From Arcadia, California,
the Carter Report presents
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"The Living
Word" around the world.
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Thank you for joining us today
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for "Creating Life
in the Laboratory. "
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My guest today
is Dr. Fazale Rana,
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who completed a
Ph. D in chemistry
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with an emphasis in
biochemistry at Ohio University,
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where he twice won the Donald
Clippinger Research Award.
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Postdoctoral studies took him
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to the Universities
of Virginia and Georgia.
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He then worked for seven years
as a senior research scientist
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for Procter and Gamble.
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He's interested in truths.
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Our scientists going to
discover life in the laboratory.
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And what are the implications
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for us as
Christians and for the world.
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Welcome today to
the Carter Report.
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Hello, I'm John Carter.
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I first came here in
1971, that's a long time ago.
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I've been back 39
times, more recently in 1991
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when we have the privilege
to under God of conducting
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the first ever
evangelistic campaign
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in the old Soviet Union.
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Since then we have
been preaching right around
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this great country,
Saint Petersburg, Moscow,
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As they call it Moskva,
Nizhny Novgorod, Dzerzhinsk.
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I could just go on and on.
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And we have seen
thousands and thousands of souls
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come to our knowledge
of the Lord Jesus Christ.
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I want to thank you today
for your magnificent support
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for standing with us in
tough times and in good times
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in the preaching of
Christ to the Russian people.
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My friend, it's not over yet.
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We're not giving up on Russia,
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because the needs
here are tremendous.
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Please pray for
the Russian people.
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And please in the name of Jesus,
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write to me, John
Carter PO Box 1900,
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Thousand Oaks, CA 91358.
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Let me give it to you again
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John Carter PO Box
1900, Thousand Oaks, CA 91358.
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For my friends in Australia
look at the screen right now,
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we're putting up our address,
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write to me and help us to keep
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the light burning as the sun
goes down in the land of Russia.
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Religious liberty will
soon be a thing of the past.
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Please write to me.
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Please pray for
us, pray for Russia.
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This is John Carter
saying to you from the Kremlin,
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thank you in Jesus
name and God bless you.
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Dr. Rana, welcome here today.
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Well, thank you for
having me Pastor Carter.
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We are delighted
to have you come here.
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We appreciate all
that you're doing.
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Our scientists really close to
creating life in the laboratory.
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What are some of
the implications?
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Sure, well.
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10 years ago
that would have been
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fodder for science fiction,
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but it really has
become science fact,
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it's a reality that's upon us.
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Our scientists are really close
to creating life in the lab.
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In fact, May of 2010,
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Craig Venter
generated a lot of attention
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by announcing a method
that he and his research
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collaborators developed,
so they can actually create
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a sweet of artificial
life forms in the lab.
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So this is a
reality that's upon us.
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This is new to me. Yeah, well.
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You know, most
people will probably say,
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"There is no way scientists are
gonna create life in the lab,
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it's just way to complex. "
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But the fact of the matter is
biochemists have been studying
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how life operates at
its fundamental level
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and have learned
enough about that
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that they're able
to apply that knowledge
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and really again are very close
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to being able to
create artificial life forms.
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When you're talking
about life in the laboratory,
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what sort of life is it?
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What are these
artificial life forms?
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Well, they basically
are like single cells,
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so nothing more complicated
than a single cell organism.
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But how complicated is
a single cell organism?
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Well, single cell organisms
are unbelievably complicated.
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The way to think about them is
it's like a city inside the cell
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where the molecules
are operating just like
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all the different types of
activities going on in a city.
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In fact, Craig Venter
who was one of the pioneers
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in trying to create life
in the lab has actually done
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some very good work
at trying to understand
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the minimum
complexity of life forms
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as part of the attempt
to create life in the lab.
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And he's determined
that you need to have about
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450 different genes
in order for an organism
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to even function
as a living entity.
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Now we're talking
about a single cell.
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Exactly.
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We're not talking about baby
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or a human being or a crocodile.
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Nothing like
that. We're talking-
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Yeah, exactly
just the single cells.
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So they're not making complex.
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They're not trying to
make complex life forms.
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No, nothing like
that at this point
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and any idea of doing
something like that is,
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you know, way
beyond the technology.
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So in a cell 400
genes, that's the minimum.
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Yeah, that's the
minimum that you need.
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And each gene
contains the information
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to make a protein
which is a large molecule
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that will carry out a specific
activity inside the cell.
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So minimal, you're gonna need
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about 450
different types of proteins
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that are gonna be
working in combination
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to carry out the
basic operations of life.
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How many molecules we're
talking about for a simple cell?
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You're looking at thousands
and thousands of molecules.
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Maybe millions.
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Perhaps, yeah, depending
on the type of molecule
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and the type of cell
that you're dealing with.
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So really it's quite
a job to try to do this,
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somewhat
adorning task, isn't that?
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Oh, yeah.
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This is not trivial
by any means and in fact,
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some of the best
scientists in the world today
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are working on, they attempts
to create life in the lab.
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Why are scientists so interested
in creating artificial life?
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And you know, this is
a bit of a stunner to me,
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because I thought they
were light years away from
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approaching the threshold of
creating life in the laboratory.
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We're not talking-
are we talking about
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a form of intelligent life?
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No, no, these are not,
this is not intelligent at all.
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But doesn't the cell seem
to have some intelligence?
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Well, the cell, I would
argue is intelligently designed.
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And it is an automated system
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in that it can
take care of itself,
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it operates according to,
you know, a set of machinery
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that will
automatically do everything
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that the cell needs to do.
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When you say automatically,
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what do we mean
by automatically?
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Well, for example the
cell has certain trigger points
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that will tell it
that it's time to divide,
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it's time to
duplicate the DNA molecules
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and then undergo
cell division process
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where they get partitioned
into the two daughter cells.
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And that during, after the
cell division is taking place,
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the cell entered
into a growth phase.
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And certain, the
machines will be turned on,
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other machines
will be turned off,
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the cells can respond to
stimuli in the environment
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or the nutrients in
this particular location,
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it will move in that direction,
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towards the nutrients will
move away from toxic materials.
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And this is all
again done automatically,
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but in order for
that type of operation
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or sets of
operations to take place,
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there's got to be an
overarching intelligence
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that has in a sense
designed and programmed
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that machinery to
operate in such a way.
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I find these are
incredibly amazing.
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I read somewhere, I
think I may have read it
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in one of your books,
you said cell is like a city.
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And they got little
factories and power supply
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and garbage disposal systems.
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Exactly, yes. Exactly.
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Yeah, so in the operations that
are going on inside the cell,
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you know, you have a
membrane or a boundary
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that separates the
inside from the outside.
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And that boundary is a
very sophisticated machine
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in and of itself
that has proteins
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that are letting material in,
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sending material out
into the environment,
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responding to
signals in the environment
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that will then
turned on and turned off,
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other
operations inside the cell.
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Now you've actually seen
this, haven't you working.
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Yes. You can see this today.
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You can depict it, yeah.
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In fact, many of the
proteins that we're taking about
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literally are
machines themselves
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that bare a startling
similarity to manmade machine.
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So you have machines that
have lever arms and hinges
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and routers and bushings
and all these good stuff.
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Now this is true that
it have little lever arms.
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Sure. And hinges.
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And hinges and you
know, routers and stators
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and bushings and drive shafts.
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Bushings. Yes.
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And shafts. Yeah.
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So in fact, these
machines are virtually identical
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to the types of
machines that we would build.
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In fact, they're-
though they're identical
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they're most sophisticated
in terms of their operation,
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they're more efficient
than anything we can produce.
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So if you saw a machine
laying on the side of the road,
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you immediately would
conclude that there had to be
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an engineer there and mechanics
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that designed and
build that machine.
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And when you see those
same machines inside the cell
00:10:00.48\00:10:04.08
that to me is
evidence that there is a mind
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that has build those
machines if they're alive.
00:10:06.50\00:10:08.82
Now you are a scientist.
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Yes. I'm a pastor.
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What do I know about science?
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Only what I read in a few books
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that I've read
down through the years.
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You say they are little machines
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and they're
intricate and they're complex
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and they're doing
special tasks. Yes.
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Not how big- how
tiny are these machines
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that you're talking about?
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Well, they're on the- the
order of nanometers in size.
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So a nanometer would be
1 billionth of the meter
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or you could think about it
roughly 1 billionth of a yard.
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Yeah. So these
are incredibly tiny.
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A billionth? A billionth, yeah.
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These are
incredibly tiny systems.
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You couldn't-
can't see these things.
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No, you have to essentially
piece their structure
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together through a
number of different techniques,
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Electron Microscopy
and X-ray Diffraction
00:10:57.70\00:11:00.22
and things like that.
00:11:00.25\00:11:01.92
So you lost me already.
00:11:01.95\00:11:03.55
I read somewhere
where scientists are working
00:11:03.59\00:11:06.95
on making these
little tiny machines
00:11:06.98\00:11:09.40
and popping them
into your bloodstream.
00:11:09.44\00:11:11.83
Yeah, that's right. Yeah.
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Yeah, so that's part of
what's called Nanoscience
00:11:13.32\00:11:16.20
and Nanotechnology in the idea-
00:11:16.23\00:11:18.96
And these little things will
go around in your bloodstream
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and fix up broken
parts or stuff like this.
00:11:21.96\00:11:24.75
That's the idea- I
mean, they're still away
00:11:24.79\00:11:27.55
from accomplishing those goals.
00:11:27.58\00:11:28.95
You think, it's
gonna happen one day.
00:11:28.98\00:11:30.51
Yes, I do.
00:11:30.54\00:11:31.93
And again it's
because for two reasons
00:11:31.97\00:11:34.81
one is we are
learning more and more
00:11:34.85\00:11:37.62
about how life
operates at a fundamental level.
00:11:37.66\00:11:40.74
And we're
developing more and more
00:11:40.77\00:11:42.20
sophisticated techniques
to manipulate these molecules.
00:11:42.24\00:11:45.67
And that's opening up distance
00:11:45.70\00:11:47.78
in terms of
research and development
00:11:47.82\00:11:49.33
that we just could only have
dreamed off even 10 years ago.
