I'd like to welcome
you to Battles of Faith.
00:00:14.80\00:00:16.32
My name is David Shin and
I'm here with Steve Wohlberg,
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who's the Speaker/Director
of White Horse Media, and we've
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been delving into the
supernatural from the Biblical
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perspective, and the
title of this series is
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"Magic, Ghosts and the Bible."
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"Potter Mania" is the
topic we're going to study today
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and it's a subject that's loved
and hated. But before we get
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into that why don't we set
the stage a little bit for our
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viewing audience that has just
joined us at this time about
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what we've been
talking about up to this point.
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Sure David, we're going
to be discussing Potter mania
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and the Potter controversy.
It's no secret that the Harry
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Potter books have been read
and are loved around the world.
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We're going to put up just
quickly on the screen a cover
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of a fairly recent issue
of time magazine, and these
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articles have been
duplicated around the world,
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they've been covered on
major news networks all over
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planet earth. That particular
issue, you see a picture
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of all these young people
with Harry Potter type glasses,
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the feature story says "Why
Harry Potter Rules", and inside
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that issue there's a quotation
that says J. K. Rowling has
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mesmerized an entire generation
of kids with her story
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chronicling the adventures of
a boy wizard named Harry Potter,
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who goes to a school called
"Hogwarts School of Witchcraft"
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"and Wizardry", and
develops his magical abilities.
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There's actually 7 books in the
entire series, these are novels,
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these are fantasy books
that started out with a book
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called "Harry Potter and
the Sorcerer's Stone", and go
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all the way through to the
final book, the grand conclusion
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called "Harry Potter
and the Deathly Hallows."
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These books have sold
approximately 300 million copies
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around the world.
Warner Brothers has committed,
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this is the legendary film
maker, to making every Harry
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Potter book into a feature
length, high budget film.
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And not only the books,
but movies are being watched
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around the world by kids
young and old, black and white,
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brown, yellow, red...every
skin color, every language
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practically. I mean,
Harry Potter is known, he's as
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known as any boy has ever
been. As I mentioned the last
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book, "Harry Potter and
the Deathly Hallows" released
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July 21, 2007, the photograph
on the screen is actually
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a pre-press copy of the
final book, before the cover was
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designed, but it's just amazing.
The first book that came out,
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"Harry Potter and the
Sorcerer's Stone", the publisher
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"Scholastic" printed
approximately 250,000 books
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for the first print run
and then as you go on each book
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has gotten bigger, and they
printed more, and the last book,
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"Harry Potter and the Deathly
Hallows", they printed a record
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12 millions, which is...there's
never been anything like it
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in publishing history. For
a hard cover book it's just
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number 1. No other hard cover
book in history has ever printed
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12 million copies for the first
print run. So, like I said,
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kids around the world are
reading Harry Potter and there
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is a tremendous controversy
going on about whether these
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books are just fun, just
fantasy, there's just nothing
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to worry about. To Christians
that are concerned people say
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"Hey, lighten up, just
lighten up and shut up, there's"
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"nothing wrong with Harry
Potter, it's just a story."
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And then there are other people,
a lot of people actually,
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that are very concerned that
these books are desensitizing
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this generation, especially
young people, to the dangers
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of the occult, and are creating
interest in real witchcraft.
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So that's the controversy,
is Harry Potter leading towards
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magic or is it just a fun
story? Is there a menace behind
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- the magic? That's the issue.
- I've read a little bit about
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J. K. Rowling and it's a
classic story of rags to riches.
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She was on welfare, living in
England, single parent and she
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was on the subway one day
and it says in her own account
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that the figure of Harry Potter
just walked into her mind...
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- Strolled right into her
head. - And rags to riches,
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she's arguably one of the
richest women in our world
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- because of this book. -
That's right, she's comparable
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to Oprah, she's richer
than the Queen of England.
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You're right, rags to riches.
She actually submitted her
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manuscript to a number of
publishers and they rejected it.
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Finally Scholastic got a
hold of it, and it just took off
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from there, and there are
many people that wonder whether
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there's some kind of
supernatural force that is
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behind the incredible
mega popularity of this series.
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I'd like to read just a number
of quick quotes here before we
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get farther in concerning
the influence of stories.
