The Carter Report presents
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"The Living
Word" around the world.
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Hello friend, I'm John Carter.
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Welcome today to
the Carter Report.
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My guest today is an
American attorney, Alan Reinach,
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who is a great
champion of religious liberty
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and civil freedoms.
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He believes and I
believe it too that freedom here
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in the United
States is under attack.
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Gonna talk about it today.
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Welcome to this special
edition of "The Carter Report."
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Hi, I'm John Carter.
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I guess the toughest
place that I've ever been to,
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as far as
preaching of the gospel
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is concerned, is India.
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Home to more
than a billion souls.
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And I guess, hundreds of
million of different Gods.
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It almost overwhelms the senses.
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What can we do?
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Well, we've been to India,
we've run outdoor meetings.
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We've had thousands
and thousands of people,
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Hindus, Muslims at our meetings
coming forth in altar calls.
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But we're going to try to
do something else as well.
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We're gonna start small.
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We're starting
with a program called
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"Touching the Untouchables."
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And we're going to start
with a little untouchable goals.
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We're doing this now.
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We're getting them food,
because they're so hungry.
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Hard to come to
Jesus, when you're hungry
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and so we're getting them food
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and we will be
sending them to school.
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We're trying to feed
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their souls and
fill their bellies.
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In India, home to
more than a billion souls
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and hundreds of million of Gods,
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controlled by evil spirits.
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Please help us in
this work. Please help us.
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Write to me, John
Carter, post office box 1900,
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Thousand Oaks, California, 91358
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or write to me at
Terrigal in Australia.
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We have an Australian office
as we have an Indian office,
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with somebody
there working full time
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trying to touch the untouchables
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with the love of Jesus.
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Please write to me today.
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And Jesus said,
"I've come to seek
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and to save
that which was lost."
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Welcome to the Carter Report.
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And Alan, a
super welcome to you.
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It's great to be
back with you, Carter.
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You're a great
guest and we're blessed
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by your contributions
to these discussions.
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Thank you, John.
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Now we're talking about freedom
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and we believe that freedom
is based up on the Bible.
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We do.
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We believe that it's
based up on Protestantism
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that we come from
the very hand of God
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and every person is
important and therefore
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every person has
a right to freedom.
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Tell me about
post-modernism, please.
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Well, it's true
John, that America has been
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a beacon of freedom to the world
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because of our
Protestant foundation.
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Not everybody understands
that or believes that.
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And that doesn't
mean that everyone
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in the founding of our
country were believers,
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were born again, were
saved were Christians.
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But there was a Protestant
culture that respected
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the rights of the individual.
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The culture.
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And it came out of
the Protestant doctrines
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about the necessity of
a personal relationship
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with Jesus Christ through faith.
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Now, for a long time
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there was this kind
of philosophical contest
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between Christianity
and the enlightenment,
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which was
rational, it was secular
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and there was this idea
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of the inavailability
of human progress.
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But really with the
collapse of the twin towers,
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the enlightenment idea of human
progress collapsed with it.
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And the terrorist
activities did more to destroy
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the enlightenment
than two centuries
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of debate with Christianity.
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This is absolutely
astounding what you're saying.
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But in the mean time, out
of the cultural revolutions
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of the '60s and the '70s
we had the new age movement
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which morphed into
what we call post-modernism.
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And modernism by
contrast, was you know,
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the enlightenment was
rationalism, was logical,
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was based on reason, humanism,
was part of the enlightenment.
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And the notion
that the human brain,
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we could reason, we could think,
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we could develop for ourselves.
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Post-modernism,
on the other hand,
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essential supplants experience
in place of logic and reason.
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Alan, it is
believed today by millions
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that we are the product of
time plus matter plus chance.
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This of course is neo-Darwinism.
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Man is the product of
time plus matter plus chance
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therefore you
don't need the Bible.
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And if you don't need the Bible,
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the concept of freedom,
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personal freedom is
an antiquated notion.
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You know, all we
have to do is go back
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and look at the later
part of the 19th century,
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when we had, what was known
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as social-Darwinism,
survival of the fittest.
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Yes, yes.
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It was a very
brutal time in the early
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part of the
industrializing of America.
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And Alan, the 20th
century, the greatest wars
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in the history of human race.
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And the greatest
destruction of human life,
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systematically
by the government.
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You know, but
Nietzsche, don't you?
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Yes.
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Nietzsche was the
great philosopher who said,
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there is no God and
therefore if there's no God,
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the death of God always
leads to the death of man.
