for society,
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good for economy,
good for industry,
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if we take this whole
half of the population
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and give them education
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and allow their skills
and abilities and brainpower
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to enter into
American industry."
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And I totally agree with that.
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I think, it's one of the reasons
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why this country has
excelled the way it has,
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but it has had an
interesting adverse effect
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on the institution of marriage.
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For example, the median
age over that same time frame,
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the median age of individuals
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getting married
for the first time
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increased by four years,
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the likelihood of an
individual aged 40 to 44
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not being married
doubled in that same time frame.
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Divorce rates increased,
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and the
percentage of married adults
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has fallen substantially
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from 71.7% to only 55.3%
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in that same time frame.
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So while it's been good
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for making money
and for industry,
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it seems to have
had an adverse effect
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on the institution of marriage.
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Okay, okay.
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So, as we look
at this topic then,
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should we then try
to reverse this norm?
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I mean, women are definitely,
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you know, they're searching for,
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you know, an educated guy.
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You know, I don't
think any woman you know,
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grows up and says, you know,
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just give me someone
that doesn't know anything,
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you know, whether and
I'm telling is education,
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you know, had a college degree,
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but they want you know,
a man that knows something.
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So what do we do?
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Do we just, you know, do
we keep the norm or do we,
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how do we adjust it some,
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you know, to be
able to go forward?
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Well, you know,
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a good biblical case study
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is the case of Queen Vashti.
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Okay. All right.
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Queen Vashti, if you remember,
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she was summoned to come
before the king's banquet.
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And she refused to do so,
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she did not respect
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what was going on
with that banquet.
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She refused to do so.
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One of the king's advisors
Memucan said to the king,
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"The queen has
disgraced the palace
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and you got to do
something about this."
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Now he loved Vashti.
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But now he's
starting to be concerned
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because it's almost like,
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you know that norm
was more prominent then,
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than it is now.
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So it's a greater
violation then than today.
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But what really got the king
to make a decision to banish
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his queen was when Memucan said,
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she will become
an example to women
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in houses of the kingdom,
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and these women
will begin to rise up
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against their husbands,
because the king allowed it.
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So, you've got to do
something about this.
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But interestingly,
this whole situation,
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God used this situation,
her insolence, if you will,
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to bring about his will
the opportunity for Esther.
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Now, when Esther
got into that position,
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she worked with the social norm.
00:10:47.78\00:10:51.31
But she still had impact
far outside of that norm.
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Right, she was
able to affect law,
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which no woman could ever do.
00:10:59.72\00:11:02.52
But she did not just come in
and start working all outside
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being offensive to the norms
and the customs of the day.
00:11:06.33\00:11:09.03
And it's important that
00:11:09.06\00:11:10.43
when you find
yourself in a situation,
00:11:10.47\00:11:11.97
you do need to
try and understand
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and respect the norms,
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because oftentimes,
00:11:15.17\00:11:16.57
they will open people up to you
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and give you now an opportunity
to be about God's purposes.
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Okay. All right, that's good.
00:11:22.11\00:11:23.81
I praise God for that.
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Do we, you know,
keep the norm though,
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do we, you know,
the Bible says that,
00:11:27.62\00:11:29.68
you know, we
are peculiar people.
00:11:29.72\00:11:31.05
Right.
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And God has
definitely standards or whatnot.
00:11:32.45\00:11:35.06
But, Muta, how do you see it?
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You know, do we
keep doing things
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at a certain level
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or do we have to
break the norm of things,
00:11:41.53\00:11:44.47
to be able to do
things God's way?
00:11:44.50\00:11:47.27
Obviously, we have
to do things God's way.
00:11:47.30\00:11:50.04
That's first and foremost,
00:11:50.07\00:11:53.01
in the case of what
we're speaking about,
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specifically, it's kind of hard
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because you want for
those who have a daughter,
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like you two,
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you don't want your daughter
bringing home just any guy.
00:12:04.92\00:12:09.36
But at the same time,
00:12:09.39\00:12:11.16
you want her to bring home
somebody who's going to love
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and respect her and
cherish her and treat her right.
00:12:14.20\00:12:17.37
So I think
education on the type of man
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one should look for,
00:12:21.77\00:12:25.17
in regards to his spirituality,
00:12:25.21\00:12:29.11
the way he
carries himself, as a man.
