Hello again, my
name is Jay Rosario.
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I'm the host for
the Engage Program,
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which is a series dedicated
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to address some challenging
issues facing young adults
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in the Christian
world all over the globe,
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joining us is my good
friend, Daniel McGrath.
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Dan, how's it
going? Very good, Jay.
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So Dan, what are we
gonna talking about today?
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Yeah, today we're gonna be
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looking at the
topic of leadership
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and this is
something that we all realize
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there's a lack of
good leadership around us.
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And we're praying
for more Godly leaders
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but today, we
have a special guest,
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somebody who I
believe the Lord has put
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in a good
responsible leadership position.
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His name is Valmy Karamera.
He's a good friend of ours.
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Valmy, come on out here.
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We're happy you
could join us today.
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Hello. Welcome.
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So Valmy, we are--
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I've actually had
the privilege of working
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together with Valmy in
leadership team in Canada.
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Valmy, I know
you, Dan knows you,
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but for those
that may not know you,
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maybe you could
talk a little bit about
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maybe where you from?
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What you're currently doing?
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And why you think leadership
is such an important subject
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that it would take an entire,
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one of our sessions to
address it and to talk about?
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Sure, my name is Valmy Karamera
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and I'm originally from Rwanda.
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Currently, I'm a a
student at Andrews University
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studying in the seminary.
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So Valmy tell us
just a little bit about
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the movements you've
been involved with that
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you've helped to
lead up till now.
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Well, when I became
Adventist about six years ago,
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I was very
inspired with the message
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God has given our church
and being a young person,
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I wanted young people to
know also about this message,
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my friends, my classmate
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and also having
attended our secular university.
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There are not so many Adventists
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on secular university.
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And so I was able to network
with young people at the time
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I was in Canada and
we started something
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called ECYC, (Eastern
Canada Youth Conference)
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for young people that is now
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reaching the entire
eastern part of Canada
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and also in the
west part of Canada,
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I had the privilege
of working with Jay.
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We worked with
the Acts for Christ,
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but also because my
roots are come from Africa.
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And we started that something
also called A.L.I.V.E.,
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which stands for African
Living In View of Eternity.
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And it's actually
spreading across the continent
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and changing the face of Africa.
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Wow! So you've been
the President of ECYC.
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You've been the
President of A.L.I.V.E.
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You've worked
with Acts for Christ
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in different positions.
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This leadership is
something that in only six years
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it's clear that God has put you
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in this
position to do something,
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but for our audience today.
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What is the difference between
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a worldly leader
and Biblical leader?
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What does--what does
the Bible say about that?
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I think it's very essential
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to address the
topic of leadership
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because everything
rises or falls on leadership.
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And there is-- we
must distinguish between
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a Biblical leadership
and secular leadership.
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And I think when I think
of a Biblical leadership,
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I think of a
text in First Peter.
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Maybe we can go
there. I Peter Chapter 5.
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I Peter Chapter 5
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and he says, "The
elders which are among you."
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You're reading from Verse
1. Verse 1, Chapter 5 Verse 1.
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It says, "The elders
which are among you I exhort,
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who I'm also an elder,"
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And that word elder can
substitute for a leader.
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And a witness of
the suffering of Christ
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and also a partaker of the glory
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that shall be revealed.
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Now, look up
verse 2, verse 2 says,
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"Feed the flock of
God which is among you."
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And some version use the
word feed, they use shepherd.
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And so, we find that
one key characteristic
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of a leader is a shepherd.
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And so, I think if they're--
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you'd start to see
the distinction between
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Biblical leadership and
also secular leadership.
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In a sense that
Biblical leadership
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we are to
shepherd the flock of God
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to lead the people of God.
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And so I think
leadership is defined by
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what you do and who you lead.
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And in this case,
Biblical leadership
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is leading the people of God,
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which is awesome responsibility
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leading the people of God.
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It's very humbling.
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So in that corporate
world, leadership would be,
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you know, how to make
money for your company?
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How to put those
processes in the place?
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But you're saying
leadership is actually caring
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for the flock of
God whether it's,
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you know, an
independent ministries
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like
A.L.I.V.E., or those things.
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Your ultimate goal is
for the salvation of souls.
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Absolutely, it's for
the salvation of souls
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and caring for the people
that God has interested you to
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because it is not my
company that I am leading
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or someone else's company.
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These are the people of God.
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And so, that makes a
clear difference here
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that it is a
spiritual responsibility.
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It is not any
other responsibility
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but rather a
spiritual responsibility.
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Now, Valmy, I
think this is brilliant
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what we're addressing at DNA,
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and I can
definitely see the needs
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in many different aspects.
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Well, Valmy, what about
the individual who says,
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"You know, I'm
not really a leader."
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Actually when I consider myself,
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I don't consider myself
by nature someone who leads.
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My older brother on
the other hand is a leader,
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I mean, every ounce of
his body is leadership.