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Hitler slept with a
copy of Friedrich Nietzsche,
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the German
philosopher, under his pillow.
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Look, if man is not, does
not have an inherent dignity
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because he's
created in Gods image.
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Yes.
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Then why should we care
about protecting human rights?
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And this is the very,
very heart of the matter
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and we want the
audience to understand this,
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the very heart of this matter
is human dignity and freedom.
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Let's talk about your
right to practice your sexuality
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and my rights to
practice my religion.
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They're in conflict, John.
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And this is really the main
issue facing religious freedom
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in America today
is, how do we achieve
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a live and let live
politically, legally
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that respects the rights
of the LGBT community to--
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And we should
respect those rights.
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Of course.
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We don't believe
in that philosophy,
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but we need to
respect those rights.
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Everyone has in America,
are genius of our system
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is respecting
everyone's right to live
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according to their own
vision, their own values,
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their own lifestyle,
their own religious beliefs.
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The problem is, right now it
seems to be a zero-some game,
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where there is this culture war
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between the LGBT
community on the one hand
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and liberal, secular,
civil rights community versus
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the religious
right, that's very anti-gay
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and anti-gay rights
and so there's this clash
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and the left ones to see
religious freedom as the enemy
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and the right ones to
see gay rights is the enemy
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and very few on either
side are willing to find
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some sort of middle
ground, some sort of compromise.
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The old intolerance.
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Alan, I want to
make a statement,
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in fact I'm going to read it.
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I want everybody to
hear this statement.
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I want them to listen up
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and hear what we
believe on homosexuality.
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"I believe that a homosexual
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has the God given
right to be a homosexual."
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Amen.
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Well said, yeah.
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"I may not agree or
disagree with homosexuality,"
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That's not the point.
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"But I believe we should defend
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the rights of all men and women.
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As Christians, we are called
to show unconditional love."
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Please comment, Alan.
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The culture war has
taught, the homosexuals taught
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the gay person
that God hates facts.
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This is
disgusting. This is dreadful
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This is not my language,
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this is the
language that we hear.
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Okay? And so-
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And that's so unchristian.
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We have the
language in the church about
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loving the sinner
and hating the sin.
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But frankly, the
sinner all they hear
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and feel is the hatred.
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Yes.
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And you know,
beyond the political
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and legal issues for Christians,
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the main event is
gospel of Jesus Christ
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that Christ died for everyone.
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Yes.
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For gays, for straight
people, for blacks, for whites,
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for people of all
faith, every human being,
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there's a great leveling,
the gospel is a great leveler.
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We are all sinners and
we are all loved by God
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and Christ died
for each one of us.
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Now, of course, we're going
to get letters and phone calls
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from people who are going
to object to your sentiments
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and object to my ideas.
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Let me read it again, Alan.
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"I believe that a homosexual
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has the God given
right to be a homosexual.
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I may not agree or
disagree with homosexuality,"
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That's not the point.
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"But I believe we should defend
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the rights of all men and women.
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As Christians, we are called
to show unconditional love."
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You know, I'm
reminded John, that in the book
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"The Keys of This Blood,
a Roman-Catholic stalwart --
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Yes, the Malachi Martin.
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And insightful guide--
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Yeah, adjudge, you would.
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He characterized
Seventh-day Adventist
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of which I am one of believing
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that everyone has
the right to be wrong.
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Of course.
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Now, you're what
you believe to be wrong
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is gonna be different
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from what somebody
else believes to be wrong.
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And you know, Malachi Martin
will have a different view
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on what's wrong in
religion than I do.
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Yes.
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So, I think he was
right. Absolutely right.
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We believe that people have
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the right to
disagree to be different.
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Well of course, in the
great-- America was founded
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on that
principle, of Protestantism.
00:11:03.29\00:11:05.93
But in the Roman-Catholic
countries, for thousand years,
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people had the
right, to be right.
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Well, this is it.
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I didn't have the right to be--
I have the right to be wrong.
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Yeah, no-- the Pope said
00:11:15.22\00:11:18.23
you don't have the
right to be a heretic--
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you don't have the
right to teach heresy.
00:11:20.61\00:11:22.42
Error has no rights.
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That was the philosophy.
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But we believe in
the right to be wrong.
00:11:25.65\00:11:27.80
Well,-- Of course--
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See the problem is,
00:11:29.14\00:11:30.17
if you don't have
the right to be wrong
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then who has the right
to define what is right?
00:11:32.30\00:11:35.11
And whoever has that right
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has the power then to
oppress people who disagree.
