The following program
discusses sensitive issues
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related to addictive behavior.
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Parents are
cautioned that some material
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may be too candid
for younger children.
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Today I had a cancellation.
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So I had to pull
somebody from the hallway
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to do this
program and I love her.
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Shelley Quinn is going to be on.
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You guys are gonna love her.
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Come join us.
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Welcome back.
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And as I said in the
beginning is that what happens
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when there's a cancellation
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I have no way to
know that in advance.
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An emergency came up
and I'm thinking okay,
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we have the schedule.
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We have a
schedule for the program
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and the show and
all that kind of stuff
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and I thought, wait a minute.
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I am at 3ABN.
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There are some
incredible men and women of God
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just walking the hallway.
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And so I thought about who
would fit best for this season,
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'cause we're
talking about the season,
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about how to not only
come out of addiction,
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come out of all
that kind of stuff
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but how do you
allow God to build you up.
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Where do you get
your strength from?
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How do you do
the transformation?
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How do you change everything?
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And I thought, oh, Shelly.
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And it was really fun, 'cause
going up to you and saying,
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"Shelley, you know,
I had a cancellation.
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Can you come and just
hangout with us for a while?"
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And immediately, absolutely.
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It's my joy to do this.
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Don't know what we're
gonna be talking about
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but I'm glad to be here.
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And we wanted--I wanted
to have you on the program
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for a long time because
I just--I love what you do.
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I love your
teachings and the material
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that you put together.
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And so for people
that are watching this,
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maybe in a rehab
center, in a jail,
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or they have to be somewhere
in a desert not to know
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who you are if
they are watching 3ABN,
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'cause you have
your own program on 3ABN.
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And--but for people
that don't know you,
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can we start with your journey?
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Can you kind of walk
us through some of that?
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How far back?
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I would say all the way back
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because I know
you and I know that,
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you know, some
people look at you and say,
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"You know what?
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She probably you
know, has always been
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kind of that woman of
God and standing tall."
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But you haven't.
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I mean you have
struggled and you know
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like--a lot of the guests
that we have on the program
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as you know what it
feels like to be surrounded
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by dysfunction and
trying to stand up.
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And so I would
say if you could--
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Just a quick testimony? Yeah.
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Okay, first of all
mine pales by comparison.
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I thought I grew
up in an extremely
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dysfunctional environment
but when I listen to your story
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mine pales by comparison.
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But my parents were
divorced when I was 4 years old.
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My father got custody of me.
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My mother got
custody of my baby sister
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who was 3 months old.
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And we moved
thousand miles away.
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Moved in with my grandparents
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and then my father
was a commercial pilot.
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So he ended up leaving and
I was left with grandparents.
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My grandmother wanted me,
my grandfather didn't. But--
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And you kind of
know that as a kid.
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Oh, yeah, you'd
really know that as a kid.
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And so here I am, you know,
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about 5 years old at this point
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and just felt
like I didn't belong.
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And according to my grandmother,
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letters that my
grandmother sent,
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I found out that I cried
myself to sleep every night
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for my mother
and my baby sister.
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So my father was
killed in a plane crash
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when his own plane, it
went down when I was six.
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I was reunited with
my mother who remarried.
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Reunited as far as going back
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and living with her. Going back.
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I went back to
live with my mother
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but I felt a
certain estrangement
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from the family and my
stepfather didn't want me.
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I was somebody he had not
planned on, bargained for.
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So my mother
ended up divorcing him
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and then she was
single till I was 13.
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She married an alcoholic man.
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He was an engineer.
He was very abusive.
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You know, I want to
go back to the point
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where you end up going back
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and did you
ever have a sense of,
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they really could
send me away at any point?
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You'd been--do
you know what I mean?
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It's like am I gonna stay here?
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Are you guys gonna keep me?
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I grew up with a
great fear of abandonment
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and because of that
I was a perfectionist.
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And I tried to do
everything perfect.
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I was always
performance oriented.
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You know, if I can just do
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more people are gonna love me.
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And they're gonna keep me. Yes.
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And I was a straight A student
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and it was like
you don't make a B.