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So what about
us who--those of us
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who feel like I'm
not naturally a leader,
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I don't have
his big corporation,
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I'm not a fancy preacher,
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I don't chair
board meeting et cetera.
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Are they leaders still or
is it only for a select few?
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What are your thoughts on that?
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You know, again it
depends on the context
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in which you working in.
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For example, I believe
some of the greatest leaders
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we have, are mothers.
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They have a
chance of molding kids,
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molding their
children to become a great man
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and woman of the world.
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If you look at them you
will not think they are leaders,
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but the context in which
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they're working
in, they're leaders.
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I think of the young
lady in Neiman's court
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who directed Neiman to go
to Israel to see the prophet.
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Was she a leader in that
case? Yes, she was a leader.
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She was able to
direct this great general
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to go to Israel
and receive healing.
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So it's in the context
that you're working in,
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for example in this show,
Jay, you're acting as a leader
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as the principal
leader in this case.
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So it's the context in
which a person is working in
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and especially as Christians,
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God has this mandate to
take the gospel to entire world.
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Christ didn't
say that a select few
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will take this
gospel to entire world.
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Christ said, "All of us."
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So all of us are
given the responsibility
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to lead someone to Christ.
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So in that case, are we leading?
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Yes, we're leading.
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So, we are all
leaders across the level.
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It's just the context
in which we're leading.
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All right, well,
you know, the Lord has--
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has used your
ministry, your leadership
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to influence thousands
of people around the world.
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That's evident. But
what about people that,
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you know, are
sitting at home thinking,
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you know, I am really a leader?
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How do I know that?
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Are there any
principles that you can give us
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from your
experience and from the Bible
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that'd help people to
know what a leader really is?
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I think today they are
tons of writing on leaderships
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and if I can
narrow-- most of at least
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what I've read,
what I've experienced,
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if I can narrow them
down in only three core values
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or three core principles.
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I would say that
number one is the call of God,
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knowing the call, your calling,
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you know, in what
area God has called you to
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and I would
explain more about this.
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And number two it
will be the vision
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that God gives you the
vision and then number three,
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it would be the
character of a leader,
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so those three things.
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And so coming to
back to number one,
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it will be the call of a leader.
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How do I know God has called me?
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How do you know
God has called you.
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And it reminds me of--
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in the book
Patriarchs and Prophets,
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when Ellen White talks about
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the call of Abraham on page 126,
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she says that, "God calls us"
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She alludes to
the ways God calls us.
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A three ways, one being
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that we may hear a
clear voice of God.
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So number one, a clear
voice of God and so number two,
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by His word through His word.
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And even the call
of God if it's audible
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it has to be
affirmed by the word of God,
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you know,
because someone may say,
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"God is calling me to do this."
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But how do we know that
this calling is Biblical?
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So we have to examine it
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based on the word of God.
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So the call from
God and the word of God
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and then circumstances
which she calls evidence,
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events of His providence--
events of His providence.
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So circumstances
happening in your life
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and you know that
God has called you.
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In the Bible we
have so many examples
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that all fit in these
three types of calling.
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For example, we think
of, let's say Abraham.
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He heard a clear voice
from God, God calling him.
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We think of Moses which combined
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both an audible voice
but also circumstances.
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It was because he
killed this Egyptian man
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that he fled for 40 years
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and because of the circumstance,
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he ended up
receiving that call from God.
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Then we think about
people like Nehemiah.
00:10:02.64\00:10:04.82
Nehemiah didn't
hear a voice from God.
00:10:04.83\00:10:06.93
It was circumstances.
00:10:06.94\00:10:08.50
So we see those
calls-- this different calling
00:10:08.51\00:10:11.30
acting out in people's life.
00:10:11.31\00:10:13.26
The second principle
00:10:13.27\00:10:14.75
which I mentioned
is the vision of God.
00:10:14.76\00:10:17.33
And let's turn to
Proverbs 29, verse 18.
00:10:17.34\00:10:22.03
Proverbs 29, verse 18.
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Jay, you can
read it for us? Yes.
00:10:27.32\00:10:29.01
Proverbs 29 Verse 18? Yes.
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Proverbs 29:18 says,
00:10:31.92\00:10:33.34
"Where there is no
vision, the people perish." Yes.
00:10:33.35\00:10:37.19
Where there is no
vision, the people perish.
00:10:37.20\00:10:40.17
In fact the actual
word for the vision there
00:10:40.18\00:10:42.88
is the word revelation.
00:10:42.89\00:10:44.91
Where there is no revelation
00:10:44.92\00:10:47.27
and it has to be a revelation
of God, people perish.
00:10:47.28\00:10:51.06
So today when you examine
the landscape of leadership,
00:10:51.07\00:10:56.39
you hear people
say, "What's your vision?
00:10:56.40\00:10:59.20
What's your
vision for this ministry?
00:10:59.21\00:11:01.23
What's your
vision for your life?"
