Welcome to
Celebrating Life in Recovery,
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I'm Cheri your host.
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How about a 3-time
felon, is God bigger than that?
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Come join us we will find out.
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Welcome back!
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We are going to do the
program a little bit different
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because I want introduce
you to the guests right away
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because they
have so much to say.
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Not only in their recovery,
which I think is amazing,
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but in this season we are
looking at not only recovery
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but what God does with us.
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I want to start this
segment out with Jeremiah.
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Jeremiah, I don't
know what, but I love him,
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he's called like
the weeping prophet.
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And I'm thinking I don't
know why love him because
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usually love energy
and people in great moods,
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and Jeremiah the whole
time was saying you guys deal
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with your stuff
because you're a mess.
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And at that he went around
told everybody that even when
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somebody was saying no
it's not so bad and you guys are
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okay, he's like no, no,
no, deal with your stuff.
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I feel I like sometimes
I say that to people a lot,
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is deal with your stuff
because you're a mess and
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God really wants to
bring you to recovery.
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But in Jeremiah 18 there
was a part where God says
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to Jeremiah, and I love
this, Jeremiah I want you go
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to the Potters House, I
want you to check something
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out and I'm going to
speak to you through this.
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So Jeremiah is very
obedient so he goes to
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the Potters House.
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This is my take on it
when you read Jeremiah 18 it
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may not be exactly this,
but Jeremiah gets to Potters
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house and he's watching
the potter and he gets this
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piece of clay and he unfolds
it and puts it like, you know
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potters ball it up
and puts it on the wheel.
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As the wheel turns they
start forming the clay into
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whatever vessel they are
going to create with that.
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Jeremiah is looking at
this Potter, it's got be just
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fascinating, all the
sudden the Potters getting a
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little anxious,
and you can tell.
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He's trying to mold some
impurities out of this clay
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and he's pushing on it
moving it and doing all that
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kind of stuff and all of
a sudden realizes he can't
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get this impurity out.
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So he takes it down to
the clay again and makes a
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simpler vessel out of it.
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I'm like shut up because I don't
want to be as simple vessel.
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I don't know if you hear
me say that, I want to be
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incredibly,
spectacular, woman of God,
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used in every single way.
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And that only thing that
stops God from be enabled
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to do that is the fact
that we do not allow Him to
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work out of our lives
the things the devil and our
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circumstances have worked in.
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And so when God puts you
on the Potters wheel, don't
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whine, it's a gift and
as things come up to the
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surface, just like it does
when the Potter molds the clay,
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things come up to the
surface and the Potter
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literally moves that
junk out of the clay so He can
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continue to work with the clay.
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I'm telling you God's
intention is for you to be
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absolutely incredible.
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I'm going to introduce
you to our guests right now
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and God did the
same in you guy's life
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Rich and Susan
Kollenberg, right?... Rich: yes!
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And I know that God has
just blessed you, has had His
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hand on you, so I want
to say for one think you for
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being on the program and
they do so much for sharing
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your testimony with us.
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Rich: thank you for
having us we are very
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excited to be here.
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Cheri: when I looked at
you, because we usually dress
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a little casual and I
came in, in just T-shirt and a
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skirt and some flip-flops
and I looked it you guys
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and I thought somebody
didn't give you the message,
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this is casual.
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Rich: were coming to see
Cheri Peters so we wanted
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to look our very best.
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What is really interesting
to me is that out of most of the
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testimonies that I get
the privilege of bringing onto
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the program, I relate
to your guys as the most.
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So we are just going to start.
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So Rich can we start with
you, where did you come from
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and what got you at the edge.
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Rich: you know I
didn't wake up one morning and
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decide what I want to
be is an addict, no way.
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I had a little bit of
low esteem problem I think
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when I was in high school
and I strove to be the best
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at everything and
wanted everybody to like me.
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Cheri: and you were the best.
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Rich: I was the class
valedictorian, I was the senior
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class president, I had
all the stripes and big
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letters and all the
stuff that a good kid does.
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I was excepted to
several colleges and had some
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scholarships and stuff
and I didn't really want
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to go that route, I
just didn't want do that.
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The mistake was I did
nothing, I said I'd been
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studying and working
hard, I'm going kick back and
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just relax here for little bit.
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I went to work for a
Chevrolet dealership...
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Cheri: let me jump in,
so your family was lifting
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you up as far as academics,
kind of a normal family?
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Rich: yeah it was a secular
family we didn't have God
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in the house and they supported
me in everything I did.
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I was very musically inclined
so I was the head drummer
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in the stage band, marching band
the concert band, you name it,
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it was just go for
it, go for it, go for it!