00:11:36.90\00:11:40.20
And we believe that
the concept of persecution
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is the very heart and
essence of anti-Christ.
00:11:43.93\00:11:47.79
Correct.
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Now, Alan, here
it is. Wait for it.
00:11:48.91\00:11:54.57
"Should a Christian be
forced by the government
00:11:54.60\00:11:57.71
to participate in so
called same sex marriage,
00:11:57.74\00:12:02.51
when his religion
says, it is wrong?"
00:12:02.54\00:12:05.07
I'm thinking particularly
of the pizza people,
00:12:05.10\00:12:08.85
who wouldn't go
along to a wedding
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and they got a big fine.
00:12:11.45\00:12:13.21
I don't remember the pizza ones,
00:12:13.24\00:12:14.85
there's a
florist, there's a baker,
00:12:14.88\00:12:17.66
there's you know
several that have been fined.
00:12:17.69\00:12:20.16
Then the florist would do,
and the baker will be okay.
00:12:20.19\00:12:21.93
You know, one of one--
and I won't quote who it is,
00:12:21.96\00:12:24.91
but one of the Republican
candidates for the president,
00:12:24.94\00:12:28.23
I thought, one
interviewed by NPR,
00:12:28.26\00:12:31.66
made a very good distinction.
00:12:31.69\00:12:33.10
He said, look
nobody has the right
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in their businesses to--
00:12:36.67\00:12:38.47
should have the
right in their businesses,
00:12:38.50\00:12:40.17
to discriminate
against gays and not so--
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And he's right, he's right.
00:12:42.60\00:12:43.65
And I agree with that. Yes.
00:12:43.68\00:12:44.72
I support laws that outlaw
discrimination against gays.
00:12:44.75\00:12:48.01
Yes.
00:12:48.04\00:12:49.07
But he said, when it
comes to same sex weddings,
00:12:49.10\00:12:52.04
the issue was not
discriminating against people.
00:12:52.07\00:12:54.79
It's abstaining from
participating in an event
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that they don't agree with,
that they can't participate in.
00:12:59.18\00:13:03.32
And that's called Christian
charity intolerance, isn't it?
00:13:03.35\00:13:06.43
Well, I think it is.
00:13:06.46\00:13:08.57
It's certainly
not intolerant to say,
00:13:08.60\00:13:11.24
I'll be happy to
provide you with services,
00:13:11.27\00:13:13.77
but don't ask me to
participate in an event
00:13:13.80\00:13:16.82
that I can't
consensually agree with.
00:13:16.85\00:13:19.42
The President of
the United States
00:13:19.45\00:13:21.38
said recently that Christians
00:13:21.41\00:13:23.25
have been guilty
of gross intolerance.
00:13:23.28\00:13:27.24
Historically that's true.
00:13:27.27\00:13:28.53
That's true.
00:13:28.56\00:13:29.59
But we're going to talk
about this when we come back.
00:13:29.62\00:13:32.01
You're watching
the Carter Report.
00:13:32.04\00:13:34.89
I'm John Carter. This
is attorney Alan Reinach.
00:13:34.92\00:13:38.15
We're glad that
you joined us today.
00:13:38.18\00:13:40.65
This is a great
program on freedom.
00:13:40.68\00:13:44.56
We're talking
about how our freedoms
00:13:44.59\00:13:46.89
are being
undermined and attacked.
00:13:46.92\00:13:50.07
We're gonna take a little
pause now, and we'll be back.
00:13:50.10\00:13:53.73
God has His time and
His place for everything.
00:13:56.33\00:14:01.63
And the time and the place now
00:14:01.66\00:14:04.55
is Latin
America, including Cuba.
00:14:04.58\00:14:09.08
Time Magazine talks about
00:14:09.11\00:14:10.94
the second
Protestant reformation
00:14:10.97\00:14:13.84
and describes how
hundreds of thousands
00:14:13.87\00:14:17.24
even millions of Latinos
00:14:17.27\00:14:20.20
are coming to
the gospel of Christ.
00:14:20.23\00:14:23.94
I'm not an armchair theologians,
00:14:23.97\00:14:26.44
I'm speeding
according to experience.
00:14:26.47\00:14:29.23
I've seen it with my own eyes.
00:14:29.26\00:14:32.90
Recently we went
down to El Salvador,
00:14:32.93\00:14:36.89
there I spoke in the
largest football stadium
00:14:36.92\00:14:40.26
in Central America
with the biggest crowd that,
00:14:40.29\00:14:43.61
that football
stadium had ever, ever seen.