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You know, you wouldn't
dare think to make a B.
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It was an
interesting thing because
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I think especially
when my mother remarried.
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My mom was a neat lady.
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She was different.
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You know, she stayed up
till 2 o'clock every night.
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When I was in first grade
I got myself off to school
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and I had to be very
quiet, not to wake up
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my mother and my baby sister.
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So my life was different
because my mom was different.
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What I didn't know
is my mother was bipolar
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because when she
started really exhibiting this,
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when she married the alcoholic
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she decided if you
can't beat him, join him.
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And so she started
drinking real heavily.
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Self medicating
more than likely.
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Yeah. And so here
we've got--you know,
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I have this abusive
stepfather who is an alcoholic
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and I just
feel-- I mean we moved.
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Every 6 months I was
in a different school,
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every semester for 3 years.
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And you feel like, you
know, I became very timid,
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very withdrawn and very quiet.
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And things at home were a wreck.
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I want you to talk
about because a lot of people
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never talk about what happens
when a parent is struggling
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with a mental
illness or with bipolar
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or with any of
that kind of stuff.
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Is it--your home life is
really different, you know.
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And you learn to adapt to
a crazy kind of environment
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but that
environment becomes your norm.
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I think for me the hardest thing
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was that I can
remember times in my life--
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I loved my mother
very much, you know.
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And once she was
finally diagnosed
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and went on medication
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she could be pretty normal
for a couple of years at a time
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but she would then go
off of medication purposely.
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So we went
through-- every 2 years
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we would go
through about 3 month spell
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where it was
literally insanity at home.
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But what hurt me the most
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I think is the
advice of my grandparents.
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My mother grew up in a
very dysfunctional environment
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and my grandparents were
pillars of the community.
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A lot of people didn't
know what went on in their home
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but what hurt me the most
was my grandparents would say,
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"You know, you cannot
tell anyone what's going on.
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You don't want
anyone"-- there was this shame.
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It wasn't
business and... Yes, yes.
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And so-- What would they think?
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Here I was as a teenager
trying to handle this at home
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because they
wouldn't help me handle her.
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And when I say handle her,
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what does 15 or
16-year-old do, you know?
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You really don't
know what to do. And--
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When you say handle
her, color that for us.
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What does that mean?
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Oh, well, I would
come home from school
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and she always
took it out on me.
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I was evidently
very much like my father
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and so this was something
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that--I know my mother loved me.
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There was never a question.
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But there was
complete disparity in the way
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I was treated and the
way my sister was treated.
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Because I would, you
know--my sister who did,
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by the way, take
the drug addict route.
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I mean the way she
handled all this dysfunction
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was to become an
addict. Right, she's got right.
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But for me I just
kept trying to be perfect.
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And my mother would tell me,
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"You know, you never
needed me as a child.
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You've always been perfect
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and that's why I
love your sister more."
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So when she would
have these episodes,
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any animosity she felt
toward my father came out to me
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and it all ended up on me.
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So you get this
barrage of stuff.
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It's like-- Oh, yeah.
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Because I mean, you know, I'm--
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I mean it doesn't--
I don't want to paint
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a horrible picture of my mother
but I've been pulled around
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the house by
the hair on my head.
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I've been pretty--you know,
things would get very intense
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and my mother was
the type that could cycle
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and be at a manic
phase and 30 minutes later
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be down in the dumps
and in a manic phase.
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And she'd go for
weeks without sleep
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which meant I went
for weeks without sleep.
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And, you know, what I think--
Because I wasn't allowed.
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What I think is really
interesting about a household
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is in the middle
of that craziness
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because you are taught to
not take that family business
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outside the door at
all, if somebody knocked
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on the door or
called on the phone
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all of a sudden
everything's normal.
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Oh, absolutely.
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And even if I went to
the psychiatrist with her,
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when she'd get in
front of the psychiatrist
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and I'm--oh, I was so
frightened to say anything
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because she's sitting
there giving me dirty looks
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while we're
talking with him like
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"don't you dare say anything."