00:11:49.37\00:11:53.69
The rate of
progress is incredible.
00:11:53.72\00:11:56.18
Here's a cell which
is incredibly complex.
00:11:56.22\00:12:01.80
Work by incredibly
tiny efficient machines.
00:12:01.83\00:12:07.38
Little trucks running around,
00:12:07.41\00:12:09.14
little
generators, little engines,
00:12:09.18\00:12:12.27
all of the stuff,
disposal systems, power plants.
00:12:12.31\00:12:16.73
I'm sort of quoting
one of your books I think.
00:12:16.76\00:12:21.15
That's why I'm
proficient in this part
00:12:21.18\00:12:22.99
of my presentation here today.
00:12:23.02\00:12:27.35
But why are scientists so keen,
00:12:27.39\00:12:31.65
I mean almost driven
with an evangelistic zeal
00:12:31.69\00:12:35.67
to create life
in the laboratory?
00:12:35.70\00:12:38.20
Well, there's two reasons,
00:12:38.23\00:12:40.34
it's easy to
think about scientist
00:12:40.38\00:12:42.75
that's trying to
usurp God's place.
00:12:42.79\00:12:45.09
But that really isn't
their motivation, part of it is-
00:12:45.13\00:12:48.01
They don't think so.
00:12:48.04\00:12:49.41
No. Not exclusively there are-
00:12:49.44\00:12:51.66
What about Richard Dawkins?
00:12:51.69\00:12:53.88
Richard Dawkins
is a different story.
00:12:53.92\00:12:56.34
But the average
scientist at the bench,
00:12:56.38\00:12:58.73
is doing this type of
work for-I think noble reasons.
00:12:58.77\00:13:02.51
Maybe at points
somewhat misguided
00:13:02.54\00:13:05.26
but still noble reasons.
00:13:05.29\00:13:07.52
First of all, if the ideas that
if we can make life in the lab
00:13:07.56\00:13:11.30
that means we have a better
understanding of it than before,
00:13:11.33\00:13:14.98
because to make something you
really need to understand it.
00:13:15.01\00:13:18.63
But also they look at
this as a huge opportunity
00:13:18.66\00:13:21.95
to really benefit humanity
for example Craig Venter
00:13:21.98\00:13:25.20
who we mentioned wants to create
artificial life forms bacteria
00:13:25.24\00:13:29.94
that will generate hydrogen gas
00:13:29.97\00:13:32.06
that could be used as
an alternative fuel source.
00:13:32.10\00:13:35.16
There are some scientists
who are trying to modify
00:13:35.19\00:13:38.65
bacteria to make
biodiesel at very high levels.
00:13:38.68\00:13:41.48
Some scientists are
trying to create bacteria
00:13:41.51\00:13:44.24
that will produce cancer drugs
that are very difficult to make,
00:13:44.28\00:13:48.60
in fact, in some
cases impossible to make.
00:13:48.63\00:13:51.13
They discovered
these compounds in nature,
00:13:51.16\00:13:53.59
but they can't really
replicate their structure
00:13:53.63\00:13:57.24
through chemical synthesis
00:13:57.27\00:13:58.64
so they're trying to
rely on living organisms
00:13:58.67\00:14:00.81
to make these compounds.
00:14:00.84\00:14:02.26
And is it not true
also that they're trying
00:14:02.30\00:14:06.47
to make a substance
that will generate power,
00:14:06.50\00:14:09.67
that can maybe take
the place of petroleum.
00:14:09.71\00:14:12.58
Bacteria and all of
the stuff. Yes, exactly.
00:14:12.62\00:14:15.40
So that would be the
quest to make bacteria
00:14:15.44\00:14:18.19
that produce biodiesel. Yeah.
00:14:18.22\00:14:21.02
And so-and there are
some success towards that end.
00:14:21.06\00:14:24.29
So this is really
exciting in many respects
00:14:24.32\00:14:26.76
because this is technology
00:14:26.79\00:14:28.51
that I think it can
revolutionize our world
00:14:28.55\00:14:31.00
and do it in a positive way.
00:14:31.03\00:14:32.77
It's not all
anti-God by any means.
00:14:32.81\00:14:34.72
No. No.
00:14:34.75\00:14:36.12
It's a desire to
benefit the human race
00:14:36.15\00:14:38.45
and to solve the
problem where did man come from.
00:14:38.49\00:14:45.61
How are scientists are trying
00:14:45.64\00:14:47.98
to create life
in the laboratory?
00:14:48.01\00:14:50.32
What steps are they taking?
00:14:50.35\00:14:51.72
Well, there's two different
strategies that you see
00:14:51.75\00:14:54.16
one is called the
top down approach.
00:14:54.19\00:14:56.49
And this is the
idea, where you'll take
00:14:56.53\00:14:58.76
a existing bacteria and
you try to reengineer it.
00:14:58.80\00:15:02.25
And to such an
extent that it's no longer
00:15:02.28\00:15:04.56
recognizable as a
natural life form.
00:15:04.59\00:15:09.02
And so you might add a
whole host of different genes
00:15:09.06\00:15:12.57
that give it a completely
novel metabolic capability
00:15:12.61\00:15:16.09
that bacteria nature don't have.
00:15:16.12\00:15:19.75
So for example
bacteria may not naturally
00:15:19.79\00:15:22.86
produce an anticancer compound.
00:15:22.89\00:15:25.74
But if you can piece
together a metabolic pathway
00:15:25.78\00:15:29.37
by adding the right genes from
a number of different organisms
00:15:29.41\00:15:32.97
and doing some modifications,
00:15:33.00\00:15:34.51
you might be
able to get a bacteria
00:15:34.55\00:15:36.57
that can make an
anticancer compound.
00:15:36.60\00:15:38.73
But that's not
creating life, is it?
00:15:38.77\00:15:40.87
No, it's really modifying life.
00:15:40.90\00:15:43.03
But still they claim that
you'll see from scientists
00:15:43.07\00:15:45.50
is that we created
an artificial life form.
00:15:45.53\00:15:47.84
So it's very
important I think for Christians
00:15:47.87\00:15:50.15
to understand what's meant
00:15:50.18\00:15:52.51
when scientist say we're
creating artificial life.
00:15:52.55\00:15:55.34
True it's
artificial in the sense
00:15:55.37\00:15:57.47
that it's been
manipulated by humans
00:15:57.51\00:15:59.54
that it's not natural,
it's not found in nature.
00:15:59.58\00:16:03.06
But they really
are reengineering life
00:16:03.09\00:16:05.57
using existing
parts that are found
00:16:05.61\00:16:07.72
in a whole host
of living organisms.
00:16:07.75\00:16:09.79
Nobody is starting from
complete scratch at this point
00:16:09.83\00:16:13.36
and making life
that's completely different
00:16:13.39\00:16:15.91
than anything
that we're aware of.
00:16:15.94\00:16:18.21
Well, you know,
in my humble opinion
00:16:18.24\00:16:20.44
I wouldn't see that
as a creation of life,
00:16:20.48\00:16:22.89
it is simply taking
something that has life in it
00:16:22.93\00:16:25.76
and adding to it or
some attracting from it.
00:16:25.79\00:16:28.58
Right. But now you say-
00:16:28.61\00:16:29.98
That's a valid
way to think about it.
00:16:30.01\00:16:32.90
You say, this was the
approach from the top down.
00:16:32.94\00:16:35.18
Yes. What's the other approach?
00:16:35.21\00:16:36.58
The other
approach is the bottom up.
00:16:36.61\00:16:38.36
And the top down
approach is where you're seeing
00:16:38.40\00:16:41.21
the most advances in the
greatest amount of success.
00:16:41.25\00:16:44.16
But the bottom up is
the idea of going in the lab
00:16:44.20\00:16:47.08
and starting with
very simple chemicals
00:16:47.11\00:16:49.40
and trying to
literally build life
00:16:49.43\00:16:51.91
piece by, piece by piece.
00:16:51.94\00:16:53.57
Taking those smaller molecules,
00:16:53.61\00:16:55.10
making larger
more complex molecules,
00:16:55.14\00:16:57.60
and capitulating
them within a membrane,
00:16:57.64\00:17:00.03
getting that whole
system to grow and divide.
00:17:00.07\00:17:02.68
And so what you're saying
doctor is that what they do,
00:17:02.72\00:17:06.88
what they're
trying to do is take-
00:17:06.91\00:17:09.83
that which is not living. Yes.
00:17:09.86\00:17:12.23
Atoms, which are not alive. Yes.
00:17:12.26\00:17:14.56
And making them into molecules
and trying to make these things
00:17:14.60\00:17:19.80
or actually living
substances, is this the theory?
00:17:19.83\00:17:24.14
Yeah, that's the idea that's-
00:17:24.17\00:17:26.36
and there are
some research teams
00:17:26.40\00:17:28.52
that are doing some
quite remarkable things
00:17:28.56\00:17:30.92
that I would think that approach
00:17:30.95\00:17:33.10
within the next decade may
actually realize some success.
00:17:33.14\00:17:36.99
What are they doing
in these laboratories?
00:17:37.02\00:17:41.13
When you say they're
doing some remarkable things.
00:17:41.17\00:17:44.58
Well, for example they're
trying to identify compounds
00:17:44.61\00:17:47.99
that would function like DNA.
00:17:48.02\00:17:49.96
DNA is a very large molecule
00:17:49.99\00:17:51.86
that harbors the
information needed
00:17:51.90\00:17:54.22
for the entire cell to operate.
00:17:54.26\00:17:56.51
So they're trying to
develop alternatives to DNA
00:17:56.55\00:17:59.92
that would be large molecules
00:17:59.95\00:18:01.65
that could harbor information
00:18:01.68\00:18:03.31
that can undergo a
replication process
00:18:03.35\00:18:06.05
to produce daughter molecules.
00:18:06.08\00:18:07.85
Now most of my
friends, who're watching
00:18:07.89\00:18:10.35
this television
program, if they like me,
00:18:10.39\00:18:12.82
would say how does this work?
00:18:12.85\00:18:16.53
You know, this is-this
is somewhat over our heads.