00:14:43.64\00:14:47.08
They came not to
see a football match
00:14:47.11\00:14:49.85
but to hear about
the Blood of Christ.
00:14:49.88\00:14:53.38
Millions are
coming to a knowledge
00:14:53.41\00:14:55.87
of God in Latin America.
00:14:55.90\00:14:59.27
Doors are opening in Cuba.
00:14:59.30\00:15:02.42
Who knows we may
be going to Cuba soon.
00:15:02.45\00:15:06.29
As the doors open
by the grace of God
00:15:06.32\00:15:09.64
we are going to
step through those doors
00:15:09.67\00:15:12.89
and we want you to step
through those doors with us
00:15:12.92\00:15:17.10
and be part of a team
for such a time as this.
00:15:17.13\00:15:21.33
Please write to me
friend, don't put it off.
00:15:21.36\00:15:24.34
Write to me, John Carter, 1900,
00:15:24.37\00:15:28.93
Thousand Oaks California 91358.
00:15:28.96\00:15:32.90
In Australia, write to me
at Terrigal, New South Wales.
00:15:32.93\00:15:38.22
Be part of the
second reformation,
00:15:38.25\00:15:41.82
join us and see
the miracles of God.
00:15:41.85\00:15:46.48
Amen.
00:15:46.51\00:15:47.56
Welcome back to Carter Report.
00:15:57.32\00:15:58.86
We have a great program today,
because we have a great guest.
00:15:58.89\00:16:02.26
Alan Reinach,
attorney, we're privileged
00:16:02.29\00:16:05.18
to have you on
our program today.
00:16:05.21\00:16:06.61
The privilege and
joy is mine, John.
00:16:06.64\00:16:08.70
Now, Alan, this
question is so good,
00:16:08.73\00:16:11.73
I'm going to read it so
I don't sort of mess it up.
00:16:11.76\00:16:16.29
"Cannot Christians and
other persons of faith,"
00:16:16.32\00:16:20.41
like us "agree to respect
the rights of homosexuals
00:16:20.44\00:16:26.00
and cannot
homosexuals agree to respect
00:16:26.03\00:16:29.08
the rights of religious people?"
00:16:29.11\00:16:32.42
Like you and me.
00:16:32.45\00:16:33.64
I call that live and let live.
00:16:33.67\00:16:35.79
And I think
that-- Is that Biblical?
00:16:35.82\00:16:37.31
That's exactly what we
need to achieve in America.
00:16:37.34\00:16:41.37
Yes, a system of
laws and a culture
00:16:41.40\00:16:45.18
that allows all of
us to live together.
00:16:45.21\00:16:47.22
The Church has the
right to have our schools,
00:16:47.25\00:16:51.07
to have our institutions
to serve the community
00:16:51.10\00:16:54.43
according to our own values,
00:16:54.46\00:16:56.46
which from any religions do
not respect same sex marriage,
00:16:56.49\00:17:00.61
but those who
believe in same sex marriage
00:17:00.64\00:17:03.72
and want to participate in it,
00:17:03.75\00:17:05.46
they should also have
00:17:05.49\00:17:07.84
their rights and
their lifestyle respected.
00:17:07.87\00:17:10.40
As you said
before, the man who wrote
00:17:10.43\00:17:13.11
"The Keys of This
Blood," Malachi Martin said,
00:17:13.14\00:17:16.71
people have the
right to be wrong.
00:17:16.74\00:17:19.27
Well, he was to
writing Seventh-day Adventist
00:17:19.30\00:17:22.33
having that possession.
00:17:22.36\00:17:23.64
Catholics--
00:17:23.67\00:17:24.70
Oh, he didn't agree
with that possession?
00:17:24.73\00:17:26.22
No, I don't believe he did.
00:17:26.25\00:17:28.12
So while, since
I've read the book.
00:17:28.15\00:17:29.66
Yeah, it's been about 20
years, since it was published.
00:17:29.69\00:17:32.97
Yeah, yeah, and that
book was a bombshell.
00:17:33.00\00:17:35.95
President Neal
Wilson said to me that
00:17:35.98\00:17:39.69
it was like "Great Controversy"
00:17:39.72\00:17:41.68
written by Ellen
White, from the other side.
00:17:41.71\00:17:45.52
Okay.
00:17:45.55\00:17:46.59
It was the inside
look, from the other side.
00:17:46.62\00:17:50.14
And what Malachi Martin said,
if he was to writing Adventist,
00:17:50.17\00:17:53.80
well we take
that as a compliment.