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And I'm sitting
there pleading with my eyes
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like "please help
me," because it was--
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when I say handle
her, it was left to me
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to try to either get
her back on her medication
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or get her into a
hospital, even as a teenager.
00:09:18.53\00:09:20.54
My grandparents
wouldn't step there.
00:09:20.57\00:09:22.22
And her psychiatrist,
she would go and act
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barely normal in
front of him and he'd say,
00:09:25.19\00:09:27.62
"Oh, let her go off medication.
00:09:27.65\00:09:29.02
She's having a little fun."
00:09:29.05\00:09:30.42
And I think a
little fun, you know,
00:09:30.45\00:09:32.94
I've nearly been killed.
00:09:32.97\00:09:34.34
I've nearly--I'm going
through just sleep deprivation
00:09:34.37\00:09:39.16
and she would hallucinate
when she would go through
00:09:39.19\00:09:41.23
her sleep deprivation. Exactly.
00:09:41.26\00:09:42.63
So things were
not pleasant at home.
00:09:42.66\00:09:45.85
And, you know,
what's interesting
00:09:45.88\00:09:48.11
is when somebody says, you know,
00:09:48.14\00:09:49.68
my story is nothing like
yours and not as bad as yours.
00:09:49.71\00:09:53.93
I think it's all--
it's all dysfunction.
00:09:53.96\00:09:56.63
Do you know what I
mean? I think that, you know,
00:09:56.66\00:09:58.45
when I hear your story I think
00:09:58.48\00:09:59.95
that you really did
learn to survive in a situation
00:09:59.98\00:10:03.66
where a lot of
people like your sister
00:10:03.69\00:10:06.20
would just totally escape.
00:10:06.23\00:10:07.74
One thing when you said
about reaching out to people,
00:10:07.77\00:10:10.07
I remember when I
was in junior high school
00:10:10.10\00:10:13.25
and it had been 3 weeks, there
had been no sleep at our house.
00:10:13.28\00:10:16.21
It had been just insanity.
00:10:16.24\00:10:18.23
And I--my--I was--
we'd just gone through
00:10:18.26\00:10:22.14
the divorce from this stepfather
00:10:22.17\00:10:25.36
and so I just was
in a brand new school
00:10:25.39\00:10:27.95
and my biology
teacher came to me
00:10:27.98\00:10:30.31
and dressed me
down in the hallway.
00:10:30.34\00:10:32.94
And she said "I
don't understand you."
00:10:32.97\00:10:34.49
She gave a pop
quiz every morning.
00:10:34.52\00:10:36.28
She was my last class.
00:10:36.31\00:10:38.34
And so whatever assignments
00:10:38.37\00:10:41.04
she gave there was no
studying when I got home.
00:10:41.07\00:10:44.35
There was no studying.
There was no quiet place.
00:10:44.38\00:10:46.79
Because there was no quiet place
00:10:46.82\00:10:48.74
and then I've had to do
the rest of my homework.
00:10:48.77\00:10:50.93
I did have one study period
00:10:50.96\00:10:52.55
that I had to do
my written homework,
00:10:52.58\00:10:53.99
but she would give
me this assignment.
00:10:54.02\00:10:56.48
And I'd always be a day behind.
00:10:56.51\00:10:58.08
And so these pop quizzes,
00:10:58.11\00:11:01.62
I was making bad
grades on the pop quizzes.
00:11:01.65\00:11:03.80
And she said
"You're the brightest
00:11:03.83\00:11:05.20
student in my class.
00:11:05.23\00:11:06.60
Why are you so lazy?"
00:11:06.63\00:11:08.00
And I'm sitting there
just so sleep deprived.
00:11:08.03\00:11:10.68
I look like rocky raccoon
00:11:10.71\00:11:12.22
and everything in
me I wanted to cry out,
00:11:12.25\00:11:14.98
"Please help me. You know,
00:11:15.01\00:11:16.43
I don't know what
to do with my mother."
00:11:16.46\00:11:18.23
Will somebody help
me? Will somebody help me?