00:18:16.57\00:18:20.36
How do scientists in a
laboratory, in the lab,
00:18:20.40\00:18:24.41
how do they stick
together atoms and molecules,
00:18:24.44\00:18:28.43
so that those things
will be able to reproduce
00:18:28.46\00:18:32.42
or harbor information like DNA?
00:18:32.45\00:18:35.36
And how they're
trying to do this?
00:18:35.40\00:18:38.31
Well, and this is where I think
00:18:38.34\00:18:40.79
the greatest
amount of excitement
00:18:40.83\00:18:43.19
is in stored
for us as Christians
00:18:43.23\00:18:45.52
when we think
about this type of work.
00:18:45.56\00:18:48.26
Because these are
not trivial enterprises
00:18:48.29\00:18:50.92
where the scientists are
rolling out a bed in the morning
00:18:50.96\00:18:53.88
and just throwing some
chemicals into a test tube
00:18:53.91\00:18:57.18
and shaking it up and out pops,
00:18:57.21\00:18:59.17
an interesting molecule or
maybe even a complex system
00:18:59.21\00:19:02.71
that's starting
to look like life.
00:19:02.74\00:19:04.59
They are sitting
down and developing
00:19:04.63\00:19:06.62
incredibly elaborate strategies.
00:19:06.66\00:19:08.58
How do they do this
physically? How do you do this?
00:19:08.62\00:19:11.36
It's mostly done in
your mind believe it or not.
00:19:11.39\00:19:14.06
It's developing the strategy
based on decades and decades
00:19:14.10\00:19:17.89
of research and understanding
00:19:17.92\00:19:19.41
about how the
molecules are working.
00:19:19.45\00:19:21.79
And then when that
strategies in place,
00:19:21.83\00:19:24.10
some of the brightest and most
capable scientists in the world
00:19:24.14\00:19:27.34
are in the lab doing
extremely careful manipulations,
00:19:27.37\00:19:30.86
controlling the
conditions in the lab.
00:19:30.89\00:19:32.38
How do they manipulate them?
00:19:32.41\00:19:34.23
I mean, I can
manipulate my glasses.
00:19:34.27\00:19:37.86
And these sheets of paper
and I can lift up the Bible.
00:19:37.90\00:19:41.46
How do you manipulate
something you can't even see?
00:19:41.49\00:19:45.02
Well, it's- you know,
00:19:45.05\00:19:46.42
you're adding
chemicals into test tubes.
00:19:46.45\00:19:48.46
You're adding them
in the right amounts,
00:19:48.49\00:19:50.81
in the right proportions.
00:19:50.84\00:19:52.41
You're
controlling the conditions.
00:19:52.45\00:19:54.37
You're stopping the
reaction at the right time
00:19:54.41\00:19:58.23
so it's basically chemical
manipulations in the lab,
00:19:58.27\00:20:02.06
but it's under very
carefully controlled
00:20:02.09\00:20:04.62
highly pristine conditions
00:20:04.65\00:20:08.20
that you're doing
the manipulations.
00:20:08.24\00:20:10.52
So it's done at
a test tube level,
00:20:10.56\00:20:12.77
but there is
enough understanding as to
00:20:12.81\00:20:15.27
how the molecules
interact that you are able to-
00:20:15.31\00:20:18.39
through the strategy control
00:20:18.42\00:20:20.29
what they're doing in such way
00:20:20.32\00:20:22.12
that out pops
more complex molecules
00:20:22.16\00:20:24.70
that might have
interesting properties.
00:20:24.74\00:20:27.21
But it's literally teams
of hundreds of scientists
00:20:27.25\00:20:31.25
at times that are engage
in these types of activities
00:20:31.29\00:20:35.26
that are producing
even the initial steps
00:20:35.29\00:20:38.04
towards life in the lab.
00:20:38.07\00:20:39.44
This is a new
frontier, isn't it?
00:20:39.47\00:20:41.34
It's a brand new frontier,
00:20:41.37\00:20:43.91
but you know, what's
exciting to me about this
00:20:43.95\00:20:48.19
is the ingenuity that's
required in order to bring
00:20:48.23\00:20:52.40
about this accomplishment,
the strategy that's involved.
00:20:52.44\00:20:55.91
As a scientist when I look
at what's being accomplished
00:20:55.95\00:20:59.39
and I look at how
clever the approach is,
00:20:59.42\00:21:01.98
I just sit back and I marvel
00:21:02.01\00:21:03.87
what these scientists
have been able to accomplish.
00:21:03.91\00:21:06.85
And in a sense what
they're demonstrating
00:21:06.88\00:21:09.89
is that apart from
an intelligent agents,
00:21:09.93\00:21:12.71
in fact a room full
of intelligent agents
00:21:12.75\00:21:15.46
it's impossible even to approach
creating life in the lab.
00:21:15.50\00:21:19.51
So it's a powerful argument
that what we see in nature
00:21:19.54\00:21:23.52
must be the work of
an intelligent agent.
00:21:23.55\00:21:25.71
Because there's no
way something like that-
00:21:25.75\00:21:27.99
we know now there's
no way that something
00:21:28.03\00:21:30.24
like what we seen in nature
00:21:30.27\00:21:31.64
could ever come into
existence all on its own,
00:21:31.67\00:21:34.59
given how hard
it is for scientists
00:21:34.62\00:21:36.60
to generate these
crude artificial life forms.
00:21:36.64\00:21:41.85
Fuz, hopefully we have folks
watching this telecast today,
00:21:41.89\00:21:47.55
who maybe are struggling with
the issues of believing God.
00:21:47.59\00:21:53.22
Maybe, they're
university students
00:21:53.25\00:21:55.18
and they have been bombarded
with facts and information.
00:21:55.22\00:21:58.26
And they've been
told there is no God.
00:21:58.29\00:22:02.46
What you're saying is this
that these intelligent people
00:22:02.50\00:22:06.64
who are doing
these great experiments,
00:22:06.67\00:22:09.49
they're not just
throwing stuff at random
00:22:09.52\00:22:11.90
but they're doing
this with intelligence,
00:22:11.93\00:22:14.24
with great care, great
concern, great control.
00:22:14.28\00:22:18.93
And this in
itself is an argument
00:22:18.96\00:22:21.19
for an intelligent being,
who started the human race.
00:22:21.23\00:22:25.09
Yeah, that's
exactly the argument.
00:22:25.12\00:22:28.15
And again, you know,
the amount of expertise
00:22:28.19\00:22:33.34
that's required
to pull this off,
00:22:33.37\00:22:35.58
the work force that's required.
00:22:35.61\00:22:37.72
They're utilizing instruments
00:22:37.75\00:22:39.79
that are million
dollar instruments.
00:22:39.83\00:22:41.76
Some of them are
unique instruments,
00:22:41.80\00:22:43.66
that these
researchers have spend decades
00:22:43.70\00:22:45.78
building just simply to aid
00:22:45.81\00:22:47.68
in this process of
creating life in the lab.
00:22:47.72\00:22:51.03
And they're standing on
the shoulders of generation
00:22:51.07\00:22:53.16
after generation after
generation of scientists
00:22:53.20\00:22:55.26
who've come before them.
00:22:55.29\00:22:56.66
Yeah, of
intelligent life forms. Yes.
00:22:56.69\00:22:58.58
And so we can look at the cell
00:22:58.61\00:23:00.64
and we can say this cell
sure appears to be design to me,
00:23:00.68\00:23:03.75
it has all these characteristics
00:23:03.78\00:23:05.50
that I think reflect
the work of a designer.
00:23:05.54\00:23:08.61
Someone like Richard
Dawkins can come along and say,
00:23:08.65\00:23:10.97
no, evolution
produce that design.
00:23:11.00\00:23:12.79
So in a sense, it's a toss up,
00:23:12.83\00:23:14.55
it's question of
what do you prefer
00:23:14.59\00:23:17.02
as the
explanation to some extent.
00:23:17.05\00:23:19.55
But we now have
people in the lab
00:23:19.58\00:23:22.01
trying to create life in cells
that to me is the tiebreaker.
00:23:22.05\00:23:27.19
Life appears to be designed
00:23:27.22\00:23:28.88
and to bring life about requires
again the incredible effort
00:23:28.92\00:23:33.69
on the part of
intelligent agents
00:23:33.72\00:23:35.31
to bring it into existence.
00:23:35.34\00:23:37.06
So to me that is
a powerful argument
00:23:37.10\00:23:39.38
that God must be
necessary for life.
00:23:39.42\00:23:41.50
It sort of
overwhelms me that people
00:23:41.54\00:23:43.55
could think all of
these just happen by itself.
00:23:43.59\00:23:47.69
A friend of mine said that,
00:23:47.72\00:23:49.09
"If life started with a zero
and if life ends with a zero
00:23:49.12\00:23:52.81
and everything
in between is a zero
00:23:52.84\00:23:55.28
and there's nothing
right, there's nothing wrong,
00:23:55.32\00:23:57.62
there's nothing good and
there's nothing beautiful.
00:23:57.66\00:23:59.93
There's nothing.
No such thing as love
00:23:59.96\00:24:02.33
and we might as
well live like barbarians
00:24:02.36\00:24:04.66
because we've come from nothing
and we're going to nothing.
00:24:04.70\00:24:10.63
You refer to Richard
Dawkins, did you see the DVD,
00:24:10.66\00:24:15.27
the movie produce by, I think
it was Ben Stein, isn't it?
00:24:15.31\00:24:19.74
Ben Stein, he's
a Jewish comedian.
00:24:19.77\00:24:23.89
And he's
interviewing Dr. Dawkins. Yes.
00:24:23.93\00:24:26.62
I thought this was
absolutely wonderful
00:24:26.66\00:24:29.32
because he said to Dr. Dawkins.
00:24:29.35\00:24:31.96
"Now you don't believe in
intelligent design, do you?"
00:24:32.00\00:24:34.23
Dr. Dawkins said, "No, no.
00:24:34.26\00:24:36.60
Now these Christian
people who believe this,
00:24:36.64\00:24:39.97
you know, they're
somewhat ignorant.