00:12:29.14\00:12:32.41
Does he take
care of his business?
00:12:32.45\00:12:36.28
Not only does he
have a college degree,
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or does he have, you know,
a home that he owns himself?
00:12:38.39\00:12:40.82
But is he somebody
00:12:40.86\00:12:42.19
who's able to really
take up responsibility
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for what's his
and do right by you?
00:12:44.03\00:12:47.36
I think that's what
we should be looking,
00:12:47.40\00:12:49.03
looking for more rather than,
00:12:49.06\00:12:53.07
"Hey, you know what?
00:12:53.10\00:12:55.50
You got to get
somebody who's got it going on."
00:12:55.54\00:12:57.77
Because otherwise
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you don't want your
kids growing up over here,
00:12:59.21\00:13:00.98
you don't want that.
00:13:01.01\00:13:02.34
And, sadly,
that's just what happens.
00:13:02.38\00:13:04.58
And it's all about education,
00:13:04.61\00:13:06.38
because my wife actually met me,
00:13:06.41\00:13:09.48
before I had a college degree
00:13:09.52\00:13:11.12
before I had a
high school diploma.
00:13:11.15\00:13:12.99
Okay.
00:13:13.02\00:13:14.36
And she had her college degree,
00:13:14.39\00:13:17.13
and she had
already started working.
00:13:17.16\00:13:18.59
And when she met me, I
was working at Office Depot.
00:13:18.63\00:13:20.70
Okay.
00:13:20.73\00:13:22.03
But at the end of the day,
00:13:22.06\00:13:23.40
she realized very quickly that
00:13:23.43\00:13:24.77
though I may not have
been at her education level,
00:13:24.80\00:13:28.60
I still was
somebody who had goals.
00:13:28.64\00:13:30.67
And she saw as
we've been together
00:13:30.71\00:13:34.14
me achieved these goals
00:13:34.18\00:13:35.51
that I wanted to
achieve in life, so.
00:13:35.54\00:13:37.45
Awesome.
00:13:37.51\00:13:38.85
It's a very, yeah, it's
a very interesting point,
00:13:38.88\00:13:41.02
because it's a
very difficult self
00:13:41.05\00:13:44.92
to a female professional,
00:13:44.95\00:13:47.72
saying to her, just find a guy,
find a guy who's responsible,
00:13:47.76\00:13:52.86
find a guy who has a job,
find a guy who is on task,
00:13:52.89\00:13:57.60
but you're so advanced,
00:13:57.63\00:14:00.54
he is not
00:14:00.57\00:14:01.90
but still relate
to him on your level,
00:14:01.94\00:14:04.21
it is a huge challenge.
00:14:04.24\00:14:05.84
And if you look at
the ratio to females,
00:14:05.87\00:14:08.41
you know, females
to males in our church,
00:14:08.44\00:14:11.95
that gap is steadily widening,
00:14:11.98\00:14:14.75
not just in
terms of pure numbers,
00:14:14.78\00:14:16.82
but in terms of
educational status,
00:14:16.89\00:14:19.35
in terms of financial ability.
00:14:19.39\00:14:22.09
So, we have a number of black,
educated, financially sound,
00:14:22.12\00:14:28.90
powerful women looking
for a boyfriend or a spouse,
00:14:28.93\00:14:32.53
and they can't find them.
00:14:32.57\00:14:34.24
It is a huge problem.
00:14:34.27\00:14:35.84
So if they can't find
them, what do they do?
00:14:35.87\00:14:38.31
Because men and women
00:14:38.34\00:14:40.64
listening to us
right now and viewing us,
00:14:40.68\00:14:42.58
and I don't want to just
be one side of what can we do?
00:14:42.61\00:14:45.55
What kind of solutions can
we make to help go forward?
00:14:45.58\00:14:49.35
Well, the first thing
00:14:49.38\00:14:51.29
and I think Muta
really plugged into it is
00:14:51.32\00:14:54.02
you want to be in God's will.
00:14:54.06\00:14:55.56
Okay.