00:11:01.24\00:11:03.55
You know, but the Bible tells us
00:11:03.56\00:11:05.56
that the actual vision it
has to be a revelation from God
00:11:05.57\00:11:10.27
and so you can imagine
that Biblical leadership
00:11:10.28\00:11:12.80
without this vision,
00:11:12.81\00:11:14.21
without this
revelation from God is doomed.
00:11:14.22\00:11:17.39
So that's why
all leaders actually
00:11:17.40\00:11:19.48
must really
honestly ask the Lord,
00:11:19.49\00:11:22.22
"What would you have me do
to get that vision from God?"
00:11:22.23\00:11:26.58
And so and God reveals to
us in many ways as we say,
00:11:26.59\00:11:30.32
"He may audibly talk to us."
00:11:30.33\00:11:32.99
He may clearly reveal
something to us in scripture
00:11:33.00\00:11:35.98
and He may lead
us by circumstances
00:11:35.99\00:11:37.80
like He led
Nehemiah or other people,
00:11:37.81\00:11:40.45
Paul and others
and Timothy and Titus.
00:11:40.46\00:11:43.79
They didn't hear
the voice from God.
00:11:43.80\00:11:45.61
So they were
called by circumstances.
00:11:45.62\00:11:49.03
And then the third principle
00:11:49.04\00:11:51.04
that I want to end
these three principles on
00:11:51.05\00:11:53.41
is the character of a leader,
00:11:53.42\00:11:55.20
you know, someone had said that,
00:11:55.21\00:11:57.46
"Sometimes your
talents would take--
00:11:57.47\00:12:00.11
would take you to a place
00:12:00.12\00:12:01.73
where your
character cannot keep you."
00:12:01.74\00:12:03.54
Your talents would
take you to a place
00:12:05.54\00:12:07.65
where your
character cannot keep you.
00:12:07.66\00:12:09.25
So which means that
my character as a leader,
00:12:09.26\00:12:12.73
your character as a leader,
00:12:12.74\00:12:14.04
what kind of
character do we have?
00:12:14.05\00:12:16.01
And there are two
things I can say on this,
00:12:16.02\00:12:18.55
number one is to be
really a follower of God.
00:12:18.56\00:12:22.33
Paul says when he writes
to the Church of Corinth,
00:12:22.34\00:12:26.57
he tell them, "Imitate
me as I've imitated Christ."
00:12:26.58\00:12:30.32
And when you-- you wonder,
00:12:30.33\00:12:31.78
"Who is this
Christ that he imitated?"
00:12:31.79\00:12:33.98
Then your mind
goes to the Philippians.
00:12:33.99\00:12:36.55
When Paul says, "Let this mind
00:12:36.56\00:12:39.48
that was in
Christ also be in you."
00:12:39.49\00:12:41.63
That mind of a servant,
00:12:41.64\00:12:43.49
which leads me to a second point
00:12:43.50\00:12:45.48
that a leader--the
character of a leader
00:12:45.49\00:12:47.29
he must not only be
a follower of Christ
00:12:47.30\00:12:49.63
but also he must be
a servant of Christ.
00:12:49.64\00:12:52.27
And you look at
this as Paul introduces
00:12:52.28\00:12:54.66
almost all his letters, he says,
00:12:54.67\00:12:57.56
"I, Paul, a servant of Christ
am one being called by God
00:12:57.57\00:13:02.87
but also a servant of Christ."
00:13:02.88\00:13:04.61
So, those three principles
00:13:04.62\00:13:06.13
that's how I can reduce
leadership into. All right.
00:13:06.14\00:13:08.98
Well, you know, the show is--
00:13:08.99\00:13:11.00
is issues that our that
young people are facing. Sure.
00:13:11.01\00:13:14.89
And it's great to
know all of the things
00:13:14.90\00:13:17.87
that make a good
leader how God calls a leader,
00:13:17.88\00:13:20.06
but what about the
people whom God has called
00:13:20.07\00:13:23.04
that aren't responding.
00:13:23.05\00:13:24.21
Maybe, Jay, you might
even be all the time here.
00:13:24.22\00:13:26.45
There are people that,
00:13:26.46\00:13:27.60
you know, are may be
questioning their leadership.
00:13:27.61\00:13:29.50
Right. You know.
00:13:29.51\00:13:30.50
Did God really
intent for me to do this?
00:13:30.51\00:13:32.32
What do you say to
people in for feeling that?
00:13:32.33\00:13:37.14
People who are
questioning their leadership--
00:13:37.15\00:13:38.49
I think--I think
that's a very good question.
00:13:38.50\00:13:41.77
One way I think
I can respond to is
00:13:41.78\00:13:44.24
look at the life of Paul.
00:13:44.25\00:13:46.58
The way Paul
responded when he was being
00:13:46.59\00:13:49.78
challenged about
his leadership's style,
00:13:49.79\00:13:51.95
about his leadership,
about his calling of leadership.