00:24:40.00\00:24:42.94
No, no, no intelligent person
00:24:42.97\00:24:44.65
would believe in
intelligent design. " Oh.
00:24:44.69\00:24:49.78
He said, "Do you think
that life just happen by itself?
00:24:49.82\00:24:52.97
What he said, no, no.
00:24:53.00\00:24:55.24
Remember what he said.
00:24:55.28\00:24:57.45
He said, well- actually he said,
00:24:57.49\00:25:00.49
"I do believe in
intelligent design.
00:25:00.52\00:25:03.45
The man who has written
books against it and railed
00:25:03.49\00:25:06.09
against the concept that
there is a creator God. "
00:25:06.12\00:25:08.69
He said, "When
you look at the cell
00:25:08.72\00:25:12.25
and other bits of nature,
00:25:12.28\00:25:14.38
it seems as though
it has been designed. "
00:25:14.42\00:25:17.85
But he said it
wasn't designed by God.
00:25:17.88\00:25:21.24
It was obviously designed
by an intelligent superior race
00:25:21.28\00:25:26.62
somewhere out
there in the universe
00:25:26.65\00:25:29.28
and it was
transported to this earth.
00:25:29.31\00:25:31.87
And he said, we're the product
of this intelligent race.
00:25:31.91\00:25:36.25
Ben Stein said to
him, but of course
00:25:36.28\00:25:38.27
an intelligent being
couldn't be God, could it?
00:25:38.31\00:25:40.97
He said, no of course
not, it couldn't be God.
00:25:41.00\00:25:43.59
But he said it had to come
from an intelligent source.
00:25:43.63\00:25:47.32
And so what you're
telling me today is of the-
00:25:47.35\00:25:51.80
the very process of scientists
00:25:51.83\00:25:53.94
are following to
make life intelligent,
00:25:53.98\00:25:57.39
no, not intelligent life
but artificial life in itself
00:25:57.43\00:26:01.87
is a proof that life has
to be intelligently created.
00:26:01.90\00:26:06.31
I think so.
00:26:06.34\00:26:07.71
And people like Richard Dawkins,
who don't believe in God.
00:26:07.74\00:26:13.26
will agree that when you look at
00:26:13.29\00:26:15.00
biochemical systems
as you've mentioned,
00:26:15.04\00:26:17.05
when you look at living systems
00:26:17.08\00:26:18.53
that they really do appear
to be designed in his book,
00:26:18.57\00:26:22.00
I believe its
The Blind Watchmaker.
00:26:22.03\00:26:24.14
Dawkins says
biology is the study
00:26:24.17\00:26:26.21
of complicated things
that give the appearance
00:26:26.25\00:26:28.54
of having been
designed for a purpose.
00:26:28.57\00:26:31.19
So everybody recognizes
00:26:31.22\00:26:32.79
that these systems
appeared to be designed.
00:26:32.83\00:26:35.73
The question is, is
that designer evolution?
00:26:35.77\00:26:38.60
Is it an alien intelligence
or is it the God of the Bible.
00:26:38.64\00:26:42.29
And I think it's just
as reasonable to conclude,
00:26:42.32\00:26:44.77
it's the God of the Bible than
any of those other two options.
00:26:44.81\00:26:49.21
And I think many
times the resistance
00:26:49.24\00:26:51.80
to drawing the
conclusion that it's a creator
00:26:51.84\00:26:54.65
that brought life into being
is not the scientific evidence
00:26:54.69\00:27:00.25
but it's rather a
philosophical objection
00:27:00.28\00:27:02.69
or maybe even a rebellious
spirit against the Creator
00:27:02.73\00:27:07.51
because as soon as you
acknowledge that a Creator exist
00:27:07.55\00:27:12.30
there're very
important questions that follow.
00:27:12.33\00:27:14.53
Who is that creator and how
do I relate to that Creator?
00:27:14.57\00:27:17.26
Do I have
responsibility to that creator?
00:27:17.29\00:27:20.18
So I think that many
times people use science
00:27:20.22\00:27:23.08
as an excuse not
to follow the evidence
00:27:23.11\00:27:27.18
where it naturally leads.
00:27:27.21\00:27:29.12
I'm talking to Dr. Rana.
00:27:29.16\00:27:31.00
The topic is "Creating
Life in the Laboratory. "
00:27:31.04\00:27:36.01
Be with us, stay with us.
00:27:36.04\00:27:37.86
We'll be back in
just a minute or two
00:27:37.90\00:27:41.32
after this important message.
00:27:41.35\00:27:45.33
Hello, friend.
00:27:45.36\00:27:46.73
I'm John Carter with a very
special message just for you.
00:27:46.76\00:27:51.01
I believe that God
has called you and me
00:27:51.04\00:27:53.95
to tell the world
about the Lord Jesus Christ.
00:27:53.99\00:27:57.85
You know friend, when I turn
in my Bible to Revelation 14,
00:27:57.89\00:28:03.04
I read there of a worldwide
proclamation of the gospel
00:28:03.07\00:28:08.19
in the setting of
some very amazing truths.
00:28:08.22\00:28:10.97
And that is why the
Carter Report, right now
00:28:11.01\00:28:13.80
is working in
China, isn't that amazing?
00:28:13.83\00:28:17.24
Also in India, we're
telecasting in India.
00:28:17.28\00:28:20.36
And very shortly
we're going to Africa.
00:28:20.40\00:28:23.45
And when we go to Africa,
00:28:23.48\00:28:25.10
the message of Christ
is going to be telecast
00:28:25.14\00:28:28.02
right across
that great continent
00:28:28.05\00:28:30.28
and millions of people are
going to have an opportunity
00:28:30.32\00:28:34.04
to come to the
knowledge of Christ.
00:28:34.07\00:28:36.76
I'm asking today for your
help and your partnership.
00:28:36.80\00:28:42.51
I want you to
write to me, please.
00:28:42.54\00:28:44.69
And I want you to support us
in this worldwide evangelism.
00:28:44.73\00:28:50.56
And when you do so
00:28:50.59\00:28:52.63
I want to send you
two DVDs, two DVDs.
00:28:52.67\00:28:59.57
One is about how to survive
the coming financial meltdown.
00:28:59.61\00:29:05.08
And the second one is
about the health crisis
00:29:05.11\00:29:08.36
that is just about
blowing America apart
00:29:08.39\00:29:11.41
but it concerns my
friends also in Australia.
00:29:11.45\00:29:15.91
So please support
us in this great work
00:29:15.94\00:29:18.68
and when you support us,
I'll send you these two DVDs.
00:29:18.72\00:29:24.04
Write to me, John
Carter PO Box 1900,
00:29:24.07\00:29:27.22
Thousand Oaks, CA 91358,
00:29:27.25\00:29:30.36
in Australia
write to me at Terrigal.
00:29:30.40\00:29:33.92
Support us in this
great outreach to the world.
00:29:33.96\00:29:38.65
Let Christ be known and
may God richly bless you.
00:29:38.69\00:29:43.35
Write to me please today.
00:29:43.38\00:29:45.66
Welcome back my dear friend.
00:29:49.09\00:29:51.33
My guest today is Dr. Rana,
00:29:51.36\00:29:53.53
who is a biochemist,
famous around the world.
00:29:53.57\00:29:56.32
We're so glad that
you're with us, Dr. Rana.
00:29:56.36\00:29:58.92
It's a pleasure to
be here Pastor Carter.
00:29:58.96\00:30:01.49
We appreciate what you're doing.
00:30:01.52\00:30:02.99
We appreciate
what you're saying.
00:30:03.02\00:30:04.42
Now we're talking
today about making life,
00:30:04.46\00:30:07.57
artificial life in the lab.
00:30:07.60\00:30:10.12
Maybe from taking life forms
00:30:10.15\00:30:12.60
and manipulating
those life forms,
00:30:12.64\00:30:14.86
but there is even a science
now that is trying desperately
00:30:14.90\00:30:18.37
to take atoms, chemicals,
work them and those things
00:30:18.40\00:30:22.39
are dead and work
those things together.
00:30:22.42\00:30:24.74
They haven't done
this yet by any means.
00:30:24.78\00:30:27.03
But work those things
together so they can say
00:30:27.07\00:30:30.74
"Wacko look at this.
00:30:30.77\00:30:32.14
We have actually created
something which is living. "
00:30:32.17\00:30:36.00
But the message
I'm getting from you,
00:30:36.03\00:30:38.64
whatever they're doing.
00:30:38.67\00:30:41.14
You've got intelligent
beings, who are doing this.
00:30:41.18\00:30:44.90
That's exactly right. Yes.
00:30:44.93\00:30:47.48
Not just happening by
itself. That's exactly right.
00:30:47.52\00:30:50.16
And so even though
some people might think
00:30:50.19\00:30:53.21
that this type of
research is replacing God
00:30:53.25\00:30:56.24
or making God unnecessary.
00:30:56.27\00:30:58.48
The irony is that it's
actually demonstrating,
00:30:58.52\00:31:01.09
I think
empirically, unequivocally
00:31:01.12\00:31:04.16
that if you don't have
intelligent agency involve,
00:31:04.20\00:31:07.34
life can't come from non-life
00:31:07.37\00:31:09.78
and that as a Christian
is very exciting to me.
00:31:09.82\00:31:14.41
Atheist tell us, you
know, that we're product of time
00:31:14.45\00:31:18.61
plus matter plus chance
00:31:18.64\00:31:21.69
and everything
just happen by itself,
00:31:21.73\00:31:24.01
no intelligence
there, no God there.
00:31:24.05\00:31:26.26
But we're talking
actually about super brains,
00:31:26.30\00:31:29.89
human brains working together.
00:31:29.92\00:31:31.90
As you said, standing on the
shoulders of great scientists
00:31:31.94\00:31:35.46
that go back to
Newton and further back
00:31:35.49\00:31:38.58
and they're manipulating with
incredibly complex machines,
00:31:38.62\00:31:45.23
trying to make
something that replicates life.
00:31:45.26\00:31:50.97
But it's not just
happening by itself.
00:31:51.00\00:31:52.67
But let me ask
you this question.