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Here's a man named Howard Pile,
he's a writer and illustrator,
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and he made a classic comment.
He said "The stories of"
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"childhood leave an indelible
impression, and their author"
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"always has a niche
in the temple of memory."
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Childhood stories have an
influence, they affect people's
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lives. Here's another quote
from E.N. Kirk, another classic
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quote, he said "It has not
been the Devil's policy to keep"
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"the masses of mankind in
ignorance, but finding that"
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"they will read he is doing
all in his power to poison"
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"their books. ",
quite a statement.
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Books definitely do have an
influence on people's lives,
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so what about Harry Potter?
This is our time to really deal
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with this controversial subject.
One of the biggest issues is:
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is Harry Potter contributing to
the craze, the explosive growth
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of real witchcraft in
our world? I think it's
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significant, David, that
people that are watching this,
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that you keep in mind that we
not only have the Potter track,
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the fantasy story about a boy
wizard, along with all the other
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TV programs, like "Sabrina,"
and the "Charmed" series
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that are fiction, but at
the same time right on the other
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track we have the growth of
real witchcraft in our world
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which we've been discussing here
on Battles of Faith for the last
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so many programs. So
we've got 2 things going on,
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we've got fantasy about
witchcraft growing, and then
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we've got real witchcraft
growing at the same time,
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and the question
is: are they connected?
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Is one feeding the other?
Let me share with you a very
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interesting document, I'm not
going to go all details where
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I got this document, but this
is actually a press release.
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It was released on the PR
web, and it was put out by
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the president of the witchcraft
school, a real witchcraft
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school that teaches
young people, young and old,
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how to practice the craft.
And the title of this press
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release is called "Witchcraft
and Wicca, the heart of"
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"the Harry Potter Controversy".
Keep in mind, this is coming
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from people that are practicing
real witchcraft, this is their
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perspective. It says "The Harry
Potter has become a record"
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"breaking phenomenon and is the
21st century's opening fairy"
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"tale. Within the pages of J.
K. Rowling's books she created"
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"a world of wizards and witches,
and she unwittingly exposed"
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"the fastest growing
religion in America to hundreds"
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"of millions of people.
This faith is called 'Wicca', "
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"and its members are
witches. It is at the core of"
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"the controversy that
Hogwarts school has created".
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Here's a little bit more:
"In 1997 a young mother wrote"
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"a book called 'Harry Potter
and the Philosopher's Stone' "
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"and it was published. Little
did she know, nor could she"
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"have imagined how much
the world needed Harry Potter"
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"and his wonderful story. J.
K. Rowling created a phenomena"
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"that brought magic to the
forefront of human thought"
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"and unwittingly reopened a
new round of an ancient battle"
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"between witchcraft and
Christianity". Then this press
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release says that "Harry Potter
has rekindled interests in"
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"beliefs that were already
growing in the UK and the US"
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"for more than 50 years, and
that belief is called 'Wicca'. "
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So this is, we could say, from
the horse's mouth. This is right
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from the president of a school
that teaches real witchcraft to
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young people, and this press
release says that Harry Potter
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has created an interest in
witchcraft among young people.
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So you're saying
that, obviously in the press
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and the media Harry Potter
has been a phenomena, and for
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a parent that's out there the
natural thinking I would assume,
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and for children alike,
this is just innocuous family
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entertainment, these are
things that are just fantasy,
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like Disney and so forth,
so you're showing here that
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according to witches themselves
they're saying that Harry Potter
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is actually advertising,
or their medium for getting
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the message out about Wicca,
is that what they're saying
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- right here? -
That's what this person is
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saying, and this person is not
the only one, there are other
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people in the Pagan community,
other people in the witchcraft
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community that are saying
the same thing, so I'm not
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the only one. I've
been on a lot of radio
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shows discussing this
topic, and I know it's extremely
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controversial, and I'm sure
that there are probably people
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out there watching this right
now that have read the Harry
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Potter books, that love Harry
Potter, and if you are I don't
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want you to feel like I'm
condemning you, I just hope
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that you'll have an open mind
to hear me out, and we've got
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a lot to discuss, and we'll just
take a look at some more facts.