00:11:18.26\00:11:19.83
But there was
that code of silence
00:11:19.86\00:11:21.80
that you don't speak
about the elephant in the room.
00:11:21.83\00:11:24.87
Do you know out
of all of the people,
00:11:24.90\00:11:27.41
even in the café are
viewing, there's so many people
00:11:27.44\00:11:31.01
that know that code of silence.
00:11:31.04\00:11:32.62
There's so many
families that know
00:11:32.65\00:11:34.23
that when you
walk outside this door
00:11:34.26\00:11:36.35
what happens here stays here.
00:11:36.38\00:11:39.13
And so, you know,
I would love to hear,
00:11:39.16\00:11:41.41
'cause, you know, I know you
as this incredible woman of God
00:11:41.44\00:11:45.59
in a loving relationship,
all of that kind of stuff.
00:11:45.62\00:11:48.22
So, you know, how
did you--how did that--
00:11:48.25\00:11:52.49
how did you survive
and how did you find God?
00:11:52.52\00:11:55.63
You know, because--was God
in the picture at that time?
00:11:55.66\00:11:58.24
My mother believed in God.
00:11:58.27\00:12:00.04
She didn't go to church
because she was divorced.
00:12:00.07\00:12:02.18
We grew up in Church of Christ
00:12:02.21\00:12:03.58
and they almost taught
that that was unpardonable sin.
00:12:03.61\00:12:06.22
So she would not go to church.
00:12:06.25\00:12:08.29
Almost shunned
when you get a divorce?
00:12:08.32\00:12:10.56
Absolutely, absolutely.
00:12:10.59\00:12:11.96
So my grandfather
did take us to church
00:12:11.99\00:12:14.02
when we were young.
00:12:14.05\00:12:15.47
And I was in love
with Jesus Christ.
00:12:15.50\00:12:19.22
I was, and as a
teenager that's the only thing
00:12:19.25\00:12:22.14
that got me through is
that I was there every time
00:12:22.17\00:12:25.09
the church doors opened.
00:12:25.12\00:12:26.49
And what is it
about the promises of God
00:12:26.52\00:12:29.88
or who you knew God to be
that comforted that child?
00:12:29.91\00:12:33.06
I think I knew that Jesus
loved me because He died for me.
00:12:33.09\00:12:36.66
I didn't--I had a very
tainted picture of the father,
00:12:36.69\00:12:40.06
a very tainted picture.
00:12:40.09\00:12:41.62
I thought that like
everyone else I knew
00:12:41.65\00:12:44.85
that I was taught
that I had to be perfect
00:12:44.88\00:12:46.77
for God to love me, the Father.
00:12:46.80\00:12:48.53
And that God was just
up there on His throne
00:12:48.56\00:12:51.61
watching and waiting to
see me do something wrong
00:12:51.64\00:12:55.36
and then He was gonna
zap me out of the picture.
00:12:55.39\00:12:57.35
But not Jesus. But not Jesus.
00:12:57.38\00:12:59.14
I always
felt--you know, Hebrews 1:3,
00:12:59.17\00:13:02.04
I remember when the Lord started
00:13:02.07\00:13:04.23
turning things around for
me is when I found Hebrews 1:3.
00:13:04.26\00:13:08.18
And I read that many
times because as a teenager
00:13:08.21\00:13:11.91
I read my Bible,
the New Testament.
00:13:11.94\00:13:14.19
We were a New
Testament Christian church.
00:13:14.22\00:13:16.49
So I'd read the New Testament
00:13:16.52\00:13:18.63
couple of hundred
times probably as a teenager.
00:13:18.66\00:13:21.18
And I'd always focus on
the second part of Hebrews 1:3
00:13:21.21\00:13:25.92
that talks about
that Jesus upholds
00:13:25.95\00:13:28.64
everything by His
mighty Word of power.
00:13:28.67\00:13:31.58
And so I thought man,
00:13:31.61\00:13:32.98
the Word of God is
powerful, you know.
00:13:33.01\00:13:35.20
And Jesus can
uphold me by His Word.