00:17:53.83\00:17:55.85
Well, I think it's
an accurate description.
00:17:55.88\00:17:58.13
Yes.
00:17:58.16\00:17:59.19
He said, we believe the law
00:17:59.22\00:18:01.36
should not sit
in judgment as to--
00:18:01.39\00:18:03.13
No, no, the right to be wrong.
00:18:03.16\00:18:06.07
If you go back to the
early days of reformation,
00:18:06.10\00:18:09.55
the Anabaptist those
who are baptizing grown up
00:18:09.58\00:18:12.50
people they
were being persecuted
00:18:12.53\00:18:15.27
and drowned by the
state, for their heresy.
00:18:15.30\00:18:18.09
They were.
00:18:18.12\00:18:19.15
And they said,
you know, they came up
00:18:19.18\00:18:20.99
with a notion that well, may be
the state shouldn't be solving
00:18:21.02\00:18:25.02
theological disputes over,
00:18:25.05\00:18:27.02
you know, when
to baptize people.
00:18:27.05\00:18:28.70
And this-- isn't this true
00:18:28.73\00:18:30.12
with the Supreme Court
pontificating on sexuality?
00:18:30.15\00:18:36.22
Well, I don't know
what the court is gonna do.
00:18:36.25\00:18:38.47
The Seventh-day Adventist church
00:18:38.50\00:18:40.16
urged the court to be
mindful of religious freedom
00:18:40.19\00:18:44.35
in its decision
of same sex marriage.
00:18:44.39\00:18:46.78
Yes.
00:18:46.81\00:18:47.84
Are we seeing intolerance
on the rise in America?
00:18:47.87\00:18:52.74
Well, I think
we're seeing intolerance
00:18:52.77\00:18:54.55
from both the
left and the right,
00:18:54.58\00:18:56.58
mutually they're
acted at one another.
00:18:56.61\00:18:58.47
They said, you
cease in the Pharisees.
00:18:58.50\00:19:00.39
So to speak, yes.
00:19:00.42\00:19:01.96
You know all about that.
00:19:01.99\00:19:03.20
You know, I know about that too.
00:19:03.23\00:19:04.34
Yeah.
00:19:04.37\00:19:05.40
The left wing
and the right wing,
00:19:05.43\00:19:06.76
in the movement of Judaism.
00:19:06.79\00:19:08.83
Right.
00:19:08.86\00:19:09.93
And we have it
today in North America.
00:19:09.96\00:19:12.01
But in the Christian
church it every where.
00:19:12.04\00:19:14.23
And let us say this,
atheists like to think
00:19:14.26\00:19:18.61
that they're
very tolerant people.
00:19:18.64\00:19:20.37
Some of the most
intolerable people
00:19:20.40\00:19:22.08
in the history of the
world have been atheists.
00:19:22.11\00:19:24.56
Look at Pol Pot,
look at Stalin and Lenin
00:19:24.59\00:19:28.72
and these unspeakable
monsters and their genocides.
00:19:28.76\00:19:33.49
Look, you know,
several years ago
00:19:33.52\00:19:36.41
there were court cases
about the phrase under God,
00:19:36.44\00:19:40.06
and the pledge of
allegiance whether that violated
00:19:40.09\00:19:42.63
the establishment cause
of the American constitution.
00:19:42.66\00:19:46.66
I think it's
incredibly important
00:19:46.69\00:19:50.30
that all elected officials,
all government officials
00:19:50.33\00:19:54.04
understand that they
answer to a higher power.
00:19:54.07\00:19:57.65
Yes, but most of them
00:19:57.68\00:19:58.75
don't seem to
realize this any longer.
00:19:58.78\00:20:00.91
They cannot exercise power
with impunity that regardless
00:20:00.94\00:20:05.90
of what they may get
away with here on earth
00:20:05.93\00:20:08.13
but there's a judgment day.
00:20:08.16\00:20:09.19
Absolutely.
00:20:09.22\00:20:10.25
And I think the
concept of being under God,
00:20:10.28\00:20:12.85
of exercising power,
on behalf of the people,
00:20:12.88\00:20:16.38
as steward of the people
and under the judgments of God
00:20:16.41\00:20:20.09
this is what can
preserve democracy.
00:20:20.12\00:20:23.07
The President of the United
States said very recently,
00:20:23.10\00:20:27.31
that the Christian
church has been in history,
00:20:27.34\00:20:30.88
a very intolerant organization.