00:13:51.96\00:13:54.84
You look at the
book of II Corinthians
00:13:54.85\00:13:57.00
Chapter 10 to Chapter 13.
00:13:57.01\00:14:00.04
Paul defends his
calling so I think one thing
00:14:00.05\00:14:03.95
we've to be sure
before even we start leading
00:14:03.96\00:14:05.95
is to be sure
of our own calling.
00:14:05.96\00:14:08.66
Is my calling sure?
Has God called me this?
00:14:08.67\00:14:11.63
Once we're
certain of this calling,
00:14:11.64\00:14:14.09
we would be
willing to die for it.
00:14:14.10\00:14:15.67
You look at the Apostles.
00:14:15.68\00:14:16.95
You look at even
Adventist pioneers.
00:14:16.96\00:14:18.81
They were sure
that God had called them
00:14:18.82\00:14:21.45
for such a time as
this and because of that
00:14:21.46\00:14:25.13
they would be
willing even to die for that.
00:14:25.14\00:14:27.22
And so you look at the
life of the Apostle Paul,
00:14:27.23\00:14:29.67
they say in those two chapter--
00:14:29.68\00:14:30.98
in those three chapters where
he defends his apostleship.
00:14:30.99\00:14:33.63
He defense it knowing
that clearly Christ called him
00:14:33.64\00:14:36.78
and so no matter what you
can say, "I've been called."
00:14:36.79\00:14:39.26
So to anybody who's
challenged by the fact that,
00:14:39.27\00:14:42.69
"Has God called me?
00:14:42.70\00:14:44.13
You know, what
is the credibility
00:14:44.14\00:14:46.73
of my leadership
is to first honestly
00:14:46.74\00:14:49.21
within one's heart
answer the question,
00:14:49.22\00:14:52.00
"Has God called me?" Right.
00:14:52.01\00:14:53.85
And once you are assure
that God has called you,
00:14:53.86\00:14:56.74
no challenge no
mountain that you cannot climb.
00:14:56.75\00:15:00.21
Yeah, I think it's interesting
00:15:00.22\00:15:01.24
'cause at least in the countries
00:15:01.25\00:15:03.29
that I served as a pastor,
00:15:03.30\00:15:04.74
I see many of our
members kind of with a fear
00:15:04.75\00:15:09.57
of assuming
positions of leadership.
00:15:09.58\00:15:11.91
And of course, I
think every individual
00:15:11.92\00:15:14.70
maybe has a
different story. Sure.
00:15:14.71\00:15:16.68
But what I found is
may be a fear of failure.
00:15:16.69\00:15:21.96
I think also may
be a previous failure
00:15:21.97\00:15:24.71
that the experience
that they don't want
00:15:24.72\00:15:27.69
to see resurrects again,
00:15:27.70\00:15:31.59
maybe a sensation of
not being good enough. Okay.
00:15:31.60\00:15:34.96
Not being, you know,
qualified for the task.
00:15:34.97\00:15:38.01
But I think it's interesting
'cause when you look at
00:15:38.02\00:15:39.63
one of the most amazing leaders
00:15:39.64\00:15:40.92
in all the scripture is Moses.
00:15:40.93\00:15:42.84
And Moses when God was calling,
00:15:42.85\00:15:44.30
you know, Valmy's talking
about being sure of your call.
00:15:44.31\00:15:46.97
And Moses was really trying
to justify the call, "Oh God."
00:15:46.98\00:15:51.41
And he says, "Who
am I?". "Who am I?"
00:15:51.42\00:15:54.06
"How can I do this?" Yeah.
00:15:54.07\00:15:55.77
But it's
interesting because I think
00:15:55.78\00:15:57.59
that actually is a
qualification of a leader.
00:15:57.60\00:16:01.30
Is when you recognize
that you're not good enough
00:16:01.31\00:16:04.06
because what
you're gonna have to do is
00:16:04.07\00:16:05.86
you're gonna have to depend
on somebody else's strength.
00:16:05.87\00:16:08.01
And obviously we're talk--
00:16:08.02\00:16:09.01
we're referring
to the Lord there.
00:16:09.02\00:16:10.37
So leadership is
something that cannot be
00:16:10.38\00:16:13.21
successfully taken
place without the recognition
00:16:13.22\00:16:19.47
that you are not good enough
00:16:19.48\00:16:21.32
and that you need the
Lord in order to cope--
00:16:21.33\00:16:24.08
in order to give you the wisdom
00:16:24.09\00:16:26.61
to make the right
decisions, to coach people, to,
00:16:26.62\00:16:30.10
you know, be a good
representative, et cetera.
00:16:30.11\00:16:32.97
So I think those
are the two things
00:16:32.98\00:16:34.18
that I've seen
is a fear of failure
00:16:34.19\00:16:36.23
and maybe a
sensation that I'm good enough
00:16:36.24\00:16:39.60
or that I'm not worthy enough.
00:16:39.61\00:16:41.38
And I think that if you feel
that you're not worthy enough.