00:13:35.23\00:13:37.98
But I missed the first
part, for some reason in my mind
00:13:38.01\00:13:41.81
till I was
probably 28 years old,
00:13:41.84\00:13:45.32
that it says in Hebrews 1:3,
00:13:45.35\00:13:47.98
that Jesus is the exact
expression of the Father.
00:13:48.01\00:13:52.90
He's the out ring,
He's of the divine.
00:13:52.93\00:13:54.93
So everything that
Jesus is, God, the Father is.
00:13:54.96\00:13:59.79
So all of a sudden I
started realizing that God
00:13:59.82\00:14:03.77
was just as
loving and compassionate
00:14:03.80\00:14:06.10
and merciful and that God,
00:14:06.13\00:14:08.74
the Father revealed
Himself to us through His Son
00:14:08.77\00:14:13.56
coming here to
represent His character,
00:14:13.59\00:14:16.14
to let us see this is who I am.
00:14:16.17\00:14:18.58
They're exactly the same.
00:14:18.61\00:14:20.44
And that totally changed
the way my experience was,
00:14:20.47\00:14:26.64
because I had had--I
mean I was--when I say
00:14:26.67\00:14:30.18
I worked toward
perfection I never gave
00:14:30.21\00:14:33.08
anyone any excuse, anyway.
00:14:33.11\00:14:36.26
I mean I did everything right.
00:14:36.29\00:14:39.80
And I'm not saying that I didn't
get some really bad spankings,
00:14:39.83\00:14:42.88
but they weren't--
it'd be like if I lost $10
00:14:42.91\00:14:46.15
at the--I remember once
I was getting vegetables
00:14:46.18\00:14:49.25
and I laid $10 down
there as I was picking up
00:14:49.28\00:14:52.66
the vegetables and
walked away and came back
00:14:52.69\00:14:54.50
and it was gone and I
got a really bad spanking.
00:14:54.53\00:14:57.17
Or if my mother couldn't find us
00:14:57.20\00:14:58.96
and she'd give me a
really bad spanking.
00:14:58.99\00:15:01.14
And we might be two houses down
00:15:01.17\00:15:02.79
but--but I never gave
anybody excuse to spank me.
00:15:02.82\00:15:08.08
I never gave anybody--I
wanted to be loved by everybody.
00:15:08.11\00:15:11.79
You lived up to
all of that pressure.
00:15:11.82\00:15:13.97
I lived up. I can remember
when I was in high school
00:15:14.00\00:15:16.87
there was a girl
that was a gang leader
00:15:16.90\00:15:19.17
and I found out
that she didn't like me.
00:15:19.20\00:15:21.44
And I'm thinking
how can she not like me.
00:15:21.47\00:15:23.93
And I went to her and I said
00:15:23.96\00:15:25.33
"What have I ever done to
you that you wouldn't like me?"
00:15:25.36\00:15:27.61
And she says,
"Well, you're so snobby.
00:15:27.64\00:15:29.65
You don't speak to me
when you go down the halls."
00:15:29.68\00:15:31.81
And I thought I would never
intentionally ignore somebody.
00:15:31.84\00:15:35.09
So then I went out of my
way to win her friendship
00:15:35.12\00:15:38.10
because I had to be loved.
00:15:38.13\00:15:40.82
I wanted so much to be loved.
00:15:40.85\00:15:42.52
That's so much pressure.
00:15:42.55\00:15:43.92
And Jesus didn't
give you that pressure.
00:15:43.95\00:15:45.96
God didn't give
you that pressure.
00:15:45.99\00:15:47.36
So when you said
that you were raised with,
00:15:47.39\00:15:50.12
you know, some of
that and that starts
00:15:50.15\00:15:53.40
kind of getting you through,
especially it had to get you
00:15:53.43\00:15:57.02
through some of those
teenage years, you know.
00:15:57.05\00:15:59.59
And so were you back
in church at that time?
00:15:59.62\00:16:02.00
Did you--did you come--
were you going to a building
00:16:02.03\00:16:04.99
or was it just kind
of what was left over
00:16:05.02\00:16:07.21
from being at
grandmother's house?