00:31:52.70\00:31:56.70
Is there a danger in this?
Is this the brave new world,
00:31:56.74\00:32:01.47
where people are going
to create monstrosities
00:32:01.50\00:32:05.59
or catastrophes of
a biblical proportion?
00:32:05.62\00:32:10.05
Are we going too far?
00:32:10.08\00:32:12.08
Are scientists going too
far in trying to play God?
00:32:12.12\00:32:17.65
What do you think?
00:32:17.68\00:32:19.05
Well, I think that
that's a very important question
00:32:19.08\00:32:22.60
that has to be asked
00:32:22.63\00:32:24.00
and continued to be
asked, is this safe?
00:32:24.03\00:32:26.62
What are the ramifications?
00:32:26.65\00:32:28.60
Have we studied what
we're doing enough to understand
00:32:28.64\00:32:31.82
how these artificial life forms,
00:32:31.85\00:32:34.04
these non-natural
life forms going to behave
00:32:34.08\00:32:37.02
if they're out of
outside the laboratory?
00:32:37.06\00:32:39.68
Right now at this
particular point in time,
00:32:39.72\00:32:42.31
the work is safe
because the entities
00:32:42.34\00:32:46.28
that they're
developing from the bottom up
00:32:46.32\00:32:48.46
are pretty fragile,
they don't last very long,
00:32:48.49\00:32:50.60
they're not real stable.
00:32:50.63\00:32:52.84
The artificial life forms that
are being created in the lab
00:32:52.88\00:32:56.41
from the top down
are utterly depended
00:32:56.44\00:32:59.29
upon the lab
environment to survive
00:32:59.32\00:33:02.10
and the researchers
are maintaining them.
00:33:02.14\00:33:04.42
Very fragile, isn't
it? Artificial. Right.
00:33:04.46\00:33:06.67
So right now, it's safe and
to the credit of the scientist
00:33:06.71\00:33:11.08
who are doing this
work, they have been
00:33:11.11\00:33:14.09
consulting
bioethicist and biosafety people
00:33:14.13\00:33:17.08
to make sure
that as they proceed
00:33:17.11\00:33:19.19
they're taking
reasonable precautions.
00:33:19.23\00:33:21.83
But as we move beyond
this initial stage to the idea
00:33:21.87\00:33:27.00
that these things may
somehow escape the lab
00:33:27.03\00:33:29.43
and become more robust. Yeah.
00:33:29.46\00:33:32.24
Who knows how
they're gonna behave. So it-
00:33:32.28\00:33:34.48
Goodness. Safety is a concern.
00:33:34.51\00:33:36.67
So the theories
that some of these things
00:33:36.71\00:33:41.26
that are being
made or manipulated
00:33:41.29\00:33:44.99
or added onto
existing life forms.
00:33:45.03\00:33:48.66
The fear is that of one of these
things could get out the window.
00:33:48.70\00:33:51.82
Sure, and once
it's in the environment
00:33:51.85\00:33:53.96
who knows if it'll die
00:33:53.99\00:33:55.36
or if it'll
suddenly start doing things
00:33:55.39\00:33:58.03
and impacting the environment
or the echo system in a way
00:33:58.07\00:34:01.01
that we would
never have anticipated.
00:34:01.04\00:34:03.25
So these are-are
big unknowns. Yeah.
00:34:03.28\00:34:05.42
But again the good news
is that that there are people
00:34:05.46\00:34:09.10
who are doing this work,
00:34:09.13\00:34:10.50
who are aware
that these are concerns
00:34:10.53\00:34:12.30
and they're trying
their best to address them.
00:34:12.34\00:34:15.08
But this is why I think
00:34:15.11\00:34:16.48
as Christians we need to be
aware of what the science is,
00:34:16.51\00:34:20.67
be aware of what
scientists are trying to do
00:34:20.70\00:34:23.87
and have them
educated in form voice
00:34:23.90\00:34:26.76
so that we can help
direct the technology
00:34:26.80\00:34:29.27
in the appropriate
direction that we can insure
00:34:29.31\00:34:31.98
that there is the
proper safeguard in place.
00:34:32.01\00:34:34.65
And there is no
virtue in ignorance.
00:34:34.68\00:34:37.10
No. There's not.
00:34:37.13\00:34:38.50
You know, we hear the old saying
00:34:38.53\00:34:40.63
that what's you
don't know can't hurt you,
00:34:40.67\00:34:43.53
well, it can hurt you.
00:34:43.56\00:34:45.01
We need to be
intelligently informed. Now-
00:34:45.05\00:34:48.23
But you know, this
is like any technology
00:34:48.27\00:34:51.42
for example nuclear power can be
00:34:51.45\00:34:54.34
put to horrible ends or it can,
00:34:54.38\00:34:57.20
perhaps be the way that rescues
us from an energy crisis.
00:34:57.24\00:35:00.57
Or I know that there
is a place outside Sydney,
00:35:00.60\00:35:05.32
where they make
stuff for radioactive stuff
00:35:05.36\00:35:10.05
for the
treatment of cancer. Yes.
00:35:10.08\00:35:12.11
And so people's lives
have been saved in this way
00:35:12.15\00:35:15.06
and this is done, of
course, in the States.
00:35:15.09\00:35:17.21
When you talk about safeguards
for this brave new world.
00:35:17.25\00:35:23.91
What about
countries that don't have
00:35:23.94\00:35:27.34
the same ethics that we
have here in the United States
00:35:27.38\00:35:30.54
or in Australia
or in Great Britain.
00:35:30.57\00:35:31.98
And again that's a real concern
00:35:32.01\00:35:35.48
so I don't want to
minimize as excited
00:35:35.52\00:35:37.60
as I am about the prospects
of creating life in the lab.
00:35:37.64\00:35:40.36
We don't want to minimize
those potential concerns.
00:35:40.39\00:35:44.34
Right now the technology
is so sophisticated to do
00:35:44.38\00:35:48.30
what's even been done that's-
00:35:48.33\00:35:50.88
you're not gonna get
people in a garage doing this.
00:35:50.92\00:35:53.33
But I think in the near future
that is gonna be a possibility
00:35:53.37\00:35:57.32
because the techniques are gonna
be more broadly understood,
00:35:57.35\00:36:01.27
more people are
gonna be trained. Yeah.
00:36:01.30\00:36:04.64
The expense of doing
it is gonna be reduced,
00:36:04.68\00:36:07.68
operations are
gonna become more turnkey
00:36:07.72\00:36:10.11
and at that point
there is a real concern
00:36:10.15\00:36:12.51
that this could be uncontrolled.
00:36:12.54\00:36:15.29
But again it's like any other
technology in the wrong hands
00:36:15.33\00:36:19.21
even good technology
can be put to bad use.
00:36:19.24\00:36:22.11
So we have to be active in
terms of how we please this,
00:36:22.15\00:36:25.75
how we regulate
this, make sure that
00:36:25.78\00:36:28.40
that our voices are
heard in informed way
00:36:28.44\00:36:31.73
and in respected way.
00:36:31.76\00:36:33.13
You see, you're
telling me lots of stuff today
00:36:33.16\00:36:35.30
that I know nothing about
00:36:35.33\00:36:37.07
and I guess many of the people
00:36:37.11\00:36:38.48
who are watching
the television program,
00:36:38.51\00:36:39.89
they're saying, "Boy, we
never knew any of this. "
00:36:39.93\00:36:42.97
But maybe it's time
you and I got to know this
00:36:43.00\00:36:46.01
because I come
again first to the-
00:36:46.04\00:36:48.53
to the idea that
there are countries
00:36:48.56\00:36:52.22
that are almost
terror states. Yes.
00:36:52.25\00:36:55.04
They'd love to
have the atom bomb
00:36:55.07\00:36:57.83
and hydrogen bomb, and nukes
00:36:57.86\00:37:01.10
because of their philosophies.
00:37:01.13\00:37:04.30
But this could
become more dangerous
00:37:04.34\00:37:06.31
than the hydrogen bomb.
00:37:06.34\00:37:08.37
That's the very real potential.
00:37:08.41\00:37:10.61
So I'm not
concerned about people
00:37:10.64\00:37:12.76
who are trying to
use the technology
00:37:12.80\00:37:14.89
for good purposes. No.
00:37:14.92\00:37:16.35
But the concern
again would be people
00:37:16.39\00:37:18.60
who have evil
motives and evil intents.
00:37:18.63\00:37:20.77
And we live in an
evil world, because of sin.
00:37:20.81\00:37:23.49
We definitely do.
00:37:23.52\00:37:24.89
Which is another great
reason why we need Christ.
00:37:24.92\00:37:28.14
Yes, exactly.
00:37:28.17\00:37:29.54
Because without God, there's
no such thing as good. Yeah.
00:37:29.57\00:37:32.64
You know. No God, no good.
00:37:32.67\00:37:34.65
Yeah, that's right.
00:37:34.68\00:37:36.05
And so to me as a Christian,
I'm excited about this,
00:37:36.08\00:37:40.03
I see that this
technology being a way for us
00:37:40.06\00:37:43.37
to be better
stewards of the planet
00:37:43.40\00:37:45.59
to help people who are sick
00:37:45.62\00:37:47.26
to love our
neighbors as ourselves.
00:37:47.30\00:37:49.92
And I even think that the fact
00:37:49.95\00:37:52.27
that scientist can
create life in the lab
00:37:52.31\00:37:54.66
not only is that I
think a powerful argument
00:37:54.70\00:37:56.98
for the need of a Creator
to bring life to existence.
00:37:57.02\00:38:00.01
But it's also a
powerful argument
00:38:00.04\00:38:02.23
that we as human beings
are made in God's image,
00:38:02.27\00:38:05.56
because if we are
made in God's image
00:38:05.59\00:38:07.57
we are mini creators.
00:38:07.60\00:38:09.39
And so every time we create
00:38:09.43\00:38:11.54
we invent the image of
God has been manifested.
00:38:11.58\00:38:14.57
These are new
ideas to me. And so-
00:38:14.60\00:38:17.15
You're unsettling
the molecules of my mind.