00:14:55.59\00:14:56.93
Society has a variety of norms,
00:14:56.99\00:14:58.76
some of them, we can look at
00:14:58.79\00:15:00.63
and then know that
they're not healthy,
00:15:00.66\00:15:02.03
we wouldn't subscribe to,
00:15:02.06\00:15:03.40
we wouldn't have
them on this show
00:15:03.47\00:15:04.80
because this show is
more provocative than that.
00:15:04.83\00:15:07.64
But, I mean, it's a good model.
00:15:07.67\00:15:12.37
You know, there's
nothing inherently wrong with it
00:15:12.41\00:15:14.91
as long as it works for you.
00:15:14.94\00:15:16.78
The problem is, if you notice,
00:15:16.85\00:15:20.02
all of the real
elements are what I call Mammon,
00:15:20.05\00:15:23.25
just material earthly things.
00:15:23.28\00:15:25.85
Okay?
00:15:25.89\00:15:27.26
And what you do
00:15:27.29\00:15:28.62
and when it
starts to turn toxic,
00:15:28.66\00:15:31.23
when those things
00:15:31.26\00:15:32.63
take the foreground
in the relationship,
00:15:32.66\00:15:36.10
okay?
00:15:36.13\00:15:37.47
And because it's
a societal thing,
00:15:37.53\00:15:39.67
which what you have is
00:15:39.70\00:15:41.04
you have a woman who
gets around her girlfriends
00:15:41.07\00:15:43.57
and is not proud to talk
about what her husband does,
00:15:43.61\00:15:47.24
because all the other
wives are married to guys
00:15:47.28\00:15:51.25
who have all these
fancy titles, okay?
00:15:51.28\00:15:53.88
Or you have girlfriends
saying house husband,
00:15:53.92\00:15:56.38
are you kidding?
00:15:56.42\00:15:57.99
I wouldn't take
that, he have to go out,
00:15:58.02\00:16:00.59
it doesn't matter that
she actually is a doctor.
00:16:00.62\00:16:02.99
And if he doesn't stay at
home, and he's a handyman,
00:16:03.02\00:16:06.53
then that means
00:16:06.56\00:16:07.86
they have to live off
of a handy man's salary
00:16:07.93\00:16:10.57
while she stays at home.
00:16:10.60\00:16:12.50
And that has far
reaching financial implications
00:16:12.53\00:16:18.07
for their children, right?
00:16:18.11\00:16:19.81
So now how do you raise them?
00:16:19.84\00:16:21.18
What level of
education can they have,
00:16:21.21\00:16:22.54
and so on and so forth?
00:16:22.58\00:16:23.95
I think what you
have to find yourself is
00:16:23.98\00:16:25.35
in the will of God,
00:16:25.38\00:16:27.42
I know an
evangelist, powerful evangelist,
00:16:27.45\00:16:30.79
who had to make that adjustment
come out of corporate America,
00:16:30.82\00:16:34.29
because he
received the call from God,
00:16:34.32\00:16:36.83
he and his wife had
to work through that.
00:16:36.86\00:16:39.63
Okay.
00:16:39.66\00:16:40.96
At the time,
00:16:41.00\00:16:43.93
a lot of people
was talking about,
00:16:43.97\00:16:45.90
you know, man, that's not
a responsible thing to do,
00:16:45.93\00:16:48.27
you know, I know
she's gonna be upset,
00:16:48.30\00:16:50.67
I don't know how
this is going to work.
00:16:50.71\00:16:52.11
Well, it's been many,
many years since that decision,
00:16:52.14\00:16:54.28
and this individual
has done a powerful work,
00:16:54.31\00:16:58.25
baptized
thousands around the world.
00:16:58.28\00:17:01.62
You know, sort of like,
00:17:01.65\00:17:02.98
when a basketball
player comes down,
00:17:03.02\00:17:05.15
he's not at home court,
00:17:05.19\00:17:06.52
and he hits the three
and silences the crowd.
00:17:06.55\00:17:09.82
Well, all these years later now,
00:17:09.86\00:17:11.83
there have been so
many threes hitting,
00:17:11.86\00:17:14.40
so many threes
that have been hit
00:17:14.46\00:17:15.80
for the sake of the gospel,
00:17:15.83\00:17:17.63
that the global
crowd has been hushed,
00:17:17.67\00:17:21.14
and now has the ultimate respect
00:17:21.17\00:17:23.41
for that decision.