00:16:41.39\00:16:44.59
If you feel
you're not good enough,
00:16:44.60\00:16:46.63
well, then you just qualified
yourself as a potential--
00:16:46.64\00:16:49.26
potential leader
that's gonna be amazing. Yes.
00:16:49.27\00:16:51.39
I like that because as
we've said in the beginning,
00:16:51.40\00:16:53.82
it's all about, you
know, caring for the flock
00:16:53.83\00:16:56.94
and that only happens, you know,
00:16:56.95\00:16:59.07
the Lord is the shepherd of
the flock, just using us. Yes.
00:16:59.08\00:17:03.16
And so that's, you
know, the leader has to be
00:17:03.17\00:17:05.67
a follower of
Christ and a servant
00:17:05.68\00:17:07.13
because Christ
was a servant. Right.
00:17:07.14\00:17:09.24
And has to be a
follower of Jesus
00:17:09.25\00:17:12.00
and that's how
Biblical leadership takes place.
00:17:12.01\00:17:15.25
Now, what about somebody
00:17:15.26\00:17:18.05
who's got a vision to
do something big for God?
00:17:18.06\00:17:21.32
Wants to get
involved in a local church,
00:17:21.33\00:17:23.08
wants to get
involved in a conference,
00:17:23.09\00:17:26.36
but needs
opposition along the way.
00:17:26.37\00:17:30.42
Maybe the church is against,
00:17:30.43\00:17:33.21
you know, this kind of program,
00:17:33.22\00:17:34.44
this kind of
approach whatever it is.
00:17:34.45\00:17:36.33
How does he, you know, he
believes God has called him
00:17:36.34\00:17:39.19
or she believes God
has called her? Right.
00:17:39.20\00:17:41.24
How does she
work with the church
00:17:41.25\00:17:44.05
and not go against it? Right.
00:17:44.06\00:17:46.57
I think that's
something as young people
00:17:46.58\00:17:49.85
we experience all the time.
00:17:49.86\00:17:51.37
You know, you have
this vision that this burden
00:17:51.38\00:17:54.54
the Lord may be
laying on your heart,
00:17:54.55\00:17:56.19
perhaps you don't
even have finances.
00:17:56.20\00:17:58.20
You have so many obstacles
00:17:58.21\00:17:59.88
but I think at first
being certain of your calling,
00:17:59.89\00:18:03.64
that's number one
and also knowing that
00:18:03.65\00:18:05.91
because God has
called you, He will provide.
00:18:05.92\00:18:08.04
Let's look at--we
were talking about Moses.
00:18:08.05\00:18:10.10
Let's look at Exodus Chapter 12.
00:18:10.11\00:18:12.28
Exodus Chapter 12.
00:18:17.51\00:18:20.03
I think I'd lost the verse here.
00:18:22.30\00:18:24.12
I think I lost the verse.
00:18:29.76\00:18:31.39
But the concept here
is that God tells Moses,
00:18:31.40\00:18:36.06
"Go therefore,
I'll be with your mouth
00:18:36.07\00:18:39.24
and I shall
teach you what to say."
00:18:39.25\00:18:41.00
I think Exodus
Chapter 4. Chapter 4 Verse 12.
00:18:41.01\00:18:43.96
Yes. Yes. Exodus 4:12.
Exodus Chapter 4 Verse 12.
00:18:43.97\00:18:47.08
And it's a very good
verse. Read it for us here, Jay.
00:18:47.09\00:18:51.15
Exodus 12:4 says,
"Now therefore go,
00:18:51.16\00:18:54.29
and I will be with your mouth,
00:18:54.30\00:18:56.46
and teach you
what you shall say."
00:18:56.47\00:18:58.29
And so you see here
God after He calls Moses,
00:18:58.30\00:19:01.75
He assures him that,
"I shall also provide.
00:19:01.76\00:19:05.32
I shall give you the strength,
I shall give you everything
00:19:05.33\00:19:08.56
you need to carry
out in this ministry."
00:19:08.57\00:19:10.41
So as long as God has called us,
00:19:10.42\00:19:13.03
we must have faith and trust
00:19:13.04\00:19:15.46
that God will help us
to carriy this through.
00:19:15.47\00:19:17.51
And also you
study the life later--
00:19:17.52\00:19:18.99
the life of Paul or
even the life of Nehemiah.
00:19:19.00\00:19:21.33
You study the life of Paul.
00:19:21.34\00:19:22.82
Paul it took him like 10 years.
00:19:22.83\00:19:25.27
Scholar showed that Paul
it took him about 10 years
00:19:25.28\00:19:27.78
before the first time he
met Christ and at the time
00:19:27.79\00:19:30.99
actually he started his
ministry to the Gentiles
00:19:31.00\00:19:33.60
because what there was this,
00:19:33.61\00:19:35.47
Acts 15 was in the
middle of his calling
00:19:35.48\00:19:38.85
because Paul couldn't
reach the Gentiles because
00:19:38.86\00:19:42.96
there was this obstacle
of the Gentiles and the Jews.