00:20:30.91\00:20:35.44
That's a pretty
transparently obvious statement.
00:20:35.47\00:20:38.42
Yes, anybody who has read.
00:20:38.45\00:20:41.08
Yes, anybody who
knows anything at all.
00:20:41.11\00:20:44.04
He is right, but so have
the Muslims and the Hindus,
00:20:44.07\00:20:49.16
the Jews and the atheists.
00:20:49.19\00:20:52.09
And the reason is
Alan, it's because,
00:20:52.12\00:20:55.72
it's a part of that
fallen sinful human nature.
00:20:55.75\00:20:58.23
That's just
what I was gonna say,
00:20:58.26\00:20:59.74
it's a part of human nature.
00:20:59.77\00:21:02.57
And of course it was the context
00:21:02.60\00:21:04.46
that he was criticized
for because we're dealing
00:21:04.49\00:21:07.42
with a research
and militant Islam
00:21:07.45\00:21:11.26
that has been prosecuting a
people with different faith--
00:21:11.29\00:21:14.31
The Jews and Christians.
Christians, the Yazidis, Jews.
00:21:14.34\00:21:16.44
Yes, burning the churches.
00:21:16.47\00:21:19.60
And other Muslims,
burning mosques even.
00:21:19.63\00:21:22.97
We've been just terribly upset
00:21:23.00\00:21:27.08
by the images of the
Christians in Egypt--
00:21:27.11\00:21:29.25
Yeah, dreadful, dreadful.
00:21:29.28\00:21:30.65
Being kneeling and hooded
and being their heads cut-off.
00:21:30.68\00:21:35.12
It's horrible.
00:21:35.15\00:21:36.24
They certainly don't believe
00:21:36.27\00:21:37.44
in the right to
be wrong, do they?
00:21:37.47\00:21:39.33
No, they don't. No.
00:21:39.36\00:21:41.26
And that's ultimately a good
idea of where that leads us.
00:21:41.29\00:21:44.44
Yes, yes.
00:21:44.47\00:21:45.50
Intolerance ultimately
leads us to what ISIS is doing.
00:21:45.53\00:21:49.95
Which is a demonic organization.
00:21:49.98\00:21:52.92
The Muslims built a Mosque
near ground zero in New York.
00:21:52.95\00:21:58.88
And lots of
people were horrified.
00:21:58.91\00:22:03.67
Did these Muslims
have the right to build
00:22:03.70\00:22:08.30
a Mosque on American
soil in good old New York?"
00:22:08.33\00:22:14.03
You're asking a New Yorker
about what to do in New York.
00:22:14.06\00:22:17.53
I'm talking to a New Yorker,
00:22:17.56\00:22:18.77
I'm going to get a plain answer?
00:22:18.80\00:22:20.89
You know, they brought property.
00:22:20.92\00:22:23.36
And they had every right
to do with their property
00:22:23.39\00:22:27.35
whatever they wanted to do.
00:22:27.38\00:22:29.20
To tell them, that
you can do anything
00:22:29.23\00:22:31.39
but practice your
religion on your property,
00:22:31.42\00:22:35.30
how does that fit
with the American idea?
00:22:35.33\00:22:37.90
The biggest problem
with the ground zero Mosque,
00:22:37.93\00:22:40.77
John, is that it wasn't.
00:22:40.80\00:22:43.63
It was blocked several
blocks away from ground zero
00:22:43.66\00:22:46.39
and nobody whoever
went to ground zero
00:22:46.42\00:22:48.75
would ever have a clue
00:22:48.78\00:22:50.22
that there was
Mosque in the neighborhood.
00:22:50.25\00:22:51.63
Well there was a little bit--
00:22:51.66\00:22:52.69
It was all hype.
00:22:52.72\00:22:54.12
And a little bit of intolerance.
00:22:54.15\00:22:55.80
Of course. Good old
fashion intolerance.
00:22:55.83\00:22:58.37
It was several blocks away.
00:22:58.40\00:22:59.87
You know, anything that's
around the corner in New York,
00:22:59.90\00:23:01.82
you don't even know it's there.
00:23:01.85\00:23:03.24
No, of course not.
00:23:03.27\00:23:05.24
Now, it is true, is it
not my attorney friend,
00:23:05.27\00:23:10.42
that people today
in this land of freedom
00:23:10.45\00:23:13.40
and prosperity lose their jobs,
00:23:13.43\00:23:17.65
because of their
religious convictions
00:23:17.68\00:23:19.63
or else if they
had to lose their jobs
00:23:19.66\00:23:21.38
they don't even get a
chance of getting a job?