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First of all, one of the
main arguments in favor of Harry
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Potter is that it's all
just a story, it's just fantasy,
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and it's not connected to
the real world of the occult.
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I beg to differ with
that. J. K. Rowling herself has
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publicly admitted that she's
done a vast amount of research
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and that 30% of what's in those
books is actually the result
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of real research that she
has done in the occult world.
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Now, the basic story line
of Harry Potter is that there's
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a battle between an evil wizard
and his followers and the good
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wizards, especially
Harry Potter, good and bad
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wizards. That philosophy,
that you can be a good wizard,
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is real witchcraft philosophy,
that is the philosophy of Wicca.
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The philosophy that you can
practice white magic, which is
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what Harry Potter's all about,
he practices the good kind
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of magic against the
evil wizard, that is also real
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witchcraft philosophy,
it's promoted in the book
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"Teen Witch" that we talked
about on a previous program,
00:10:26.73\00:10:28.68
and many other books.
The philosophy that's in
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Teen Witch is in Harry
Potter. One of the components of
00:10:31.35\00:10:36.20
the Harry Potter series is that
Harry, when he goes to Hogwarts
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School of Witchcraft and
Wizardry, he takes all kinds
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of classes. He takes a class on
divination, on potions, history
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of magic, and he also takes a
class called "Defense against"
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"the dark arts" and he learns
that he can use certain spells
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to protect himself from the evil
wizards that are out to kill
00:10:54.21\00:10:57.48
him. That philosophy is also in
the book "Teen Witch", which is
00:10:57.51\00:11:01.45
a real witchcraft book promoting
witchcraft to teenagers.
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The lady that wrote that book,
that's what she says, that you
00:11:05.74\00:11:07.93
can protect yourself by casting
good spells against evil.
00:11:07.96\00:11:11.58
You can point by point
and demonstrate that in spite
00:11:11.61\00:11:14.69
of the fantasy, in spite of the
fiction, in spite all the goofy
00:11:14.72\00:11:17.36
elements that are within Harry
Potter there are real components
00:11:17.39\00:11:22.85
that are connected to
real witchcraft. And that,
00:11:22.88\00:11:24.82
going back to this press release
that I referred to, it comes
00:11:24.85\00:11:28.06
right out here, and it says
that "Harry Potter has many"
00:11:28.09\00:11:31.23
"components that are similar to
Wicca". So the people that are
00:11:31.26\00:11:36.74
into witchcraft, many of
them see it. As I've mentioned,
00:11:36.77\00:11:41.45
I've been on a lot of radio
shows, I've been interviewed
00:11:41.48\00:11:44.50
on a lot of programs, both
TV and radio, to discuss this.
00:11:44.53\00:11:47.59
Let me just share some
very interesting information.
00:11:47.62\00:11:50.58
One time I was on a show
in Seattle called "Live from"
00:11:50.61\00:11:53.72
"Seattle", and they were
supposed to keep me on for
00:11:53.75\00:11:56.09
about 45 minutes, because the
phones just went off the hook
00:11:56.12\00:12:00.01
I was on for an hour and a half,
and during that show a woman
00:12:00.04\00:12:03.79
named Melissa, I still remember
to this day, she called in
00:12:03.82\00:12:07.07
to the show and spoke to me and
the host. She said "Let me tell"
00:12:07.10\00:12:11.47
"you my story, I'm a mother.
I have a Christian home",
00:12:11.50\00:12:15.09
"my 14 year old daughter,
she went out and read the first"
00:12:15.12\00:12:19.59
"Harry Potter book, 'Harry
Potter and the Sorcerer's' "
00:12:19.62\00:12:22.21
" 'Stone'. And after going out
and reading that book she went"
00:12:22.24\00:12:24.60
"right back to the bookstore
and she began buying real"
00:12:24.63\00:12:27.82
"witchcraft books". And
then she said that her daughter
00:12:27.85\00:12:31.67
began to have all kinds
of spiritual problems and her
00:12:31.70\00:12:35.43
daughter came to her mother,
and Melissa's telling the story,
00:12:35.46\00:12:38.01
she said "My daughter came to
me and said 'Mom, I'm scared'. "
00:12:38.04\00:12:41.00
She said "I feel like
the Holy Spirit has left me".