00:38:17.19\00:38:20.25
and probably there on-
00:38:20.28\00:38:21.65
the molecules of
some of the listeners
00:38:21.68\00:38:23.25
who are watching this program.
00:38:23.28\00:38:24.65
Well, it's a different
way to think about this.
00:38:24.68\00:38:26.37
Yes, it is, we need to think.
00:38:26.40\00:38:28.15
And if God made life,
00:38:28.18\00:38:31.07
it's only a matter of
time before we make life.
00:38:31.11\00:38:33.68
Did you know some
churches I've been told?
00:38:33.71\00:38:36.22
Not this
church, not your church,
00:38:36.25\00:38:37.96
none of the
churches of the people
00:38:37.99\00:38:39.63
who are watching
this television program,
00:38:39.67\00:38:41.58
they had boxes at the
door of some churches,
00:38:41.61\00:38:43.49
certainly not in America.
00:38:43.52\00:38:45.13
And they have a little signup,
00:38:45.17\00:38:46.54
it says, "Check your
brains at the door. "
00:38:46.57\00:38:48.96
And it does seem
to some people that,
00:38:48.99\00:38:53.15
some people who profess
the name of Christianity
00:38:53.19\00:38:56.04
are afraid of thinking,
00:38:56.07\00:39:00.60
they have become so traditional
00:39:00.64\00:39:02.88
and they live in
such a little box.
00:39:02.91\00:39:05.08
It's good for us to think
big thoughts and new thoughts
00:39:05.12\00:39:08.12
even if we don't
agree with everything. Yes.
00:39:08.15\00:39:13.73
If scientists using
all of their technology,
00:39:13.76\00:39:19.27
all of the wisdom of hundreds
and hundreds thousands of years.
00:39:19.31\00:39:23.71
We're able one day to
make life in the laboratory,
00:39:23.74\00:39:29.98
artificial life or
something new and amazing.
00:39:30.01\00:39:36.51
Does this make in your opinion
as a scientist God unnecessary?
00:39:36.55\00:39:41.86
Well, I think it means that God
00:39:41.89\00:39:43.85
is absolutely
necessary, because again-
00:39:43.89\00:39:46.13
I would think
so to save us. Yes.
00:39:46.16\00:39:48.58
Well, He's
necessary in the sense
00:39:48.62\00:39:50.97
that it's demonstrating
that intelligent agents
00:39:51.01\00:39:54.22
are needed to bring
life into existence.
00:39:54.25\00:39:56.66
I think the only
reason why scientists can even
00:39:56.70\00:39:59.22
entertain the idea of
creating life in the lab is
00:39:59.25\00:40:01.74
because they're
made in God's image.
00:40:01.77\00:40:03.75
And they have this creativity
00:40:03.78\00:40:05.47
that is part of
the image of God,
00:40:05.51\00:40:07.13
at least that's how
I would understand it
00:40:07.17\00:40:09.24
and that's being manifested.
00:40:09.27\00:40:11.07
And so God creates life,
00:40:11.11\00:40:12.84
we as humans too can create life
00:40:12.88\00:40:15.37
because we have that
that image of God in us.
00:40:15.41\00:40:19.24
But it's all about your
attitude before the Creator.
00:40:19.28\00:40:23.60
If you do it with an attitude
that acknowledges God exists,
00:40:23.64\00:40:28.58
acknowledges that
good things come from Him,
00:40:28.61\00:40:30.91
that you respect
Him, that you worship Him.
00:40:30.94\00:40:33.24
When you're making
the life in the lab,
00:40:33.27\00:40:35.54
it brings God glory
00:40:35.57\00:40:37.19
if you think
about it in those terms,
00:40:37.23\00:40:38.77
but if you are opposed
to that, which is good,
00:40:38.81\00:40:42.23
if you are
opposed to the Creator,
00:40:42.26\00:40:44.47
then it something that could be
00:40:44.50\00:40:46.46
viewed as an
assault against God.
00:40:46.50\00:40:48.39
So it's all the attitude
in the world view perspective
00:40:48.43\00:40:52.93
that you bring to the
activity that makes it,
00:40:52.96\00:40:55.93
I think good or evil.
00:40:55.96\00:40:58.13
Do you think a man
like Richard Dawkins?
00:40:58.17\00:41:00.97
I'm not
criticizing him by any means.
00:41:01.01\00:41:03.74
I don't know enough to criticize
such a great scientist.
00:41:03.78\00:41:07.62
I know that he is
a militant atheist.
00:41:07.65\00:41:10.71
Yes, he is.
00:41:10.74\00:41:12.11
I know he has no time
for the Bible, he ridicules,
00:41:12.14\00:41:14.94
the God of the Old Testament,
00:41:14.97\00:41:16.91
he ridicules Jesus Christ.
00:41:16.95\00:41:18.82
And he talks about
issues where he got to besought.
00:41:18.86\00:41:23.11
He is certainly
not a theologian,
00:41:23.14\00:41:25.22
he's not a philosopher.
00:41:25.25\00:41:26.91
And I've read
some of his arguments.
00:41:26.95\00:41:28.39
And I think some of his
arguments are extremely weak,
00:41:28.43\00:41:30.90
I think they're
shallow, I think they're false.
00:41:30.93\00:41:33.66
And I think he
is very emotional,
00:41:33.69\00:41:36.00
an emotional atheist.
00:41:36.03\00:41:41.50
There must be other
people like Richard Dawkins
00:41:41.54\00:41:43.79
who are in these laboratories.
00:41:43.82\00:41:46.80
Who have the
idea that if they can
00:41:46.84\00:41:49.75
somehow create
some type of life forms,
00:41:49.79\00:41:52.69
simple or complex?
00:41:52.72\00:41:55.15
Then it shows
that the Bible story
00:41:55.19\00:41:57.76
that tells us
that in the beginning
00:41:57.80\00:42:00.34
there was a Creator.
00:42:00.37\00:42:01.74
God created the
heavens and the earth.
00:42:01.77\00:42:03.90
This is not so. Some scientists-
00:42:03.93\00:42:06.60
would you think some
scientists have that motive?
00:42:06.64\00:42:09.25
Yes, I think there is a
group of scientists that do
00:42:09.29\00:42:11.87
indeed have that motivation.
00:42:11.90\00:42:13.27
Desperate. Yeah.
00:42:13.30\00:42:14.89
That they are trying to explain
life in life's beginning,
00:42:14.93\00:42:19.26
life genesis
apart from a Creator.
00:42:19.29\00:42:22.26
And they look at
this type of work as,
00:42:22.29\00:42:25.23
meaning that life isn't special
00:42:25.26\00:42:27.35
or that if we can make
life in the lab, then surely
00:42:27.39\00:42:30.91
it could have originated
on earth, all on its own.
00:42:30.94\00:42:34.43
But again
there's an irony in this,
00:42:34.46\00:42:36.33
because those are
the same scientists
00:42:36.36\00:42:38.16
who I think are doing some
of the most sophisticated work
00:42:38.20\00:42:42.25
in terms of bringing about
the creation of life in the lab.
00:42:42.28\00:42:46.30
And they're
intelligent beings. Yeah.
00:42:46.33\00:42:48.33
And they're never going to deny
that they're not intelligent
00:42:48.37\00:42:51.77
or that they're not genius
00:42:51.80\00:42:53.17
or they're not clever
in what they're doing.
00:42:53.20\00:42:55.42
So in a sense this
argument for the Creator
00:42:55.46\00:42:58.69
kind of boxes them
into a corner so to speak.
00:42:58.72\00:43:01.88
Because you-in a sense of
complimenting their efforts
00:43:01.92\00:43:05.23
and pointing out how
brilliant their work is.
00:43:05.26\00:43:08.32
And so are they going
to deny their brilliance
00:43:08.35\00:43:11.34
and deny the very real
sophistication of their work.
00:43:11.38\00:43:15.68
If they do then it
minimizes their accomplishments.
00:43:15.71\00:43:18.92
And if they don't then
I think it makes the case
00:43:18.95\00:43:22.13
that you need an
intelligent agent so-
00:43:22.16\00:43:24.35
I'm talking to Dr. Rana.
00:43:24.38\00:43:25.94
We're talking about
the life in the laboratory.
00:43:25.98\00:43:28.93
Will scientists make
life in the laboratory?
00:43:28.96\00:43:31.88
It seems they're getting close.
00:43:31.91\00:43:34.57
Now, I want to say
to the young people
00:43:34.61\00:43:36.66
who are watching
who go to universities,
00:43:36.70\00:43:38.68
you need to listen up, because
this is tremendously important.
00:43:38.72\00:43:42.04
Because we're dealing
here with tremendous issues
00:43:42.07\00:43:46.10
that give us evidence to
believe in a Creator God.
00:43:46.13\00:43:51.18
Now for people who have
just tuned into this program,
00:43:51.22\00:43:56.24
Dr. Rana, you talked about life
00:43:56.27\00:43:58.40
coming down from
above the laboratories
00:43:58.44\00:44:01.16
and trying to make
life up from the basement.
00:44:01.20\00:44:05.50
For those who
tuned in tell us about
00:44:05.53\00:44:08.01
what they're doing particularly
00:44:08.04\00:44:09.92
in trying to make life
coming down from above.
00:44:09.96\00:44:12.35
Tell us about this again.
00:44:12.38\00:44:13.75
Yeah, and again
though they may use the term
00:44:13.78\00:44:15.81
that they're
creating life in the lab
00:44:15.84\00:44:17.90
or creating artificial life,
00:44:17.93\00:44:19.39
it's really a
better way to understand
00:44:19.43\00:44:21.40
it is that they're reengineering
life that already exists,
00:44:21.44\00:44:24.95
they're modifying
it, they're altering it,
00:44:24.98\00:44:27.23
using materials that are already
present in nature itself.
00:44:27.27\00:44:32.35
There's very
little and true invention
00:44:32.38\00:44:34.35
going on and that's it.
00:44:34.38\00:44:35.75
So that's not that impressive?
00:44:35.78\00:44:37.27
On one hand it's not impressive
00:44:37.31\00:44:39.07
but on the other hand in
terms of the technical nature
00:44:39.11\00:44:41.89
of their accomplishment,
it's incredibly impressive.