00:17:23.44\00:17:25.14
So the point is,
00:17:25.17\00:17:26.51
is we can't let
social norms define us.
00:17:26.54\00:17:28.38
God is not
beholden to social norms.
00:17:28.41\00:17:30.68
Okay.
00:17:30.75\00:17:32.08
And He proved that in His Word.
00:17:32.11\00:17:33.45
There's an example in the Bible,
00:17:33.48\00:17:34.82
if I could just
take a few more minutes,
00:17:34.85\00:17:37.09
where Moses is giving out land
00:17:37.12\00:17:40.06
to the different
tribes based on their leaders.
00:17:40.09\00:17:42.36
Well, women
were not to own land.
00:17:42.39\00:17:44.99
And as these two daughters
whose patriarch is deceased.
00:17:45.03\00:17:49.20
So, they are the only ones
00:17:49.23\00:17:51.40
who can step up and
ask Moses for their land.
00:17:51.43\00:17:54.94
Moses didn't know what to do.
00:17:54.97\00:17:56.44
He's like this,
women can't have land.
00:17:56.47\00:17:58.74
Right?
00:17:58.77\00:18:00.21
So he goes,
00:18:00.24\00:18:01.58
and has this long
drawn out conversation,
00:18:01.61\00:18:03.58
I could see him
enhanced and but now Lord,
00:18:03.61\00:18:06.15
you know, we got a problem here,
00:18:06.18\00:18:08.12
you know, the other tribes
00:18:08.15\00:18:09.62
are gonna have a
problem with this.
00:18:09.65\00:18:11.42
And you know, women don't,
00:18:11.45\00:18:12.82
we're not
supposed to give them land,
00:18:12.85\00:18:14.22
it goes through
this whole dissertation.
00:18:14.29\00:18:15.99
What should I do, Lord? Yeah.
00:18:16.02\00:18:18.03
The Lord says,
00:18:18.06\00:18:19.46
"Give them their land."
00:18:19.49\00:18:21.70
And so even then,
00:18:21.73\00:18:23.16
God was showing
that He does not,
00:18:23.20\00:18:26.47
He's not beholding,
00:18:26.50\00:18:27.84
He doesn't have to
subscribe to our social norms.
00:18:27.87\00:18:30.44
So our best bet is to figure out
00:18:30.51\00:18:32.84
what is the model
00:18:32.87\00:18:34.41
that God has for
our family for us,
00:18:34.44\00:18:38.01
and find ourselves in it.
00:18:38.05\00:18:39.81
Yeah, that's good.
00:18:39.85\00:18:41.18
Right here
you're saying is that,
00:18:41.22\00:18:42.55
you know, always
focusing on God's will
00:18:42.58\00:18:44.09
for our or individualize
00:18:44.12\00:18:46.05
focusing on what God is saying,
00:18:46.09\00:18:47.56
and don't worry
about so much the crowd
00:18:47.59\00:18:50.13
or what society is
always saying as well.
00:18:50.16\00:18:53.23
And I think that's significant.
00:18:53.26\00:18:54.56
Because so many times we
listen to the other voices,
00:18:54.60\00:18:58.07
you know, especially as men,
00:18:58.10\00:18:59.90
and sometimes as men,
you know, even if our,
00:18:59.93\00:19:02.37
if our wife or
girlfriend, whoever is,
00:19:02.40\00:19:05.01
is making more money than us,
00:19:05.04\00:19:06.57
you know, sometimes
we feel intimidated,
00:19:06.61\00:19:08.24
you know, we feel like,
00:19:08.28\00:19:09.61
you know, I'm
supposed to be the man,
00:19:09.64\00:19:11.28
you know, I'm supposed to
be the breadwinner or whatnot.
00:19:11.31\00:19:13.95
And it's okay, you
know, what it's, you know,
00:19:13.98\00:19:16.48
because that's God's will
00:19:16.52\00:19:18.29
for our life or
my life right now.
00:19:18.32\00:19:21.62
If I have to be if I'm at home,
00:19:21.66\00:19:23.46
we shouldn't think you know,
what the key is supposed be,
00:19:23.49\00:19:25.29
we shouldn't think
that it's a bad thing,
00:19:25.33\00:19:27.23
you know, that
you're not working,
00:19:27.30\00:19:28.76
you are working.