00:16:07.24\00:16:08.73
No, I was going.
00:16:08.76\00:16:10.13
There was a church--our church
00:16:10.16\00:16:11.59
was just about a
block or two away.
00:16:11.62\00:16:13.40
So I went there every
time the door was open.
00:16:13.43\00:16:15.56
And we had a wonderful pastor.
00:16:15.59\00:16:17.27
Did you talk to
anybody about this craziness?
00:16:17.30\00:16:19.90
It's like, you know,
to me I look at this child
00:16:19.93\00:16:22.63
and I think,
man, is there--nobody.
00:16:22.66\00:16:25.21
Nobody. Nobody had a clue.
00:16:25.24\00:16:27.17
Well, I think
there's a few of my friends
00:16:27.20\00:16:28.98
that came in when my
mother might be drunk
00:16:29.01\00:16:31.13
or something and that
was terribly embarrassing
00:16:31.16\00:16:33.54
if she's bouncing off the walls.
00:16:33.57\00:16:34.94
But, you know, you
downplayed all of that.
00:16:34.97\00:16:37.84
But what happened
was after college,
00:16:37.87\00:16:41.15
I think--when I went
to school I thought, man,
00:16:41.18\00:16:44.54
I love God to just take
care of myself, hallelujah.
00:16:44.57\00:16:46.94
And I was working
my way through school
00:16:46.97\00:16:49.91
and after school I
kind of went through
00:16:49.94\00:16:53.04
my little rebellious period when
I walked in the ways of world.
00:16:53.07\00:16:56.39
I can't even
imagine that, Shelley.
00:16:56.42\00:16:58.14
Don't even tell me that.
00:16:58.17\00:17:00.09
It's too much for me. Yeah.
00:17:00.12\00:17:02.43
But, you know, at the same time
00:17:02.46\00:17:03.83
and I've got-- I want to go back
00:17:03.86\00:17:05.52
and just say your
sister is jumping into drugs.
00:17:05.55\00:17:08.70
She's using--and she
really got lost in drugs.
00:17:08.73\00:17:11.29
So you've got that going on.
00:17:11.32\00:17:12.78
You went off to
college with that whole thing.
00:17:12.81\00:17:15.55
Mom is kind of doing better
because she is on medication.
00:17:15.58\00:17:19.00
She's staying on them longer.
00:17:19.03\00:17:20.40
Sister is not doing well
and now you're in college
00:17:20.43\00:17:22.59
just taking care of yourself.
00:17:22.62\00:17:23.99
Yeah, because I had
been my mother's mother
00:17:24.02\00:17:25.46
since I was 13 and I'd been
my--tried to be my sister's.
00:17:25.49\00:17:28.70
I tried to intervene and
tell them she is doing drugs.
00:17:28.73\00:17:31.73
Nobody would believe
me and I would catch her
00:17:31.76\00:17:34.07
so she and I had
a bad relationship
00:17:34.10\00:17:36.40
which the Lord
has totally mended.
00:17:36.43\00:17:39.10
You know, because my
sister, praise the Lord,
00:17:39.13\00:17:41.66
after over 15 years of doing--
what do they call, hard ball.
00:17:41.69\00:17:45.86
Well, but it was hard ball
where you combine the cocaine...
00:17:45.89\00:17:49.31
Speed balls, yeah. Speed balls,
00:17:49.34\00:17:50.72
where you combine this
cocaine and the heroin.
00:17:50.75\00:17:55.70
God delivered her
overnight, literally.
00:17:55.73\00:17:58.85
When she just said if
it's true what my sister says,
00:17:58.88\00:18:02.23
you know, that I can
come to you and say forgive me
00:18:02.26\00:18:05.57
and I can say Lord, I'm
tired of living like this
00:18:05.60\00:18:08.17
and fill me with
your Holy Spirit.
00:18:08.20\00:18:09.79
And He did.
00:18:09.82\00:18:11.30
And I mean she's been
drug free for 25 years.
00:18:11.33\00:18:14.22
I remember that whole
time that you were just saying
00:18:14.25\00:18:17.41
I don't know and is
she gonna survive this.