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So my whole life became this
excel thing, push, push, push.
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Which wasn't a bad thing
I suppose but when you don't
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have God in your life
your motives are all skewed.
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Cheri: Or self-esteem,
if people don't really take
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into account, if
you're not feeling good about
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yourself and you are
realizing, do I have push like
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this my whole life.
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Rich: yeah and you know
you're looking back on it now I
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see what the problem was,
but when your in that kind of
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a life you are so caught
up in pushing and pushing and
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pushing and you don't realize
that that's your problem.
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Cheri: Exactly!
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So I got out of school and
did nothing, I went to work
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for Chevrolet dealership
and became a mechanic.
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I started drinking
and smoking with the boys.
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When I was in high
school I worked on the side
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pouring concrete so
after the mechanic thing I
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started pouring
concrete and got introduced to
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cocaine when I was
doing that, and I just kept
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graduating, graduating,
and graduating up to a
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worse and worse
state of existence.
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The funny thing is as I
look back on some of the
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things like the first
time I bought cocaine and
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I had a gun held to my head.
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Now you think that
would wake a guy up, you know
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this is not where you
need to be, but the thrill
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of the disobedience
and the thrill I guess of
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what I was doing.
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Stepping out on the
next fringe so to speak.
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Cheri: I'm really out here now.
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Rich: so maybe that outweighed
the logic, I don't know
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how it all shakes out.
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It was very dumb of me
to put myself in those types
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of positions and the
further out I got of course the
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weirder the positions
get, the weirder things get,
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and the more
dangerous they get and so you're
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constantly living
on the razors edge.
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As you look back on it now,
you say wow, how did I make it
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through that, how did
I make it through that.
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You make it through that
because God has His hand on
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you, even though
we rebel against Him,
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He loves us so much.
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I can look back and see
how He kept me out of jail
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and things like that and
just took care of me even
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though I was in total rebellion.
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Because He had a
plan for me and I don't
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know what it was.
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Cheri: exactly and I don't even
know as you said God kept me
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out of jail, I felt like
the Holy Spirit saying no
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I was trying to put him in jail.
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Rich: that's very possible.
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Cheri: Rich the very
fact and it's amazing to me
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when I look back on my
own testimony, or someone
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else's testimony, you can
see God's hand all the way
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through that and you
think I don't know where we
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got the idea that God
somehow walks away from us
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when we walk away from Him.
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I think if He did
we would all be dead,
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we wouldn't survive it.
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Rich: you know that poem
"Foot Prints", we all refer
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to it and everything but
when you look back especially
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if you are an addict
and look back on your life.
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Cheri: so tell the poem
for people who don't know what
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you're talking about.
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Rich: well you know it's
about the guy this crying out
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to God and he says God you
know I look back through my
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life and You said you are
always going to walk with me.
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Then I look back on the
sand and I only see one set
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of footprints...
Cheri: on my worst times.
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Rich: on my worst
times and where were you God.
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He says, well
that's when I carried you.
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That's when I
carried you, and that's what
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He's done for us.
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Cheri: you are out there
using, not even realizing
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how far out
there you had gotten.
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Rich: yeah I'm using and
going through all of these
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bizarre situations
and they become normal.
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They become normal life.
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They become... Cheri: in fact
normal life becomes bizarre!
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Rich: exactly!... Cheri:
I can't stand to be around
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people that are just
hanging out, just laughing.
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just being with
family how boring is that?
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Rich: it's just a
very miserable existence.
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So I got involved in
cocaine for about 10 years.
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Cheri: when you say that,
unless you have been there,
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you just think, 10
years of your poor liver,
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when you said
that my liver dried up.
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It shrank a little bit,
do you know what I mean?
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Rich: I remember laying
in bed at night with my heart
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pounding so hard like it
was going to blow out of my
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chest and I would
make deals with God.
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Even when I look back
now, I had talked to Him...
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Cheri: I You
keep me alive tonight.
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Rich: I will never do it
again, just get me through
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tonight and the
heart is just blowing up.
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The next morning I
would feel so horrible, right?
00:10:02.50\00:10:06.78
And then the next afternoon
just have a drink and the
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next thing you
know it was on again.
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Cheri: and what about you
folks, the people that love
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you how were they handling
this 10 years of addiction.
00:10:15.33\00:10:18.19
This is the interesting
thing, in this whole period of
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my addiction, which was
about 24 years, towards the
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end I lived about 20 minutes
from my mother and father,
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they had got split up, but
between both of them I lived
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about 20 minutes away from them.