00:19:28.80\00:19:30.17
You're doing, you're
fulfilling your role for God
00:19:30.20\00:19:33.17
would have you to do right now
in this particular situation,
00:19:33.20\00:19:35.74
which is a blessing as well.
00:19:35.77\00:19:37.84
I think that's
good. That's good.
00:19:37.87\00:19:39.64
But it tell us a
little bit more about this,
00:19:39.67\00:19:41.51
this whole norm.
00:19:41.54\00:19:42.88
I know there's this
concept of even you know,
00:19:42.91\00:19:45.31
as mundane as may sound that
00:19:45.35\00:19:47.22
women look to marry a man
00:19:47.25\00:19:49.35
that's even taller
and statue than they are.
00:19:49.38\00:19:54.79
They're just
affected by the norm.
00:19:54.82\00:19:56.52
And this is kind of interesting
00:19:56.56\00:19:58.06
because a lot of women
00:19:58.09\00:20:00.43
don't even know
what it's called.
00:20:00.50\00:20:02.63
They haven't
heard it by its term,
00:20:02.66\00:20:04.07
they've only experienced
it through their society.
00:20:04.13\00:20:07.94
So they, they will
get around and talk.
00:20:07.97\00:20:11.41
And yeah, she married some dude.
00:20:11.44\00:20:13.27
Yeah, he's like two,
three inches shorter than her.
00:20:13.34\00:20:15.78
Now you dating some dude,
00:20:15.81\00:20:17.85
you haven't told
the girls about it,
00:20:17.88\00:20:19.28
and he's two, three
inches shorter than you.
00:20:19.31\00:20:21.75
All right, so
now all of a sudden,
00:20:21.78\00:20:23.79
just through that interaction,
00:20:23.85\00:20:25.49
you don't need
a social scientist
00:20:25.52\00:20:27.42
to come teach you about
the norm of hope of hypergamy,
00:20:27.46\00:20:30.96
you're already living it,
00:20:30.99\00:20:32.33
and you're already
starting to shrink,
00:20:32.36\00:20:34.60
possibly from the responsibility
00:20:34.63\00:20:36.46
in the direction
that God has for your life
00:20:36.50\00:20:38.67
simply because of
this so called social norm.
00:20:38.70\00:20:41.67
And it's a problem.
00:20:41.70\00:20:43.04
And I'll tell you who
does most of the shrinking,
00:20:43.07\00:20:45.87
you know, we always look at this
00:20:45.91\00:20:47.24
from the woman's perspective,
00:20:47.31\00:20:49.24
but particularly in
the black community,
00:20:49.28\00:20:51.11
where we have statistically
00:20:51.15\00:20:53.78
not been able to
fulfill that social norm.
00:20:53.85\00:20:57.75
And we have had women,
you know, black women who say,
00:20:57.79\00:21:00.86
you know what?
00:21:00.89\00:21:02.22
See that we talked
about this in earlier shows,
00:21:02.26\00:21:04.13
they have
certain emotional needs,
00:21:04.16\00:21:06.90
that they will need that
are so high and so strong
00:21:06.93\00:21:08.46
that they will say,
00:21:08.50\00:21:09.83
well, here's the
minimum set of requirements
00:21:09.86\00:21:11.20
that I have to have,
00:21:11.23\00:21:12.57
this guy has to be
above these, these things,
00:21:12.60\00:21:14.40
and if he can't make
all the money I need,
00:21:14.44\00:21:16.97
that's not in this box.
00:21:17.01\00:21:19.47
I rather have the companionship
and the love and the affection
00:21:19.51\00:21:22.68
and even spiritual guidance,
00:21:22.71\00:21:24.38
I rather have that
and they're willing,
00:21:24.41\00:21:26.38
more often than the man
00:21:26.41\00:21:27.92
is to enter into
that type of relationship,
00:21:27.95\00:21:30.65
because men have
this evil thing going on
00:21:30.69\00:21:33.76
where we want to
be a dominant force
00:21:33.82\00:21:36.12
in the relationship.
00:21:36.16\00:21:37.49
And we don't
think we can be that
00:21:37.53\00:21:38.86
if we're in this
somewhat compromised role
00:21:38.89\00:21:41.23
in the relationship.