00:19:42.97\00:19:45.98
You know, unless
this issue of circumcision
00:19:45.99\00:19:48.14
had been reserved, Paul
could not reach the Gentiles.
00:19:48.15\00:19:50.79
So imagine that
when God calls Paul,
00:19:50.80\00:19:53.99
Christ calls Paul but
Paul has to wait for some years
00:19:54.00\00:19:57.67
before Act 15 happens.
00:19:57.68\00:20:00.03
And once Acts 15
happens then Paul has a--
00:20:00.04\00:20:03.39
more open door to
reach the Gentiles.
00:20:03.40\00:20:06.18
So as long as God has called us
00:20:06.19\00:20:08.19
we must have the patience
00:20:08.20\00:20:09.59
and know that
God's timing is not ours.
00:20:09.60\00:20:11.91
That at a critical time
God will open a door for us
00:20:11.92\00:20:15.30
to go through. All right.
00:20:15.31\00:20:16.51
So you've experienced
00:20:16.52\00:20:19.41
some opposition along the away.
00:20:19.42\00:20:20.94
Haven't you? Absolutely.
00:20:20.95\00:20:23.20
Do you wanna-- do
you care to tell us
00:20:23.21\00:20:25.14
how you dealt
with those situations,
00:20:25.15\00:20:27.28
maybe a little bit
of what happened then?
00:20:27.29\00:20:30.55
I think, I mean,
opposition must be expected,
00:20:30.56\00:20:34.05
you know, there is a
law in physics that says,
00:20:34.06\00:20:36.41
"Where there is motion,
there is always friction."
00:20:36.42\00:20:39.57
You know, as
along as there is motion
00:20:39.58\00:20:41.80
you must expect friction
00:20:41.81\00:20:43.41
and so I think
opposition must be expected.
00:20:43.42\00:20:47.26
But if you know
this is God's calling,
00:20:47.27\00:20:49.67
this is God's
vision, nothing can stop it.
00:20:49.68\00:20:52.30
So I think any leader
must exhibit that confidence
00:20:52.31\00:20:55.18
that God has called me
and this is God's vision.
00:20:55.19\00:20:58.24
And so I think that becomes
the source of your strength.
00:20:58.25\00:21:01.44
So number one, how do you deal
00:21:01.45\00:21:02.99
with these
obstacles and these challenges
00:21:03.00\00:21:05.74
and opposition is
like Paul dealt with it.
00:21:05.75\00:21:08.57
First of all, draw courage
00:21:08.58\00:21:10.64
and strength from
your own calling, you know,
00:21:10.65\00:21:13.27
he spends three chapters
defending his apostleship
00:21:13.28\00:21:16.85
so he draws courage
from his own calling,
00:21:16.86\00:21:19.04
from his
experience with the Lord,
00:21:19.05\00:21:20.88
you know, so I
think as a young leaders
00:21:20.89\00:21:24.03
this is where we
need to draw our courage
00:21:24.04\00:21:26.66
and our strength in times
00:21:26.67\00:21:28.33
when we face opposition
that God has called us.
00:21:28.34\00:21:31.71
Also we must understand
that we must wait on God
00:21:31.72\00:21:35.88
to lead to open doors
just as Paul waited on God
00:21:35.89\00:21:39.12
to remove the
issue of circumcisions
00:21:39.13\00:21:41.90
so he can reach to the Gentiles.
00:21:41.91\00:21:43.98
So we must have the patience
00:21:43.99\00:21:45.59
and in time in
this period of waiting,
00:21:45.60\00:21:48.62
God is also
molding our characters.
00:21:48.63\00:21:50.70
He is walking on us also.
00:21:50.71\00:21:52.23
So I think those
are-- those are two points
00:21:52.24\00:21:55.26
I can provide on
this and how to deal
00:21:55.27\00:21:57.26
with this
obstacles and challenges.
00:21:57.27\00:22:00.40
All right. Real quick.
00:22:00.41\00:22:02.80
You said that
Biblical leadership
00:22:02.81\00:22:05.27
has certain qualities? Yes.
00:22:05.28\00:22:07.41
Tell us what those are?
00:22:07.42\00:22:09.18
I think Biblical if
I can some--you know,
00:22:09.19\00:22:11.22
Biblical leadership must exhibit
00:22:11.23\00:22:12.96
two fundamental qualities.
00:22:12.97\00:22:14.48
Number one, it
must be Bible-based,
00:22:14.49\00:22:16.75
in other words
the calling for itself
00:22:16.76\00:22:19.62
for Biblical leadership
must be a God's calling.
00:22:19.63\00:22:23.09
God has-- have called you.
00:22:23.10\00:22:24.60
Secondly, you must
be the vision of God.