00:10:31.74\00:10:33.29
I saw them twice a year,
Thanksgiving and Christmas,
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that was it.
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Cheri: so you
had to cut them off.
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Yeah I just didn't want to
deal with the fact that I knew I
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was doing wrong things, I
just wanted to with the fact
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that they were going to
have to talk to me about it.
00:10:46.04\00:10:48.43
I was just
hiding from everything.
00:10:48.47\00:10:50.11
So my dad I would actually
go by his house and hope he
00:10:50.15\00:10:53.79
wasn't there so I can
leave him a note, put it there
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and take off and think
that's good for a couple months.
00:10:57.48\00:11:00.81
Cheri: right just to
let them know I'm alive.
00:11:00.85\00:11:02.92
Just to let them know I'm
alive and it frustrated them.
00:11:02.96\00:11:06.74
I'm going to ask you a
question that I know some people
00:11:06.77\00:11:10.52
just hate for me to
ask, but during that time,
00:11:10.55\00:11:12.87
that 10 years where
you're slipping notes to your
00:11:12.91\00:11:15.53
father where they
don't even know half the time
00:11:15.56\00:11:18.15
if you're dead or alive.
00:11:18.18\00:11:19.56
You're strung out with
Coke and all the other stuff
00:11:19.60\00:11:23.85
that comes with that, can
you explain what got tweaked
00:11:23.89\00:11:27.25
in your personality, because
some people think it's I'm
00:11:27.28\00:11:30.44
just doing drugs not
realizing there is a huge amount
00:11:30.48\00:11:33.61
of who we are, our character.
00:11:33.64\00:11:35.26
Rich: you know it's
interesting because of course as
00:11:35.30\00:11:38.76
you look back and see all
the decisions that you make
00:11:38.80\00:11:42.11
as you stepped out on the
edge, as I stepped out on the
00:11:42.15\00:11:45.43
edge, and did something
a little bit different.
00:11:45.46\00:11:48.57
I would all of a
sudden give myself a stamp of
00:11:48.61\00:11:51.65
of approval now to do that
behavior once I did it one time.
00:11:51.69\00:11:54.37
When you learned how
to lie your head off.
00:11:54.40\00:11:56.06
Rich: exactly, you actually
claim you didn't never lied,
00:11:56.09\00:11:59.79
you never lied you
would make those claims.
00:11:59.82\00:12:02.34
Cheri: I'm honest.
00:12:02.37\00:12:03.40
Rich: I'm an honest guy and you
would be offended, of course,
00:12:03.43\00:12:05.01
if someone called
you a liar naturally.
00:12:05.04\00:12:07.15
Cheri: Somebody said, how do
you know they're lying because
00:12:07.18\00:12:09.09
they open their mouth.
00:12:09.13\00:12:10.24
Rich: yeah exactly!
Only your lips are moving.
00:12:10.28\00:12:12.69
And even in that lifestyle,
everything becomes who you
00:12:12.73\00:12:16.54
can con and who you can
manipulate and who you can lie.
00:12:16.57\00:12:20.68
The truth is weird in
that lifestyle, it's unnatural.
00:12:20.71\00:12:24.04
Rich: exactly so you live
in this fantasy world that
00:12:24.08\00:12:27.11
everything is okay, but
you have given everything a
00:12:27.14\00:12:29.76
stamp of approval as you
move out farther and farther
00:12:29.79\00:12:32.37
and farther, so
it's okay in your mind,
00:12:32.40\00:12:34.26
but really at one point in
time you knew it wasn't okay.
00:12:34.29\00:12:37.15
Cheri: sexually!
00:12:37.18\00:12:38.21
Rich: same thing, you
just do everything perverted,
00:12:38.24\00:12:41.39
everything is perverted.
00:12:41.42\00:12:43.39
Cheri: you know to me,
one time in my recovery,
00:12:43.42\00:12:46.47
I came upon a
statement of Ellen White's,
00:12:46.50\00:12:49.67
where she talked
about cultivated sins,
00:12:49.70\00:12:52.83
natural and cultivated sins.
00:12:52.87\00:12:55.08
And I thought I can't
even tell you what I learned to
00:12:55.12\00:13:00.01
be drawn to in that lifestyle,
so I am glad that that
00:13:00.05\00:13:04.90
was brought out so it
is not just the drugs,
00:13:04.94\00:13:07.29
it's not just that you
learn to lie and steal and you
00:13:07.32\00:13:12.20
learn to tweak your
character and your mind so
00:13:12.23\00:13:14.85
where you are
not the same person.