00:21:41.26\00:21:42.60
So, we got to talk to
some of the men out there
00:21:42.63\00:21:45.77
who are finding
themselves in the situation
00:21:45.80\00:21:47.84
or have this opportunity,
00:21:47.87\00:21:49.77
who may not be
taking advantage of it,
00:21:49.80\00:21:51.97
because they're
simply influenced
00:21:52.01\00:21:53.84
by this social norm.
00:21:53.91\00:21:56.11
And they're not plugging into
00:21:56.14\00:21:57.95
what is God's
purpose for my life?
00:21:57.98\00:22:00.62
Well said,
00:22:00.65\00:22:01.98
Doc, talk to us a little bit
00:22:02.02\00:22:03.39
about the clinical side of this?
00:22:03.42\00:22:04.75
Yeah, you know,
00:22:04.79\00:22:06.12
I couldn't agree
with Brandon more.
00:22:06.15\00:22:07.72
When we run our lives
based on norms or expectations,
00:22:07.76\00:22:12.53
we sort of put on a
show, we wear masks,
00:22:12.56\00:22:16.33
and so outwardly,
00:22:16.36\00:22:18.47
you know, we're fulfilling
the requirements of society,
00:22:18.50\00:22:22.30
but inwardly
00:22:22.34\00:22:23.67
we're not
living fulfilled lives.
00:22:23.71\00:22:25.21
And Brandon is absolutely right,
00:22:25.24\00:22:27.64
what is God's will for my life?
00:22:27.68\00:22:30.11
How does He want me to function?
00:22:30.15\00:22:32.75
And it could be
00:22:32.78\00:22:34.12
that he wants me to
play a supportive role
00:22:34.18\00:22:37.45
rather than a dominant role.
00:22:37.49\00:22:39.42
You know, you can use
an analogy of basketball.
00:22:39.45\00:22:42.82
You know, I certainly
am not a basketball player.
00:22:42.86\00:22:45.59
But I do know that
00:22:45.63\00:22:46.96
most teams have a
couple of superstars.
00:22:47.00\00:22:49.23
And then there's there
are those supporting guys
00:22:49.26\00:22:52.13
who can pass the ball,
who can set the game up.
00:22:52.17\00:22:54.80
That's right.
00:22:54.84\00:22:56.17
And as males,
00:22:56.20\00:22:57.54
we don't always have to be
00:22:57.57\00:22:58.91
in a perceived dominant position
00:22:58.94\00:23:01.01
to live a satisfactory life,
00:23:01.04\00:23:02.58
and we need to remember that.
00:23:02.61\00:23:03.98
That's good. That's good.
00:23:04.05\00:23:05.38
Because lot of
times the point guard,
00:23:05.41\00:23:07.95
he runs the team,
00:23:07.98\00:23:09.32
but he may not be the superstar.
00:23:09.35\00:23:10.69
Absolutely.
00:23:10.72\00:23:12.05
But he knows
where to ditch it off,
00:23:12.09\00:23:13.46
he knows where to give the
ball to at just the right time.
00:23:13.49\00:23:16.73
Absolutely.
00:23:16.76\00:23:18.09
And he, you know,
00:23:18.13\00:23:19.46
the other person
becomes the star.
00:23:19.49\00:23:20.83
That's right.
00:23:20.86\00:23:22.16
But they work
together. That's right.
00:23:22.20\00:23:23.53
That's why we
say working together.
00:23:23.57\00:23:24.90
How does this, you know,
play itself out in the church?
00:23:24.93\00:23:26.50
Because I see, I see this being,
00:23:26.53\00:23:28.47
you know, very practical,
00:23:28.50\00:23:30.01
but I'll see it
could be challenging,
00:23:30.07\00:23:31.87
especially as
relates to the church,
00:23:31.91\00:23:35.31
and this whole this whole norm,
00:23:35.34\00:23:38.38
especially those
who have education,
00:23:38.41\00:23:40.48
and then the guy
feels is you know what,
00:23:40.52\00:23:42.12
I don't want to come around,
00:23:42.15\00:23:43.49
you know, you know,
00:23:43.55\00:23:44.89
others because
I'm not, you know,
00:23:44.92\00:23:46.32
I don't have
everything everybody else has.