00:22:24.61\00:22:27.20
I mean, you look
at even our Church
00:22:27.21\00:22:28.91
our beloved Church, our vision,
00:22:28.92\00:22:30.92
you know, the
three angels' message
00:22:30.93\00:22:32.26
is God's vision for us.
00:22:32.27\00:22:34.30
That's why even as a
Seventh-day Adventist
00:22:34.31\00:22:36.33
whenever God gives me a vision,
00:22:36.34\00:22:38.36
I have to know that it falls
00:22:38.37\00:22:40.19
within this large
vision of the Church
00:22:40.20\00:22:43.17
that my vision my small vision
00:22:43.18\00:22:45.06
God has given me
as a church member,
00:22:45.07\00:22:47.59
it has to fit in the
larger vision of the church.
00:22:47.60\00:22:50.26
So number one, it
has to be Bible-based
00:22:50.27\00:22:52.84
the calling of
God, the vision of God,
00:22:52.85\00:22:55.23
it has to be Bible-based.
00:22:55.24\00:22:57.26
And secondly, it has
to be reviving in nature,
00:22:57.27\00:23:00.83
if I'm a leader I
have to lead God's people
00:23:00.84\00:23:05.08
and I should be leading
them from point A to point B.
00:23:05.09\00:23:09.33
So if there is no changes in
the lives, in their lifestyle.
00:23:09.34\00:23:13.35
If there is no change
that is happening in the Church
00:23:13.36\00:23:15.90
then there is a problem.
00:23:15.91\00:23:17.36
So Biblical
leadership must be Bible-based
00:23:17.37\00:23:20.45
and it must be
also reviving in nature.
00:23:20.46\00:23:23.13
So Valmy, what about,
maybe it's good to know
00:23:23.14\00:23:26.81
the good things about leadership
00:23:26.82\00:23:28.34
and the how-to's
and what not. Yes.
00:23:28.35\00:23:30.64
But how do we avoid
00:23:30.65\00:23:33.53
may be the common
mistakes made by leaders?
00:23:33.54\00:23:37.04
You as a leader may be
you're coaching other leaders.
00:23:37.05\00:23:39.63
What have you seen
are the common mistakes
00:23:39.64\00:23:41.92
that leaders make
that makes their leadership
00:23:41.93\00:23:45.55
a little bit not so successful
00:23:45.56\00:23:47.36
and maybe even discourage them
00:23:47.37\00:23:48.66
from continuing in
their leadership role?
00:23:48.67\00:23:50.51
Have you seen
anything that kind of repeats
00:23:50.52\00:23:52.55
something that's
kind of continual?
00:23:52.56\00:23:54.08
I think one of the obvious one
00:23:54.09\00:23:56.92
we mentioned about
it is discouragement.
00:23:56.93\00:23:59.62
You know, you start a project.
00:23:59.63\00:24:01.52
You start a ministry
and five years down the road
00:24:01.53\00:24:05.07
you feel
discouraged and you quit.
00:24:05.08\00:24:07.73
So I can imagine Paul
quitting after five years.
00:24:07.74\00:24:10.33
You know, but he persisted
00:24:10.34\00:24:11.55
and waited until that
the vision was removed.
00:24:11.56\00:24:14.43
So discouragement is
one of the common one.
00:24:14.44\00:24:16.76
The second one is
also a lack of reflection,
00:24:16.77\00:24:20.09
a lack of sit down to plan,
00:24:20.10\00:24:22.24
you know, as the
leaders we need to sit down
00:24:22.25\00:24:25.12
and plan and think ahead,
00:24:25.13\00:24:27.31
you know, anticipate the future,
00:24:27.32\00:24:30.77
anticipate what could happen.
00:24:30.78\00:24:32.34
And so I've also seen
that as one of the obstacle
00:24:32.35\00:24:36.20
and the challenges that ends
up discouraging many leaders.
00:24:36.21\00:24:39.97
And the third one,
I would say would be
00:24:39.98\00:24:43.50
lack of planning to
have a successful successor.
00:24:43.51\00:24:50.51
You know, investing in someone--
00:24:50.52\00:24:52.59
Who will take issues on? Yes.
00:24:52.60\00:24:55.06
Investing in someone
who will take your issues.
00:24:55.07\00:24:58.04
Who will pass the baton,
00:24:58.05\00:24:59.04
somebody who will
pass the baton. Exactly.
00:24:59.05\00:25:00.79
You know as they say,
00:25:00.80\00:25:01.79
"Success without a
successor is failure."
00:25:01.80\00:25:03.94
So taking time
really to invest in someone
00:25:03.95\00:25:07.04
that actually would
be see them as someone
00:25:07.05\00:25:09.33
who could be a
greater leader than you.
00:25:09.34\00:25:11.05
Thanks a lot.
00:25:11.06\00:25:12.45
I can imagine Moses
investing in Joshua.
00:25:12.46\00:25:14.85
You know, seeing that Joshua
would be this great leader
00:25:14.86\00:25:18.38
that will take the people
of God in the Promised Land
00:25:18.39\00:25:21.70
and so I think that's
also the other hindrance
00:25:21.71\00:25:25.18
that we see common.