00:18:17.44\00:18:20.23
Oh, yeah. And now she is.
00:18:20.26\00:18:23.26
She's probably watching.
00:18:23.29\00:18:24.73
Yeah, she will be watching.
00:18:24.76\00:18:26.17
She loves this program.
00:18:26.20\00:18:27.75
I know she will be watching.
00:18:27.78\00:18:29.19
Just want to say
hi. And we're so close.
00:18:29.22\00:18:31.69
We talk everyday, you know.
00:18:31.72\00:18:33.62
But, you know, could
you imagine growing up,
00:18:33.65\00:18:36.22
she jumps into drugs.
00:18:36.25\00:18:37.62
She jumps into
all that kind of stuff
00:18:37.65\00:18:39.06
and she's looking at you as
the perfect sister, you know.
00:18:39.09\00:18:42.95
It's like what do you
think you are, you know,
00:18:42.98\00:18:44.72
and I could imagine for a
while just kind of pushing
00:18:44.75\00:18:48.36
you guys further
and further apart.
00:18:48.39\00:18:49.93
Well, and plus I
tried to police her.
00:18:49.96\00:18:52.29
You know, I tried to be the one
00:18:52.32\00:18:53.69
that was watching
what she was doing.
00:18:53.72\00:18:55.09
So yes, we were. We
were quite distanced.
00:18:55.12\00:18:59.92
But she knew she
could always call on me
00:18:59.95\00:19:02.09
if she needed help.
00:19:02.12\00:19:03.49
And I actually enabled
her for some years, you know,
00:19:03.52\00:19:05.41
thinking like
by paying her rent,
00:19:05.44\00:19:07.47
I'd keep her off the streets.
00:19:07.50\00:19:08.87
And I didn't realize I
was just--I was enabling her
00:19:08.90\00:19:11.76
to do more drugs and
spend her money on drugs
00:19:11.79\00:19:14.18
rather than paying her rent.
00:19:14.21\00:19:15.58
It is hard to know that
because it's hard to know
00:19:15.61\00:19:17.74
the difference
between loving somebody
00:19:17.77\00:19:19.35
and kind of allowing them
to stay in their lifestyle.
00:19:19.38\00:19:22.96
And when you pull
back it feels so cruel.
00:19:22.99\00:19:25.68
This sounds so
mean. What if she doesn't?
00:19:25.71\00:19:27.97
And, you know, we ask ourselves
00:19:28.00\00:19:29.71
all those questions
and I get calls like
00:19:29.74\00:19:32.05
that all the time is
what's the difference.
00:19:32.08\00:19:34.09
You know, tough love is
tough on the people who--
00:19:34.12\00:19:36.21
It's tougher on you guys, yeah.
00:19:36.24\00:19:38.44
But let me kind of
fast forward this because
00:19:38.47\00:19:40.68
my walk with the Lord
00:19:40.71\00:19:42.57
was kind of like
up the down escalator.
00:19:42.60\00:19:45.37
I would just go forward
with God and then I would stop
00:19:45.40\00:19:48.23
and then if you
don't keep progressing,
00:19:48.26\00:19:49.85
you find
yourself going back down.
00:19:49.88\00:19:51.50
Then I'd go forward with God.
00:19:51.53\00:19:53.67
So there was this
kind of roller coaster
00:19:53.70\00:19:55.54
Christian walk of mine.
00:19:55.57\00:19:57.32
And I met J.D.
Quinn and J.D. had been--
00:19:57.35\00:20:04.13
You know I love him. Oh, yeah.
00:20:04.16\00:20:06.36
Everybody--
everybody loves my husband.
00:20:06.39\00:20:08.50
Everybody does.
00:20:08.53\00:20:09.90
But he'd been brought up
as a Seventh-day Adventist.
00:20:09.93\00:20:12.29
But when I met him he
wasn't going to church.
00:20:12.32\00:20:15.56
And he'd been an
elder by the age of 21
00:20:15.59\00:20:18.35
but it was kind
of a cultural thing,
00:20:18.38\00:20:20.27
more than-- I mean somehow
00:20:20.30\00:20:21.96
it was rules
without relationship
00:20:21.99\00:20:24.50
and that always
results in rebellion.