00:44:41.93\00:44:44.68
So it's
remarkable and unremarkable
00:44:44.71\00:44:46.65
at the same time
and that make sense.
00:44:46.68\00:44:48.59
It's a bit like getting
00:44:48.62\00:44:49.99
a Cadillac motor
car or Mercedes-Benz.
00:44:50.02\00:44:52.57
You got the basic car
and then you modify it
00:44:52.61\00:44:55.17
so it becomes a
racing machine. Yes.
00:44:55.20\00:44:57.43
It's modifying,
isn't that? Exactly.
00:44:57.47\00:44:59.65
And there is a
certain amount of genius
00:44:59.68\00:45:01.83
it takes to do
that modification,
00:45:01.86\00:45:03.86
but at the end of the day
you still have an automobile
00:45:03.90\00:45:07.39
and you simply have
altered an existing design. Yes.
00:45:07.43\00:45:10.89
But what we're
also talking about today
00:45:10.92\00:45:14.52
is that scientist
seems to be on the verge.
00:45:14.56\00:45:18.13
This is what you were saying,
00:45:18.16\00:45:19.57
on the very edge of
so manipulating chemicals
00:45:19.61\00:45:25.91
and atoms and molecules
00:45:25.94\00:45:30.00
that are dead that
have got no life at all.
00:45:30.04\00:45:33.83
And getting these
things to have the capacity
00:45:33.87\00:45:37.59
of having some life like
characteristics. Exactly.
00:45:37.63\00:45:42.60
Or more. Exactly.
00:45:42.63\00:45:44.00
And that would be
again work from the bottom up
00:45:44.03\00:45:46.93
and for example there
is a scientist at Harvard,
00:45:46.97\00:45:49.92
Jack Szostak who has figured out
00:45:49.95\00:45:53.16
how to build the membrane,
00:45:53.19\00:45:55.48
a boundary and put
inside that boundary
00:45:55.52\00:45:59.43
molecules that can not
truly divide on their own
00:45:59.47\00:46:04.61
or replicate on their own.
00:46:04.64\00:46:06.01
A membrane. Yes.
00:46:06.04\00:46:07.41
Like the membrane,
membrane around the cell.
00:46:07.44\00:46:10.47
Yes, exactly.
00:46:10.50\00:46:11.87
Because the cell is capitulated,
isn't that? Exactly.
00:46:11.90\00:46:15.57
And he can get that membrane
00:46:15.60\00:46:17.59
by adding the right compounds
to grow larger and larger
00:46:17.63\00:46:21.14
and eventually it
will divide into two.
00:46:21.17\00:46:23.35
So there is a
growth in division process
00:46:23.38\00:46:25.53
that he's able
to do and he's can,
00:46:25.56\00:46:28.00
can incorporate molecules-
00:46:28.03\00:46:29.70
Did he stop with a life form?
00:46:29.74\00:46:31.34
No, he's starting now
with molecules to do this,
00:46:31.38\00:46:34.66
but he's taking all
of these clues to do this
00:46:34.69\00:46:37.94
from how living organisms works.
00:46:37.97\00:46:40.66
So on one hand he is creating
this very interesting system.
00:46:40.70\00:46:45.13
He's thinking God's
thoughts after him. Exactly.
00:46:45.16\00:46:48.23
Didn't Newton say that? Exactly.
00:46:48.26\00:46:49.63
Who said that? I think
it might have been him.
00:46:49.66\00:46:52.25
I'm not sure.
You're a scientist.
00:46:52.28\00:46:53.70
I'm not sure who said that.
00:46:53.73\00:46:55.10
You remember-- I'm
just a payroll pastor
00:46:55.13\00:46:56.50
who knows
nothing about it. Yeah.
00:46:56.53\00:46:57.90
Well, you know,
you've got me on that one.
00:46:57.93\00:46:59.30
I'm not sure who-
I've heard that of course.
00:46:59.33\00:47:00.73
I think, I
don't know who it was.
00:47:00.76\00:47:02.13
Somebody gonna write it
00:47:02.16\00:47:03.53
and they're gonna
tell us but he said,
00:47:03.56\00:47:05.47
"In his lab he
was simply thinking
00:47:05.51\00:47:07.85
God's thoughts
after Him. " Yeah.
00:47:07.89\00:47:10.16
So this man has been
able to make a membrane. Yeah.
00:47:10.20\00:47:14.62
And that holds in these
atoms and so forth. Yeah.
00:47:14.65\00:47:19.04
And he can get it
to grow and divide.
00:47:19.07\00:47:21.09
I'm amazed. Yeah.
00:47:21.12\00:47:22.49
So it's an
incredible accomplishment.
00:47:22.52\00:47:24.06
Well, is it a life?
00:47:24.09\00:47:25.46
That's a good question,
00:47:25.49\00:47:26.86
you know, what's interesting is
00:47:26.89\00:47:28.92
biologist can't
define what life is.
00:47:28.96\00:47:32.16
That was something that
actually got me interested in,
00:47:32.20\00:47:35.69
in becoming a biochemist.
00:47:35.72\00:47:37.09
This is my first
biology class, going to class-
00:47:37.12\00:47:40.06
Well, let me ask you.
00:47:40.09\00:47:42.15
You're a
biochemist, what is life?
00:47:42.19\00:47:45.39
Well, in a physical sense
00:47:45.42\00:47:47.76
it's really
difficult to know exactly
00:47:47.80\00:47:49.89
what life is
and what isn't life.
00:47:49.92\00:47:51.85
Nobody has been
able to define it
00:47:51.88\00:47:53.90
from a scientific perspective.
00:47:53.94\00:47:55.89
In fact, if you
look in the literature,
00:47:55.93\00:47:58.70
there's probably
about 250 years of work
00:47:58.74\00:48:01.31
where people have off
and on tried to produce
00:48:01.34\00:48:03.84
a definition for life and
have been unable to define it.
00:48:03.88\00:48:07.40
And what they end up
doing is just saying-
00:48:07.43\00:48:09.13
You're amazing me here today,
00:48:09.16\00:48:10.92
I'm enjoying this.
00:48:10.95\00:48:12.32
So what they do
is just simply say,
00:48:12.35\00:48:14.00
"Well, all living organisms
have these characteristics. "
00:48:14.04\00:48:16.71
But that's not
really defining life,
00:48:16.74\00:48:18.97
it's more describing it.
00:48:19.00\00:48:20.37
It doesn't say
how it started or-
00:48:20.40\00:48:23.20
But where this is significant is
00:48:23.24\00:48:25.54
if you don't
know how to define it
00:48:25.58\00:48:27.81
how do you really know that
you've actually created life.
00:48:27.85\00:48:31.06
And so when we talk
about the work of Jack Szostak,
00:48:31.09\00:48:34.61
who's done
again incredible stuff
00:48:34.64\00:48:36.15
where he's getting these
entities to grow and divide,
00:48:36.19\00:48:39.77
he can encapsulate
molecules in there,
00:48:39.80\00:48:41.58
he can get them to do
some interesting things.
00:48:41.62\00:48:43.59
Has he made a cell?
00:48:43.62\00:48:45.62
Not really a cell, they
call them protocells, but-
00:48:45.66\00:48:48.42
That's a primitive cell, is it?
00:48:48.45\00:48:49.90
It maybe, maybe not even
a primitive cell. No, no.
00:48:49.93\00:48:53.18
So it's somewhere between
being not alive and being alive.
00:48:53.21\00:48:58.69
And that's where the inability
00:48:58.72\00:49:01.01
to define life
becomes important,
00:49:01.04\00:49:03.11
because depending on one
definition maybe it is a life,
00:49:03.14\00:49:06.28
depending on another
definition maybe it isn't.
00:49:06.31\00:49:09.20
So it's important
for people to be aware
00:49:09.23\00:49:11.48
that when they hear claims
00:49:11.51\00:49:13.19
that we've
created life in a lab.
00:49:13.22\00:49:16.19
Nobody really knows what
that definition of life is
00:49:16.22\00:49:19.57
and so maybe they're just simply
00:49:19.60\00:49:21.05
exaggerating
their accomplishment.
00:49:21.08\00:49:23.84
And it makes
headlines, it gets publicity
00:49:23.87\00:49:26.28
and people then
react out of concern
00:49:26.31\00:49:28.85
for no reason at all.
00:49:28.88\00:49:31.15
I've got a question coming on.
00:49:31.18\00:49:34.62
I've been pondering this.
00:49:34.65\00:49:37.17
Now there were big
seminars held around the world
00:49:37.20\00:49:40.13
called the origin of life
meetings, aren't they? Yes.
00:49:40.16\00:49:43.27
And scientists get together
00:49:43.30\00:49:45.02
and they talk about
we've made this advancement
00:49:45.05\00:49:48.87
we've made this advancement.
00:49:48.90\00:49:50.27
I heard a scientist, a
well known scientist say that,
00:49:50.30\00:49:53.77
they open one door and
that leads to another corridor
00:49:53.80\00:49:59.26
and they say, ha-ha.
00:49:59.29\00:50:00.94
They don't say
hallelujah but they say,
00:50:00.97\00:50:02.50
we've got in this corridor
00:50:02.53\00:50:04.56
And then they discover there
are lots of other doors. Yeah.
00:50:04.59\00:50:07.30
And when they open those doors,
00:50:07.33\00:50:09.41
This leads to other corridors.
00:50:09.44\00:50:12.16
Now atheists
00:50:12.19\00:50:15.97
or atheistic
evolutionists teach--
00:50:16.00\00:50:20.73
you know, I'm not a scientist.
00:50:20.76\00:50:22.51
I'm just trying to get
my words together here.
00:50:22.54\00:50:25.39
They teach that
basically there was nothing
00:50:25.42\00:50:29.93
and then it became something
00:50:29.96\00:50:32.70
and that something wasn't alive.
00:50:32.73\00:50:35.90
And over a long period of time,
00:50:35.93\00:50:39.12
out of that which was non alive
00:50:39.15\00:50:42.65
became something which was alive
00:50:42.68\00:50:45.45
And this happened
spontaneously by itself. Yeah.