00:13:14.88\00:13:17.90
Rich: exactly, even your
surroundings because after
00:13:17.93\00:13:20.77
I did cocaine I got into
methamphetamine and did that
00:13:20.81\00:13:23.61
for about 10 years.
00:13:23.65\00:13:24.68
Cheri: so what's the
difference between Coke and Meth
00:13:24.71\00:13:26.52
for the people that
don't know, even in lifestyle?
00:13:26.55\00:13:30.28
Methamphetamine to me,
well once I start smoking it,
00:13:30.31\00:13:34.00
to tell you the difference.
00:13:34.04\00:13:35.74
I can't really describe a
difference in my response to
00:13:35.78\00:13:40.05
it because I knew when I
first tried coke that was the
00:13:40.09\00:13:44.33
answer to all my problems.
00:13:44.36\00:13:45.72
I had gotten so far in it
that it no longer did what
00:13:45.76\00:13:51.07
it needed to do.
00:13:51.11\00:13:52.22
So then when I tried
smoking crank that became the
00:13:52.25\00:13:56.05
answer to all my problems.
00:13:56.09\00:13:57.64
That's all I was interested
in was my drug choice was
00:13:57.67\00:14:00.16
more, it didn't really
matter what it was, what ever it
00:14:00.19\00:14:03.79
was to get me where I
needed to be, to self medicate,
00:14:03.83\00:14:07.40
to keep me away from reality.
00:14:07.43\00:14:09.21
Cheri: what is really
interesting a lot of people will
00:14:09.25\00:14:11.89
go from Coke which is socially
acceptable drugs, you are
00:14:11.93\00:14:14.70
still staying involved in
sometimes social situations.
00:14:14.74\00:14:18.02
Meth and crank, you are
off, you are psychotic, you can
00:14:18.05\00:14:21.30
get delusional, you're paranoid.
00:14:21.33\00:14:23.13
I mean it literally takes
you out even being able to
00:14:23.16\00:14:26.55
step into a social
realm, you're out of that.
00:14:26.59\00:14:28.74
Rich: yeah this
is what happened.
00:14:28.77\00:14:29.86
I started getting more
and more removed from society.
00:14:29.90\00:14:33.28
The whole time you
are saying this is okay,
00:14:33.31\00:14:37.85
because the drug...
00:14:37.89\00:14:39.08
Cheri: this is what I want.
00:14:39.12\00:14:40.15
Rich: this is what I
want, this is what I need.
00:14:40.18\00:14:41.65
People ask me why
don't you ever quit and
00:14:41.68\00:14:43.23
I would say why?
00:14:43.26\00:14:44.29
I couldn't see how bad
I was living, so now I'm
00:14:44.32\00:14:47.42
living in downtown
Sacramento in a little one-room
00:14:47.45\00:14:51.04
shack with a dirt floor
with the chemicals to cook
00:14:51.07\00:14:54.06
the methamphetamine
buried underneath were I slept.
00:14:54.09\00:14:57.04
I don't want
anybody to get to it.
00:14:57.07\00:14:58.18
Cheri: You don't
want anybody to steal it.
00:14:58.21\00:14:59.73
Not thinking
what if this blows up.
00:14:59.76\00:15:02.20
Rich: anything, you
know logic is thrown out the
00:15:02.23\00:15:05.66
window just so that we
can get into our bodies what
00:15:05.69\00:15:09.46
ever it is we need to
have in there so we can escape.
00:15:09.49\00:15:13.54
Cheri: so in that when we
followed you through that where
00:15:13.58\00:15:17.60
did you guys meet Susan?
00:15:17.63\00:15:19.11
Susan: we met after
we both started doing
00:15:19.14\00:15:21.64
methamphetamine.
00:15:21.68\00:15:22.75
Cheri: so in that
one-room shack was your home?
00:15:22.79\00:15:26.83
Susan: no we never, I
don't know what was we were
00:15:26.87\00:15:30.28
a couple but we kept
separate I think it was because
00:15:30.32\00:15:33.35
he was more of a loner,
but we were great friends
00:15:33.39\00:15:36.17
and great partners
because all we wanted to do is
00:15:36.21\00:15:38.59
to get and use drugs
that was our goal in life.
00:15:38.63\00:15:41.21
Cheri: so where did you
come from, because we heard
00:15:41.24\00:15:43.78
were he came from, a
normal family and all
00:15:43.82\00:15:45.99
that kind of stuff?
00:15:46.02\00:15:47.05
Susan: as normal as it
can be, I look back now and I
00:15:47.08\00:15:49.43
know that my mom and dad
did the very best they could.