00:23:21.41\00:23:23.72
That is the bread
and butter of our work,
00:23:23.75\00:23:25.71
John, is representing people
00:23:25.74\00:23:27.27
who suffer religious
discrimination at work.
00:23:27.30\00:23:30.70
And-- Is it common?
00:23:30.73\00:23:32.04
Its all too common,
we're kept extremely busy
00:23:32.07\00:23:35.77
representing folks like this,
intervening with employers,
00:23:35.80\00:23:39.47
trying to help people keep jobs
00:23:39.50\00:23:41.39
and perhaps the biggest problem
00:23:41.42\00:23:43.99
is that job
applications ask about
00:23:44.02\00:23:46.53
are you available seven days?
00:23:46.56\00:23:47.92
Yes.
00:23:47.95\00:23:48.98
And people who are not available
00:23:49.01\00:23:51.30
because may be they say,
00:23:51.33\00:23:52.88
well, I go to church
every Sunday morning,
00:23:52.91\00:23:55.43
I'm not
available on Sunday morning
00:23:55.46\00:23:57.38
or I observe the
seventh-day Sabbath,
00:23:57.41\00:24:00.20
I'm not available
someday on Friday,
00:24:00.23\00:24:02.15
someday on Saturday
or may be I just attend
00:24:02.18\00:24:04.60
a prayer meeting or a
choir practice every week
00:24:04.63\00:24:06.87
and I'm not available Wednesday
evenings or Tuesday evenings.
00:24:06.90\00:24:10.41
They get screened out.
00:24:10.44\00:24:12.07
They don't even get
their foot in the door.
00:24:12.10\00:24:13.79
But we have a young man
who works for us, Alan De Leon.
00:24:13.82\00:24:16.79
He's a fine young fellow.
00:24:16.82\00:24:19.66
Let--
00:24:19.69\00:24:20.72
Named like Alan,
he must be. Pardon.
00:24:20.75\00:24:22.63
Named like Alan, he must be.
00:24:22.66\00:24:23.80
Oh you got to be all
right. He's got to be all right.
00:24:23.83\00:24:26.05
So, Alan was working
in a hotel in Pasadena.
00:24:26.08\00:24:30.54
And the time came
when the Sabbath issue
00:24:30.57\00:24:33.44
came along and he said I
can't violate my conscience,
00:24:33.47\00:24:37.18
and so they said,
fired, out the door.
00:24:37.21\00:24:41.02
But the good news
is, he has a better job
00:24:41.05\00:24:43.69
because now he's
working for the Carter Report.
00:24:43.72\00:24:46.71
Alan, tell me
what you'd do to defend
00:24:46.74\00:24:51.19
the religious
rights of minorities
00:24:51.22\00:24:53.99
who are losing their jobs
00:24:54.02\00:24:55.56
because of their
religious convictions?
00:24:55.59\00:24:58.77
You know, we're very proud John,
00:24:58.80\00:25:00.31
of the fact that we
represent people of all faiths.
00:25:00.34\00:25:03.20
That's right, I never knew that.
00:25:03.23\00:25:04.47
It's a Seventh-day
Adventist organization,
00:25:04.50\00:25:06.19
we have lots of Adventists
who suffer discrimination
00:25:06.22\00:25:09.10
because of Sabbath observance.
00:25:09.13\00:25:10.85
And that's how we got our start,
00:25:10.88\00:25:12.49
that's how we
got our experience.
00:25:12.52\00:25:14.29
But we've been
recognized as experts
00:25:14.32\00:25:16.91
in the field of
religious discrimination.
00:25:16.94\00:25:18.53
Yeah, that's terrific.
00:25:18.56\00:25:19.59
And we get
referrals for Muslim clients,
00:25:19.62\00:25:23.00
Mormons, Catholics,
Sunday keeping Christians,
00:25:23.03\00:25:26.89
Jews all kinds of issues
where people are suffering
00:25:26.92\00:25:31.67
discrimination
at the work place.
00:25:31.70\00:25:33.11
And so you go to court for them?
00:25:33.14\00:25:34.40
We do.
00:25:34.43\00:25:35.46
Who pays the
bills? If necessary.
00:25:35.49\00:25:36.53
Who pays the money?
00:25:36.56\00:25:37.59
The organization
is foots to build
00:25:37.62\00:25:39.07
and we provide our service.
00:25:39.10\00:25:40.13
That's the Adventist Church.