00:50:45.48\00:50:49.32
And then after a
tremendous long process
00:50:49.35\00:50:52.85
taking billions of years.
00:50:52.88\00:50:55.74
the simple cell
became a human being,
00:50:55.77\00:50:59.21
here we are today.
00:50:59.24\00:51:00.61
So if you leave gasses
by themselves long enough,
00:51:00.64\00:51:05.87
they'll become
people like you and me.
00:51:05.90\00:51:08.23
And they'll have
television cameras
00:51:08.26\00:51:10.18
and they'll be, you
know, people like you and me
00:51:10.21\00:51:12.29
having a good time
together, laughing together.
00:51:12.32\00:51:17.14
But this is
nothing like that. No.
00:51:17.17\00:51:20.97
We're not talking about
things spontaneously generating.
00:51:21.00\00:51:24.11
No, we're not.
00:51:24.14\00:51:25.51
We're talking about
great cooperation's,
00:51:25.54\00:51:27.88
the greatest minds in the world,
00:51:27.91\00:51:30.83
with the best
equipment in the world,
00:51:30.86\00:51:33.25
playing around with atoms
00:51:33.28\00:51:37.08
that they never
created. Exactly.
00:51:37.11\00:51:39.31
And molecules that
they never created,
00:51:39.34\00:51:41.69
they never made any of
that basic stuff. Exactly.
00:51:41.72\00:51:44.63
And they're putting
that stuff together.
00:51:44.66\00:51:47.00
And to this point of
time some of it seems
00:51:47.03\00:51:49.31
to have some of the
minor characteristics of life.
00:51:49.34\00:51:55.37
But even if
scientists, Dr. Rana,
00:51:55.40\00:51:59.48
even if scientists were able
00:51:59.51\00:52:02.29
to make
something in the laboratory
00:52:02.32\00:52:05.58
and they said it was living,
00:52:05.61\00:52:08.67
it's not spontaneous generation.
00:52:08.70\00:52:10.62
No, it's intelligent
agency. It's not evolution.
00:52:10.65\00:52:14.12
No, it's not evolution at
all. It's intelligent design.
00:52:14.15\00:52:17.61
And so to me I think
00:52:17.64\00:52:19.01
again the attempts
to create life in a lab
00:52:19.04\00:52:21.48
is one of the
most powerful arguments
00:52:21.51\00:52:23.41
we're going to have. Absolutely.
00:52:23.44\00:52:24.82
That a creator is
necessary for life.
00:52:24.85\00:52:26.42
I want the young
people listening that,
00:52:26.45\00:52:27.82
listen up now, hear this,
00:52:27.85\00:52:29.60
don't be taken
in by the atheist.
00:52:29.63\00:52:31.30
I'm telling you that it
just spontaneously generated,
00:52:31.33\00:52:34.71
because it didn't, did it?
00:52:34.74\00:52:36.13
No, this is a
clear demonstration
00:52:36.16\00:52:38.69
that spontaneous generation
00:52:38.72\00:52:40.71
gets you nowhere
and nowhere fast.
00:52:40.74\00:52:43.35
It's only when you have again,
00:52:43.38\00:52:46.11
intelligent agency involved
that life comes from non-life,
00:52:46.14\00:52:49.67
if you want to even call what
they've done, creating life.
00:52:49.70\00:52:52.53
Isn't that amazing
that once upon a time
00:52:52.56\00:52:54.94
people who believed
in spontaneous generation
00:52:54.97\00:52:57.74
were considered to be
barbarians, ignoramuses.
00:52:57.77\00:53:02.19
It's a pretty
good word, isn't it?
00:53:02.22\00:53:03.59
Yeah. Ignoramuses.
00:53:03.62\00:53:04.99
Anybody who believed
that life came from non-life
00:53:05.02\00:53:07.31
once upon a time, people
said, "that sounds crazy"
00:53:07.34\00:53:10.45
but now it's
believed by many people. Yeah.
00:53:10.48\00:53:12.83
That life in some
billions of years ago,
00:53:12.86\00:53:16.50
it spontaneously
generated. Yeah, yeah.
00:53:16.53\00:53:19.71
And that's exactly
where you have to go,
00:53:19.74\00:53:22.31
if you're gonna argue
00:53:22.34\00:53:23.91
that life evolved
from nonliving matter.
00:53:23.94\00:53:26.58
It is in the sense that a
form of spontaneous generation,
00:53:26.61\00:53:30.16
maybe a little bit different
than how it was conceived of,
00:53:30.19\00:53:33.54
you know, in the middle ages.
00:53:33.57\00:53:35.11
But nevertheless
it's still essence,
00:53:35.14\00:53:39.22
a model that's employing
spontaneous generation.
00:53:39.25\00:53:43.00
And again this work in the lab
00:53:43.03\00:53:46.00
where scientists are
trying to create life
00:53:46.03\00:53:48.44
is a clear demonstration that--
00:53:48.47\00:53:51.50
You got to have intelligent--
It's a bankrupt idea.
00:53:51.53\00:53:53.24
You've got to have intelligent
brains doing this. Exactly.
00:53:53.27\00:53:55.81
And they're not
working with original material.
00:53:55.84\00:53:58.08
They're working with material
that somebody put there. Yes.
00:53:58.11\00:54:02.07
And they are taking their
understanding of how life works
00:54:02.10\00:54:06.00
and applying that understanding
to create life in the lab.
00:54:06.03\00:54:09.57
They're not
conceiving all on their own
00:54:09.60\00:54:12.33
a blueprint or a strategy for
how to make life from non-life.
00:54:12.36\00:54:16.16
They are
borrowing an understanding
00:54:16.19\00:54:18.04
from that which already exists.
00:54:18.07\00:54:19.44
Now think of me 90.
00:54:19.47\00:54:20.84
And I think of me
as a university student
00:54:20.87\00:54:23.93
and I have been
bombarded with evolution
00:54:23.96\00:54:27.74
and other atheistic ideas.
00:54:27.77\00:54:31.94
Or atheistic ideas.
00:54:31.97\00:54:34.86
You're a scientist,
you're a biochemist,
00:54:34.89\00:54:38.19
you've studied
this many, many years
00:54:38.22\00:54:40.50
it is the passion of your life.
00:54:40.53\00:54:43.17
Tell me why are you a Christian?
00:54:43.20\00:54:46.07
Why do you believe in Christ?
00:54:46.10\00:54:48.32
Why do you believe
in a Creator God? Why?
00:54:48.35\00:54:51.17
Well, to me when I
look at living systems,
00:54:51.20\00:54:55.14
that's not that these systems
are complex which they are.
00:54:55.17\00:54:57.86
It's they're so elegant.
They're so sophisticated.
00:54:57.89\00:55:00.78
They're so clever
and how they are operate,
00:55:00.81\00:55:03.05
that to me immediately suggests
a mind is involved. Yes.
00:55:03.08\00:55:06.70
And when you look at
the way in which scientists
00:55:06.73\00:55:08.69
try to explain where
these systems come from.
00:55:08.72\00:55:11.82
Those explanations are
demonstrably unworkable
00:55:11.85\00:55:16.90
from a scientific perspective,
00:55:16.93\00:55:18.48
which means there has to be
a mind that's behind it all.
00:55:18.51\00:55:22.29
And as soon as
you recognize that,
00:55:22.32\00:55:24.84
it immediately
begs questions like,
00:55:24.87\00:55:27.30
who is that creator?
00:55:27.33\00:55:28.70
How do I relate it to Him?
00:55:28.73\00:55:30.23
And the reason I'm a Christian
00:55:30.26\00:55:31.63
is because once I
started asking those questions
00:55:31.66\00:55:33.91
as I began to
read the Bible. Yes.
00:55:33.94\00:55:36.00
I felt that the Bible
provided the best explanation
00:55:36.03\00:55:39.25
for who that Creator is
and how I related to Him
00:55:39.28\00:55:42.30
and my desperate
need for a Savior.
00:55:42.33\00:55:44.64
So to me, I'm a Christian
00:55:44.67\00:55:46.89
because I think the evidence
indicates a Creator exists
00:55:46.92\00:55:50.03
and I believe that the Bible--
00:55:50.06\00:55:51.46
This is not blind faith. No.
00:55:51.49\00:55:53.56
But the Bible
makes so much sense to me
00:55:53.59\00:55:55.71
in terms of
explaining the human condition
00:55:55.74\00:55:58.71
and explaining how
human beings can be rescued
00:55:58.74\00:56:02.23
from the
predicament that we're in.
00:56:02.26\00:56:04.12
You have reasons to believe?
00:56:04.15\00:56:05.73
I do. Yes, exactly. Yes.
00:56:05.76\00:56:07.40
And the people who are
watching this program today,
00:56:07.43\00:56:09.70
I want to say to you,
you have reasons to believe.
00:56:09.73\00:56:14.33
There is
scientific evidence to suggest
00:56:14.36\00:56:16.82
that there is a
wonderful Creator God.
00:56:16.85\00:56:19.64
And this Creator
God loved you so much
00:56:19.67\00:56:22.13
that He sent His own Son Jesus
00:56:22.16\00:56:24.73
to die for you on the cross.
00:56:24.76\00:56:27.92
And because we came from God,
00:56:27.95\00:56:29.77
one day we're going back to God.
00:56:29.80\00:56:32.34
One day we're going to
be with God in paradise.
00:56:32.37\00:56:35.81
Please, write to me John
Carter, Post Office Box 1900,
00:56:35.84\00:56:39.54
Thousand Oaks,
California, 91358.
00:56:39.57\00:56:42.54
Write to me at the
Terrigal address in Australia.
00:56:42.57\00:56:45.55
Thank you for joining us today.
00:56:45.58\00:56:47.19
Dr. Rana, thank you for
being a marvelous guest.
00:56:47.22\00:56:49.37
Thank you for having me.
00:56:49.40\00:56:50.77
We appreciate your work so much.
00:56:50.80\00:56:52.26
God bless you all.
00:56:52.29\00:56:53.66
See you next time. Bye-bye.
00:56:53.69\00:56:55.06