00:15:49.46\00:15:52.17
I was sexually molested
when I was younger for many
00:15:52.20\00:15:54.84
years, and at the age of 10
I start smoking and drinking
00:15:54.87\00:15:59.14
because that is what
covered up that big dark hole
00:15:59.18\00:16:02.82
I had inside of me.
00:16:02.86\00:16:04.62
Cheri: that
shame, you're not normal.
00:16:04.66\00:16:06.25
Susan: Right, because I
knew I would never be like any
00:16:06.29\00:16:07.82
other girl I had
ever come in contact with.
00:16:07.85\00:16:10.08
I was dirty, I was not
worthy to be loved and so
00:16:10.12\00:16:13.39
if I could just be
someone other than who I was
00:16:13.43\00:16:16.67
then I was okay.
00:16:16.71\00:16:18.52
Cheri: don't you, to me
my heart breaks when you hear
00:16:18.55\00:16:22.69
somebody say I
decided that at 10?
00:16:22.73\00:16:24.98
And I want to say just one
thing, probably the decision
00:16:25.02\00:16:28.15
wasn't at 10, but you had
probably decided that years
00:16:28.18\00:16:31.28
before, the
decision to use at 10,
00:16:31.31\00:16:33.60
the decision to escape
was at 10. Susan: right!
00:16:33.63\00:16:36.35
Cheri: and it works!
00:16:36.38\00:16:38.64
Susan: it did for a time,
it did so by the time I was in
00:16:38.67\00:16:42.24
eighth grade, well the
time I was in sixth grade I had
00:16:42.27\00:16:45.80
started smoking pot.
00:16:45.83\00:16:46.86
By the time I was in
eighth grade I started using
00:16:46.89\00:16:48.51
cocaine, sophomore in high
school every other weekend by
00:16:48.54\00:16:51.35
the time I was a senior I
was using it every day and
00:16:51.38\00:16:54.16
then I had my first arrest.
00:16:54.19\00:16:56.41
Cheri: as a
senior in high school?
00:16:56.44\00:16:58.59
Susan: yes, just
got out of high school.
00:16:58.62\00:17:00.13
Cheri: for
drugs... Susan: correct!
00:17:00.16\00:17:01.30
I sold an ounce of cocaine
to an uncover police officer.
00:17:01.34\00:17:06.63
Cheri: so as that unfolded
you went from Coke, how did
00:17:06.66\00:17:11.92
Meth come into the picture?
00:17:11.95\00:17:13.19
Susan: the same thing I
tried to do geographical
00:17:13.22\00:17:15.59
because I figured if
I could just get away...
00:17:15.62\00:17:18.00
Cheri: So nobody knows
what a geographical is.
00:17:18.03\00:17:20.47
It's funny you said
that, because I mean an addict
00:17:20.51\00:17:23.41
is like oh yeah, okay
go ahead, normal people are
00:17:23.45\00:17:26.32
not going to
know what that means.
00:17:26.35\00:17:27.39
Susan: if I just move to
someplace where nobody knew who
00:17:27.43\00:17:30.80
I was, if they didn't know
I had just gotten arrested.
00:17:30.84\00:17:33.77
The town I grew up was a
very small town and my father
00:17:33.80\00:17:36.69
had worked there, the
family is very well known, if I
00:17:36.73\00:17:39.51
could just get away from my
surroundings and the people.
00:17:39.54\00:17:42.26
It's the people I hang out
with and there is a problem.
00:17:42.29\00:17:45.02
It's the cops that
busted me, had they just left me
00:17:45.05\00:17:47.39
alone, to let me do what I
wanted to do then everything
00:17:47.42\00:17:49.73
would have been okay.
00:17:49.76\00:17:50.79
So I moved to Hawaii for
five and one half years, and the
00:17:50.82\00:17:54.35
very first person I
met was a drug dealer.
00:17:54.38\00:17:56.56
Cheri: because for a
lot of druggies is we don't
00:17:56.59\00:18:00.86
see anybody but dealers
or people that are like us.
00:18:00.90\00:18:04.24
You can see the
craziness or the chaos in their
00:18:04.27\00:18:07.46
life or in their eyes
and were drawn to each other.
00:18:07.50\00:18:10.65
Until we literally
choose recovery we are
00:18:10.69\00:18:13.25
drawn to one another.
00:18:13.29\00:18:14.61
Susan: I always wondered,
you know I went through
00:18:14.65\00:18:18.60
physical abuse, to smoking,
crack, cocaine and I went
00:18:18.63\00:18:22.55
to get help and I said, can
you help me change this person,
00:18:22.59\00:18:25.93
I don't know why
he is hitting me.