00:20:24.53\00:20:26.17
So at age 25 he'd just
kind of quit going to church.
00:20:26.20\00:20:29.18
And he's good at
business. He was--
00:20:29.21\00:20:30.74
Oh, he was a great businessman
00:20:30.77\00:20:32.42
so he just kind of
evolved away from it.
00:20:32.45\00:20:34.61
And when we met I told him well,
00:20:34.64\00:20:36.05
I'm not gonna date anybody
that doesn't go to church.
00:20:36.08\00:20:38.40
So he started coming to
church with me and it was like,
00:20:38.43\00:20:41.28
wow, there's a lot of energy.
00:20:41.31\00:20:42.77
By this time I had studied
my way out of Church of Christ
00:20:42.80\00:20:45.49
into a non-denominational arena.
00:20:45.52\00:20:47.76
And he's going, wow,
there's a lot of energy
00:20:47.79\00:20:51.24
and this is interesting.
00:20:51.27\00:20:52.82
So we marry and very active
in the church, very active.
00:20:52.85\00:20:59.83
And J.D. went with me
all the time to church.
00:20:59.86\00:21:03.87
I didn't know till
just a few years ago
00:21:03.90\00:21:06.66
when they were
interviewing us on 3ABN
00:21:06.69\00:21:08.60
that all the time
he was feeling guilty
00:21:08.63\00:21:10.84
because he's going
to church on Sunday.
00:21:10.87\00:21:13.06
And that Sabbath
truth was in him.
00:21:13.09\00:21:16.45
But what happened was
I--God--I had an illness
00:21:16.48\00:21:23.46
in 1995 and that's when God
taught me the power of His Word.
00:21:23.49\00:21:28.25
I mean really, I'd
been so sick for 8 months
00:21:28.28\00:21:30.44
that my mother
tried to commit suicide
00:21:30.47\00:21:32.82
a number of times.
00:21:32.85\00:21:34.22
And I--you know,
you're always cleaning up
00:21:34.25\00:21:36.01
after that and
trying to save her.
00:21:36.04\00:21:38.02
And I got to the
point where finally
00:21:38.05\00:21:41.88
I'd been so sick for 8
months with just 24/7 vertigo.
00:21:41.91\00:21:46.87
I mean it
was--vertigo is that condition
00:21:46.90\00:21:49.06
where you feel like your
whole world twirling but mine--
00:21:49.09\00:21:51.81
And you couldn't even stand up.
00:21:51.84\00:21:53.21
I could hardly
stand up, you know.
00:21:53.24\00:21:56.25
And this had been 8 months.
00:21:56.28\00:21:57.74
You're nauseated. You can't eat.
00:21:57.77\00:21:59.23
You can't read the Bible.
00:21:59.26\00:22:00.63
I mean your eyes won't focus.
00:22:00.66\00:22:02.55
And God really impressed upon me
00:22:02.58\00:22:05.62
that His Word was life to me
00:22:05.65\00:22:08.42
and that I needed
to get into the Word
00:22:08.45\00:22:10.35
and trust His promises.
00:22:10.38\00:22:12.58
You know what I'd like to do,
00:22:12.61\00:22:14.02
because I know
where you're gonna go,
00:22:14.05\00:22:16.19
because I love
you and we're friends,
00:22:16.22\00:22:18.31
so I want to go to break,
00:22:18.34\00:22:20.68
come in to
start your second half
00:22:20.71\00:22:22.08
so we don't have to
interrupt any of this next part.
00:22:22.11\00:22:25.98
And so, you know, if you
want to hear the rest of it,
00:22:26.01\00:22:28.23
if you want to
hear what happened,
00:22:28.26\00:22:29.63
how God jumped
in, even how Shelley
00:22:29.66\00:22:32.92
survived this vertigo,
00:22:32.95\00:22:34.88
you're gonna have to come back.
00:22:34.91\00:22:36.37