00:25:40.16\00:25:41.58
Yes, it is. So
we defend Mormons?
00:25:41.61\00:25:43.51
We do defend
people of any faith--
00:25:43.55\00:25:45.79
And Muslims?
00:25:45.82\00:25:46.85
Who suffer discrimination. Yes.
00:25:46.88\00:25:49.43
Because we believe,
in the right to be wrong.
00:25:49.46\00:25:52.30
We believe that
everyone has to stand before God
00:25:52.33\00:25:57.26
and give an
answer for themselves.
00:25:57.29\00:25:59.16
They don't answer to you, John,
and they don't answer to me.
00:25:59.19\00:26:02.25
Or to the General Conference.
00:26:02.28\00:26:04.00
They answer to God. Yes.
00:26:04.03\00:26:05.93
And so we're not responsible
for what they believe
00:26:05.96\00:26:08.83
but we are
responsible for how we live
00:26:08.86\00:26:10.96
the love of Jesus
Christ and live that love
00:26:10.99\00:26:13.91
and show that
love to every person.
00:26:13.95\00:26:16.22
This is another reason
why we like you so much, Alan.
00:26:16.25\00:26:18.93
Yeah.
00:26:18.96\00:26:19.99
Because you're
defending the rights of Mormons
00:26:20.02\00:26:22.17
and Jehovah's
Witnesses and Muslims
00:26:22.20\00:26:24.54
and everybody else.
00:26:24.57\00:26:25.91
How much success are you having?
00:26:25.94\00:26:28.53
the Lord is
good, and He, you know,
00:26:28.56\00:26:32.91
He steps in when we're weak
00:26:32.94\00:26:36.32
and He has blessed
our ministry tremendously.
00:26:36.35\00:26:38.02
But you're saving,
you're saving people
00:26:38.05\00:26:40.84
so they can keep
their jobs and get jobs?
00:26:40.87\00:26:44.35
Sometimes we help
people get their jobs back,
00:26:44.38\00:26:47.54
often times, it'll be some
kind of financial settlement
00:26:47.57\00:26:51.60
and they move on
with their lives.
00:26:51.63\00:26:53.41
But we're holding
companies to account,
00:26:53.44\00:26:55.58
and what we find
is that once companies
00:26:55.61\00:26:58.24
are being held to
account, at least some of them
00:26:58.27\00:26:59.94
get the message
and they do differently
00:26:59.97\00:27:03.07
in the future
and that's the goal.
00:27:03.10\00:27:05.17
This is the last question Alan,
its got to be a quick answer.
00:27:05.20\00:27:08.74
What should concern
Christians do to defend freedom?
00:27:08.77\00:27:13.12
Well, I think, first of
all you need to be informed,
00:27:13.15\00:27:16.44
pay attention to what's going on
00:27:16.47\00:27:18.34
and be prepared to get involved,
00:27:18.37\00:27:20.55
make your voice count
on the issues of the day.
00:27:20.58\00:27:24.52
Be prepared to
contact your Congressmen,
00:27:24.55\00:27:27.19
your state representatives,
find organizations
00:27:27.22\00:27:30.28
that you can support
that you can work with.
00:27:30.31\00:27:33.25
Stand up for the truth.
Thank you for joining us today.
00:27:33.28\00:27:36.47
This has been a great
program with Alan Reinach.
00:27:36.50\00:27:39.21
We hope you have enjoyed it.
00:27:39.24\00:27:41.01
Please write to me,
00:27:41.04\00:27:42.08
John Carter,
Post Office Box 1900,
00:27:42.11\00:27:44.69
you can see it on the screen.
00:27:44.72\00:27:46.15
Write to me in
Australia at Terrigal.
00:27:46.18\00:27:48.42
Write to Alan Reinach,
00:27:48.45\00:27:50.53
at the Pacific Union Conference,
00:27:50.56\00:27:52.65
where he is a defender
of the rights of all people,
00:27:52.68\00:27:56.59
Muslims, Jews, Gentiles,
Catholics, John Carters,
00:27:56.62\00:28:01.52
to defend the right of freedom.
00:28:01.55\00:28:04.81
So please write to him
00:28:04.84\00:28:06.29
and support him
and support us too
00:28:06.32\00:28:08.61
in the preaching of
Word of God around the world.
00:28:08.64\00:28:11.22
This is been great to
have you with us today, Alan.
00:28:11.25\00:28:14.55
Great to have you with us today.
00:28:14.58\00:28:16.20
Till next time,
thank you. God bless you.
00:28:16.23\00:28:19.09