00:18:25.96\00:18:27.50
He said to me you know
you are an addict and you
00:18:27.53\00:18:29.63
need help, and I said
what are you talking about
00:18:29.67\00:18:32.08
you know I don't need
that and I finally ended up
00:18:32.11\00:18:34.45
coming back to the states
because I ran out everything
00:18:34.49\00:18:37.91
in Hawaii and came back.
00:18:37.95\00:18:39.19
A family member was
doing crank and that's
00:18:39.22\00:18:41.87
how I started doing that.
00:18:41.91\00:18:43.24
Cheri: so you
start using Meth...
00:18:43.27\00:18:45.39
Susan: starting using
Meth for about 10 years and
00:18:45.43\00:18:49.39
I am a 3 time felon,
so I'm in an out of jail.
00:18:49.42\00:18:53.35
Cheri: all drug charges - yeah!
00:18:53.39\00:18:55.93
The last time I was
arrested my father was the Mayor
00:18:55.96\00:18:59.20
of the city I grew up in
and it was the biggest bust
00:18:59.24\00:19:02.56
in that county and there
were a lot of weapons there.
00:19:02.60\00:19:05.66
I had never held a gun
before, but they charged me
00:19:05.69\00:19:08.57
with that so I have a
bunch of enhancements and all
00:19:08.61\00:19:11.45
different kinds of things.
00:19:11.49\00:19:12.60
Cheri: another thing,
people that are in a normal
00:19:12.64\00:19:15.34
background, is that it
is part of the lifestyle.
00:19:15.37\00:19:18.00
I mean you are cooking Meth,
you've got people in and out,
00:19:18.04\00:19:20.87
there's guns everywhere
and it doesn't even bother you.
00:19:20.90\00:19:23.88
I remember at times
having somebody so paranoid that
00:19:23.91\00:19:26.62
they would take a gun
and go in the backyard and
00:19:26.66\00:19:28.97
decide they are going
to watch because they knew
00:19:29.01\00:19:31.29
for sure the FBI was after us.
00:19:31.33\00:19:32.78
They would stay all night
long in a crouched position
00:19:32.82\00:19:35.65
with a gun and wait
for anybody to show up.
00:19:35.69\00:19:37.71
I'm think of the fact
that most of us don't end up
00:19:37.75\00:19:41.73
killing somebody is
miraculous, but at that time I
00:19:41.76\00:19:44.87
want you to explain
cooking Meth, being in that
00:19:44.91\00:19:47.99
lifestyle what is that like?
00:19:48.02\00:19:50.09
Rich: the thing is...
00:19:50.13\00:19:52.05
Susan: well for me you
cannot wake up in the morning
00:19:52.09\00:19:56.64
or go to sleep at night
unless you have enough to wake
00:19:56.68\00:20:01.20
up and enough to go to sleep.
00:20:01.24\00:20:03.38
You have got to make
sure, I mean we stay up till
00:20:03.41\00:20:05.87
3-4 in the morning waiting
for someone to call us so
00:20:05.91\00:20:08.30
we can go and make sure
that we had enough drugs
00:20:08.33\00:20:10.68
so we could wake
up the next morning.
00:20:10.72\00:20:12.83
That's how bad it was.
00:20:12.86\00:20:14.14
Cheri: because if
you didn't have them...
00:20:14.17\00:20:15.46
Susan: we couldn't function.
00:20:15.50\00:20:16.69
Rich: you couldn't function.
00:20:16.73\00:20:17.86
I would drive
around, I had a work truck,
00:20:17.89\00:20:20.02
I was still pouring concrete.
00:20:20.05\00:20:21.38
Somehow I manage to
continue some form of employment
00:20:21.41\00:20:25.27
and I could remember, I
had all the chemicals in the
00:20:25.30\00:20:28.81
back of the truck and I
was driving around working,
00:20:28.85\00:20:32.68
and if you get caught
with that kind of stuff it's a
00:20:32.71\00:20:36.51
pretty bad situation.
00:20:36.55\00:20:40.13
Cheri: just for
people, we're going to get into
00:20:40.17\00:20:43.38
this little bit more,
next segment, but chemically
00:20:43.41\00:20:46.52
you have gotten yourself
so tweaked that you really
00:20:46.55\00:20:49.62
are not feeling
normal unless you can jack
00:20:49.66\00:20:52.56
up all those chemicals.
00:20:52.59\00:20:53.80
Rich: exactly, yeah!