00:23:46.35\00:23:48.56
And that may be another
reason, because we started off,
00:23:48.59\00:23:50.79
you know, previous episodes
00:23:50.83\00:23:52.59
talking about mid run,
00:23:52.63\00:23:54.13
you know, Adam
sometimes destined or whatnot.
00:23:54.20\00:23:56.60
I'm seeing, you know,
00:23:56.63\00:23:57.97
the norm of
hypergamy being, you know,
00:23:58.00\00:24:01.50
in relationship to
why sometimes men may run,
00:24:01.54\00:24:05.61
you know, maybe
00:24:05.64\00:24:06.98
could we discussed
that a little bit as well
00:24:07.01\00:24:08.84
as figure out how that
relates to church and Adam?
00:24:08.88\00:24:11.98
Sure.
00:24:12.01\00:24:13.35
You know, I believe that
God runs a beauty parlor.
00:24:13.42\00:24:17.32
So... Say it.
00:24:17.39\00:24:19.19
I'll run to barber
shop, beauty parlor.
00:24:19.22\00:24:22.66
So, if that is the case,
00:24:22.69\00:24:24.69
whereby the guy is married
to someone who's smarter,
00:24:24.73\00:24:29.20
better, taller,
whatever than him.
00:24:29.23\00:24:33.07
So there could be
that feeling that,
00:24:33.10\00:24:34.64
you know, I can't
come into the church
00:24:34.67\00:24:36.54
because I'm going to,
I'm going to seem less than.
00:24:36.57\00:24:40.08
When you come to
the Church of God,
00:24:40.14\00:24:42.14
God makes you a better person.
00:24:42.18\00:24:44.21
You know, He
gives you a haircut.
00:24:44.25\00:24:46.78
He motivates you.
00:24:46.82\00:24:48.32
He opens and He
widens your horizon.
00:24:48.35\00:24:50.75
So yeah, you know,
00:24:50.79\00:24:52.12
you may have a
high school diploma,
00:24:52.15\00:24:54.59
and that's okay.
00:24:54.62\00:24:56.02
When you come to the church
and you stay with the church,
00:24:56.06\00:24:58.16
God makes you a better person.
00:24:58.19\00:24:59.73
He runs a beauty parlor.
00:24:59.76\00:25:01.13
Yeah, I like that, I'm
gonna use that as well.
00:25:01.16\00:25:03.06
That's all right.
00:25:03.10\00:25:04.90
You can't lose. Absolutely.
00:25:04.93\00:25:07.34
So don't be fazed by the norm.
00:25:07.37\00:25:10.11
Look what the Bible says,
00:25:10.14\00:25:11.47
what Bible says that
00:25:11.51\00:25:12.84
man looks on the
outward appearance.
00:25:12.87\00:25:14.88
You know, that's what
this whole discussion is about.
00:25:14.91\00:25:16.31
Everybody's like
look on the outside
00:25:16.34\00:25:17.68
trying to judge
you from the outside.
00:25:17.71\00:25:19.75
But God, Bible says
that God looks in the heart,
00:25:19.78\00:25:21.65
and God knows
exactly what's going on,
00:25:21.68\00:25:24.19
on the inside
whether good or bad.
00:25:24.22\00:25:26.12
And I appreciate
that about God as well.
00:25:26.15\00:25:30.43
Help us understand a
little bit more about
00:25:30.46\00:25:32.03
some of the other
social implications
00:25:32.06\00:25:33.43
of this whole norm.
00:25:33.50\00:25:35.00
And, you know, we'll
have about, you know,
00:25:35.03\00:25:36.93
two and a half minutes
left in this broadcast,
00:25:36.97\00:25:39.50
help us understand God's will,
00:25:39.53\00:25:41.37
help us understand
the steps we need to take
00:25:41.40\00:25:43.77
so that we don't fall, you know,
00:25:43.81\00:25:46.17
pray to what's been happening,
00:25:46.21\00:25:48.08
you know, through
our society for so long.
00:25:48.11\00:25:51.48
Well, you know, socially,
00:25:51.51\00:25:55.85
and we talked about
it a little bit earlier,
00:25:55.88\00:25:58.25
I think the real problem
is that men who God has called
00:25:58.29\00:26:03.86
to do a level of
ministry that perhaps,
00:26:03.89\00:26:10.37
you know, I will
say only men can do
00:26:10.40\00:26:12.13
but God told
called men first to do.