00:25:25.19\00:25:26.78
People want to
be leaders for life,
00:25:26.79\00:25:28.92
president for life kind
of thing, kind of mentality.
00:25:28.93\00:25:32.83
I come from Africa
and so we've presidents
00:25:32.84\00:25:36.11
in power for like
40 years, you know.
00:25:36.12\00:25:38.22
Right. And by the time
they even in their 5th year
00:25:38.23\00:25:40.53
they have no
more vision, nothing.
00:25:40.54\00:25:42.24
And so we have to
avoid that kind of mentality.
00:25:42.25\00:25:45.03
What would you say to somebody
who wants to be a leader,
00:25:45.04\00:25:49.55
but where would
you tell him to start?
00:25:49.56\00:25:51.74
I would say start
on your knees. Amen.
00:25:53.61\00:25:56.45
Start on your knees, you know,
00:25:56.46\00:25:58.24
"God, what is it
that you're calling--
00:25:58.25\00:26:00.17
you're calling me for?"
00:26:00.18\00:26:01.30
Start on your knees,
you know, wrestle with God
00:26:01.31\00:26:03.93
because God sees the
end from the beginning,
00:26:03.94\00:26:06.15
you know as Ellen White says,
00:26:06.16\00:26:07.48
"God sees the end
from the beginning.
00:26:07.49\00:26:09.11
He sees our lives as
though they were this moment."
00:26:09.12\00:26:12.24
And so as we
see, as we kneel down
00:26:12.25\00:26:15.60
to search the
entire council of God
00:26:15.61\00:26:19.20
and God will reveal
to us whatever vision,
00:26:19.21\00:26:21.72
whatever plan He
has for our lives.
00:26:21.73\00:26:23.46
So it's also knowing,
"What is my purpose in life?"
00:26:23.47\00:26:26.67
You know, and
so, I mean, leaders
00:26:26.68\00:26:28.97
we've to face it also
leadership is also a try,
00:26:28.98\00:26:31.86
you know, it is as they
say, "Leadership is hardship."
00:26:31.87\00:26:34.77
But also leadership is one
of the most rewarding thing,
00:26:34.78\00:26:37.77
you know, you enjoy
mentoring young people.
00:26:37.78\00:26:41.87
You enjoyed being mentored,
you know, and all this.
00:26:41.88\00:26:44.47
Well, Valmy, I think
we've learned quite a bit
00:26:46.02\00:26:47.61
in the subject of leadership.
We've packed in a lot.
00:26:47.62\00:26:49.91
I didn't think there
was-- we could exhaust so much.
00:26:49.92\00:26:52.49
I wish we could
continue but unfortunately,
00:26:52.50\00:26:54.74
our time is
pretty much gone. Sure.
00:26:54.75\00:26:56.65
But we definitely
appreciate your presence with us
00:26:56.66\00:26:59.23
and I feel
inspired to be a leader.
00:26:59.24\00:27:01.00
I'm feeling
inspired to do better job
00:27:01.01\00:27:03.00
in my leadership
roles and hopefully,
00:27:03.01\00:27:05.75
those that have
watched this program
00:27:05.76\00:27:07.29
have seen that
inspired of whatever position
00:27:07.30\00:27:10.07
you find yourself in,
you're actually a leader,
00:27:10.08\00:27:12.67
now you may not
be the president,
00:27:12.68\00:27:14.52
you may not have be the CEO
00:27:14.53\00:27:16.49
of a very successful
corporation but nonetheless,
00:27:16.50\00:27:20.61
God has placed you
in a capacity to lead.
00:27:20.62\00:27:24.53
Maybe you're a
father, maybe you're a parent,
00:27:24.54\00:27:26.33
maybe you're mother,
maybe you're an older brother.
00:27:26.34\00:27:28.64
Maybe you've
positions in the church,
00:27:28.65\00:27:31.36
et cetera, et cetera.
00:27:31.37\00:27:32.70
The point is that
God has called all of us
00:27:32.71\00:27:34.80
to be leaders in
different capacities,
00:27:34.81\00:27:36.94
we must accept this challenge.
00:27:36.95\00:27:38.62
But we must accept it humbly
00:27:38.63\00:27:40.96
and we must accept the
fact that God has called us
00:27:40.97\00:27:43.07
not to fail but to succeed.
00:27:43.08\00:27:45.53
But we must accept it
in humility like Moses did,
00:27:45.54\00:27:48.06
recognizing that
in our own strength,
00:27:48.07\00:27:50.08
it is possible to be
as successful leader.
00:27:50.09\00:27:53.45
So by the grace of God
those that are watching
00:27:53.46\00:27:56.62
will go from this place
00:27:56.63\00:27:58.11
forward in their
leadership roles.
00:27:58.12\00:27:59.87
God bless you. Till next time.
00:27:59.88\00:28:01.95