00:20:53.84\00:20:54.97
Cheri: so you're making sure you
had enough get up in the morning
00:20:55.01\00:20:58.76
Susan: had enough to
get up in the morning.
00:20:58.80\00:21:00.51
Cheri: What is the longest
that you ever stayed awake?
00:21:00.55\00:21:03.89
Susan: probably
2 weeks straight.
00:21:03.92\00:21:08.55
Cheri: frying literally stuffing
yourself full of whatever drug
00:21:08.59\00:21:13.45
is in front of you.
Susan and Rich: Right!
00:21:13.49\00:21:14.52
Susan: whatever drug because
then you would cook it and
00:21:14.55\00:21:17.18
it probably really
wasn't crank but you went ahead
00:21:17.21\00:21:19.91
and did it
anyway, thinking it was.
00:21:19.94\00:21:21.73
Cheri: so you know, and to
me, again, I don't think anyone,
00:21:21.77\00:21:27.17
unless you are there,
understands the craziness that
00:21:27.21\00:21:30.65
a week of being awake,
what two weeks of being
00:21:30.69\00:21:34.48
awake looks like, what
your teeth look like, what your
00:21:34.51\00:21:38.00
skin looks like, what
your brain looks like, how it
00:21:38.04\00:21:41.49
processes information,
although things were so crazy.
00:21:41.53\00:21:45.67
Man, I'm thinking all
this craziness, I'm serious,
00:21:45.70\00:21:49.81
my body hurts for
you guys right now.
00:21:49.84\00:21:52.09
And so your living
environment you guys meet
00:21:52.12\00:21:56.23
and decide to date.
00:21:56.26\00:21:57.76
Rich: if you call it
dating, yeah one common goal
00:21:57.80\00:22:01.11
getting to use drugs, it
didn't matter if we had to
00:22:01.14\00:22:03.93
drive from Sacramento
to San Jose in the middle
00:22:03.96\00:22:06.72
of the night to
get drugs or whatever
00:22:06.75\00:22:08.79
it took that was the goal.
00:22:08.82\00:22:10.55
Susan: and you asked a
question from Rich earlier
00:22:10.59\00:22:13.13
you know what else goes
along with the lifestyle.
00:22:13.17\00:22:16.52
That probably was the
hardest, I did everything I had
00:22:16.56\00:22:20.20
to do in order to use
drugs, no matter what it was.
00:22:20.23\00:22:23.84
Whether it was
stealing, I put my parents
00:22:23.87\00:22:26.98
through a lot of stealing...
00:22:27.01\00:22:28.42
Cheri: taking
everything they own.
00:22:28.45\00:22:29.84
Susan:
everything... Cheri: pawned it!
00:22:29.88\00:22:30.91
Whatever I had to do with
the opposite sex, hang out with
00:22:30.94\00:22:37.81
whoever I needed
to hang out with.
00:22:37.84\00:22:39.09
Dressed a specific
way to try to attract
00:22:39.12\00:22:41.42
just immoral things.
00:22:41.46\00:22:44.28
Cheri: that is a part of
the lifestyle, and a very
00:22:44.32\00:22:47.99
natural part of the lifestyle,
in fact if you were not
00:22:48.03\00:22:51.64
doing that you would
actually stand out because it's
00:22:51.68\00:22:55.26
like what do you mean.
00:22:55.29\00:22:56.34
Of course you're going
to play some one, of course
00:22:56.38\00:22:58.72
you're going to sexually get
tweaked and the anger and the
00:22:58.75\00:23:03.30
rage is amazing to
me in that lifestyle,
00:23:03.34\00:23:06.73
did you ever feel that?
00:23:06.76\00:23:08.01
Susan: no I don't think I
was a real angry drug user.
00:23:08.04\00:23:13.43
Rich: no we did not
have nice things to say about
00:23:13.47\00:23:18.82
people that is for sure.
00:23:18.86\00:23:20.34
Susan: but we hung around
people who were really angry.
00:23:20.38\00:23:23.85
oh yeah...
00:23:23.88\00:23:25.50
Cheri: because they
would put holes in walls.
00:23:25.54\00:23:26.70
Susan: oh yeah!
00:23:26.74\00:23:27.77
Cheri: and totally
flipped out, I just remember the
00:23:27.80\00:23:30.02
rage and then again I
don't think I was into that
00:23:30.06\00:23:33.01
too much but I can remember
with Meth addicts the rage
00:23:33.04\00:23:35.68
was unbelievable, the
anger that would all of a sudden
00:23:35.72\00:23:38.78
come up in the next
statement would be and so what
00:23:38.82\00:23:41.85
are we going to do?