00:26:12.17\00:26:15.67
And we will often find ourselves
00:26:15.70\00:26:18.87
not subscribing to that,
00:26:18.91\00:26:21.14
because we are caught
up emotionally in something
00:26:21.18\00:26:25.48
that is really nothing at all.
00:26:25.51\00:26:27.42
I was just listening to
a preacher preach a sermon,
00:26:27.45\00:26:30.59
majoring in minors,
00:26:30.62\00:26:32.32
majoring the norm of
hypergamy is really a minor.
00:26:32.35\00:26:37.06
And when a man subscribes to God
00:26:37.13\00:26:40.96
in His purpose for his life,
00:26:40.96\00:26:43.16
it's just like,
00:26:43.20\00:26:44.53
"seek ye first
the kingdom of heaven,
00:26:44.57\00:26:46.60
and all these other
things that I'll add unto you."
00:26:46.63\00:26:49.04
And that's your relationship.
00:26:49.07\00:26:50.57
That's the right woman,
00:26:50.61\00:26:52.84
family dynamics,
wealth, you name it.
00:26:52.87\00:26:56.54
And it really comes
when you let the social norm
00:26:56.58\00:27:01.02
pull you away from
00:27:01.05\00:27:02.58
what you know to be
God's order for your life,
00:27:02.62\00:27:04.82
and that's idolatry.
00:27:04.85\00:27:06.62
And idolatry in the
Bible, last time I checked,
00:27:06.65\00:27:09.36
was never rewarded by God.
00:27:09.39\00:27:10.76
As a matter of fact,
00:27:10.79\00:27:12.13
it was punished
quite vehemently.
00:27:12.16\00:27:13.96
That's good. Absolutely.
00:27:14.00\00:27:16.06
Let me read this text
00:27:16.10\00:27:17.57
as we come to the
close with Bible says
00:27:17.60\00:27:19.80
in 1 Peter 2:9,
00:27:19.83\00:27:23.81
the Bible says,
00:27:23.84\00:27:25.17
"But you are a
chosen generation,
00:27:25.21\00:27:28.04
a royal
priesthood, a holy nation,
00:27:28.08\00:27:30.88
a peculiar people,
00:27:30.95\00:27:32.45
that you should show
forth the praises of Him
00:27:32.48\00:27:35.15
who's called
you out of darkness,
00:27:35.18\00:27:38.22
into His marvelous light."
00:27:38.25\00:27:41.39
And I think so
many times even with,
00:27:41.42\00:27:42.82
you know, this norm of you know,
00:27:42.86\00:27:44.26
women think they had to marry up
00:27:44.33\00:27:45.66
and men thinking they have
this certain role or whatnot,
00:27:45.69\00:27:48.26
then we got to be so comfortable
00:27:48.30\00:27:49.63
in who we are,
00:27:49.66\00:27:51.00
as we said before in
God, that I am peculiar.
00:27:51.03\00:27:54.10
that my family is peculiar,
00:27:54.14\00:27:56.00
that we don't have to
operate in some linear box
00:27:56.04\00:27:59.64
that man has set up with that
00:27:59.67\00:28:02.14
even when man looks at us
00:28:02.18\00:28:03.81
that we still
can, you know what,
00:28:03.88\00:28:05.71
regardless of
what you may think,
00:28:05.75\00:28:07.85
I know that I'm
following the will of God,
00:28:07.88\00:28:10.92
and God's will is
always the perfect will.
00:28:10.95\00:28:14.19
So I challenge
my brothers today,
00:28:14.22\00:28:16.79
that are
battling with this topic,
00:28:16.86\00:28:20.63
say the norm of hypergamy,
00:28:20.66\00:28:21.96
even though women that
that may be join us well,
00:28:22.00\00:28:24.10
to seek the will of God
00:28:24.17\00:28:26.50
not to seek the will of man,
00:28:26.53\00:28:28.30
but to know that God before us,
00:28:28.34\00:28:30.44
no one else can be against us.
00:28:30.51\00:28:32.57
Until next time,
I'm Pastor William Lee,
00:28:32.61\00:28:34.68
I look forward to
you joining us again?
00:28:34.71\00:28:37.35