00:23:41.88\00:23:42.91
And I'm like, do realize
you just killed that person,
00:23:42.94\00:23:45.89
I mean it's like it didn't
matter, what are we going to do
00:23:45.92\00:23:48.52
later on tonight?
00:23:48.55\00:23:49.58
Rich: and the filth, the
filth I would sleep for days
00:23:49.61\00:23:53.20
when I didn't have the
drugs, with my shoes on.
00:23:53.23\00:23:56.65
I wouldn't shower for
days and even if I was on the
00:23:56.69\00:24:00.38
drugs, I would go in
the same clothes for days.
00:24:00.41\00:24:04.07
I don't how
people put up with me...
00:24:04.10\00:24:06.87
Susan: and the diet,
the non-diet, we didn't eat,
00:24:06.90\00:24:11.52
we didn't drink
water, we were just a mess.
00:24:11.55\00:24:14.60
Cheri: if I were
starving I would get Hostess
00:24:14.63\00:24:17.61
Twinkies and butter, and
put butter on the Hostess
00:24:17.64\00:24:20.02
Twinkies and put them in
the oven and that was like
00:24:20.06\00:24:22.41
a good meal to me.
00:24:22.44\00:24:23.79
Rich: yeah you know
it reminds me of a story.
00:24:23.83\00:24:27.42
One time I was starving
and I had just come down
00:24:27.46\00:24:31.02
off of crank.
00:24:31.05\00:24:32.45
I had gotten up in the
morning and I was so hungry, I
00:24:32.48\00:24:37.13
hadn't eaten in
probably a week and a half.
00:24:37.17\00:24:39.77
There was a lucky store
right across the street...
00:24:39.80\00:24:42.29
Cheri: how
about drinking fluids?
00:24:42.32\00:24:44.08
Rich: no you don't
drink, you're so dry.
00:24:44.11\00:24:47.01
Cheri: I just want to
get a picture for people
00:24:47.05\00:24:49.26
because you don't
drink, you don't eat, your body
00:24:49.30\00:24:51.48
just, I can't even
believe we survive it.
00:24:51.51\00:24:53.94
Rich: so I'm starving, I
go down to my truck, it's an
00:24:53.97\00:24:59.02
old beat-up truck and it's got
this change, you know you have
00:24:59.05\00:25:02.45
stashes where you have a little
bit of change here and there.
00:25:02.48\00:25:05.84
I'm almost tearing the
seat out of this truck to get
00:25:05.88\00:25:08.84
enough change to go over
there so I can buy one of
00:25:08.87\00:25:13.24
them Stouffer's four
cheese lasagna, and I eat one of
00:25:13.28\00:25:17.61
those about every 2 weeks.
00:25:17.65\00:25:18.97
So I get enough change
to go down there and I walk
00:25:19.01\00:25:22.49
across the street and I
go in and I walked past the
00:25:22.52\00:25:25.92
cigarettes and I start
looking at the cigarettes.
00:25:25.96\00:25:28.94
I don't have any cigarettes
either, and I look over
00:25:28.98\00:25:31.93
at the food and I
buy the cigarettes.
00:25:31.96\00:25:34.77
Cheri: We are going to
go ahead and take a break,
00:25:34.80\00:25:38.24
but sometimes when we
meet people, and some of you
00:25:38.28\00:25:41.68
are in this place,
were you think that
00:25:41.72\00:25:44.44
God even can't get here.
00:25:44.48\00:25:46.02
God can't even get
through this, and I just want
00:25:46.06\00:25:49.60
to say not true.
00:25:49.64\00:25:51.15
And that is the most
amazing thing, we can take
00:25:51.18\00:25:54.06
ourselves to such destructive
places, and if you are
00:25:54.10\00:25:57.00
sitting out there smiling
and you haven't gone through
00:25:57.03\00:26:00.15
Meth, sometimes destructive
places for us that are
00:26:00.19\00:26:03.27
more normal, they
just don't look as bad.
00:26:03.31\00:26:05.53
But they are as bad, they
are infested with junk, somebody
00:26:05.56\00:26:09.73
that is a perfectionist,
or a religious addiction
00:26:09.77\00:26:12.87
or something that
is a spend-a-holic,
00:26:12.90\00:26:14.69
I'm telling you it's
the same and God knows where
00:26:14.73\00:26:17.48
you're at and can bring you out.
00:26:17.52\00:26:18.86
So we are going to come
back and find out what did God
00:26:18.90\00:26:20.83
do with these guys, oh man!
00:26:20.86\00:26:22.70
Stay with us will be right back!
00:26:22.74\00:26:24.54