00:12:41.03\00:12:44.08
"What's happening to me? "
And her mom said "Well, what's"
00:12:44.11\00:12:46.45
"going on in your life?
" And then that's when she
00:12:46.48\00:12:49.52
divulged that she had
been reading Harry Potter,
00:12:49.55\00:12:51.54
and then she finally got rid
of those books because of that.
00:12:51.57\00:12:54.84
So there's one example, and I'll
tell you a few more in a minute.
00:12:54.87\00:12:57.45
So you're saying that up to
30% of J. K. Rowling's material
00:12:57.48\00:13:00.96
is laced with real
life witchcraft situations,
00:13:00.99\00:13:05.52
philosophies and so forth, and
you've actually documented some,
00:13:05.55\00:13:09.28
or met, or talked with certain
individuals that have evidence
00:13:09.31\00:13:13.33
of going from Harry
Potter into witchcraft?
00:13:13.36\00:13:17.08
Yes, I have a friend of mind
who is a good friend of mine
00:13:17.11\00:13:20.57
and he has a daughter that
works at a Barns and Noble in
00:13:20.60\00:13:23.07
Nashville, Tennessee, and this
man told me that his daughter
00:13:23.10\00:13:27.01
said, she's standing at the
cash register, she's selling
00:13:27.04\00:13:29.38
the books, ringing up
the orders. And this daughter
00:13:29.41\00:13:32.90
said that whenever a
Harry Potter book comes out
00:13:32.93\00:13:36.13
and the young and the old, they
just line up to get the book
00:13:36.16\00:13:39.66
she said that many of them
not only grab the Potter book,
00:13:39.69\00:13:43.64
but they also grab real
witchcraft books, right there
00:13:43.67\00:13:46.73
on the shelf, and they bring
them both to the cash register
00:13:46.76\00:13:50.28
and they buy them both.
There's another experience
00:13:50.31\00:13:53.33
that I learned about, it
was shared with me from a friend
00:13:53.36\00:13:59.73
that lives in Paso
Robles, California, where I used
00:13:59.76\00:14:02.18
to live. She goes to Paso Robles
High School, she's a 16 year
00:14:02.21\00:14:05.33
old girl. She forwarded to me a
dialogue between her and a young
00:14:05.36\00:14:11.05
man in an Internet chat room
where they were just discussing
00:14:11.08\00:14:14.61
things, and this girl's on
fire for the Lord, and she is
00:14:14.64\00:14:17.69
witnessing wherever she goes,
so she was dialogging with this
00:14:17.72\00:14:20.83
young man, she forwarded to
me the dialogue. She asked this
00:14:20.86\00:14:24.36
young man about the star
that he said was on his neck,
00:14:24.39\00:14:29.01
he wore a pentacle. And
he explained it, he said:
00:14:29.04\00:14:31.81
"It's a 5 point star with a
circle around it, it's called"
00:14:31.84\00:14:34.24
"a Pentacle. Most Wiccans
wear a necklace with one on it,"
00:14:34.27\00:14:37.09
and she said
"Oh, you're a Wiccan"?
00:14:37.12\00:14:40.08
And he responded
and said "Yes I am".
00:14:40.11\00:14:42.71
Then she said "Did Harry
Potter spark your interest"
00:14:42.74\00:14:45.24
"in witchcraft", and he said,
you can see the answer right
00:14:45.27\00:14:48.04
there, he said "Yeah, it did."
Now, let me clarify that I'm not
00:14:48.07\00:14:52.60
saying that every boy or girl
that reads a Harry Potter book
00:14:52.63\00:14:55.00
is going to rush out and
join a covenant, and become
00:14:55.03\00:14:58.08
a [solitaire] or a witch.
Obviously that's not true,
00:14:58.11\00:15:00.99
but for anyone that has
their eyes open, it is a fact,
00:15:01.02\00:15:05.91
and I can tell story after
story after story, and this
00:15:05.94\00:15:08.65
is just a few stories, that
many young people have become
00:15:08.68\00:15:11.93
interested in witchcraft
because of Harry Potter.
00:15:11.96\00:15:15.06
Even though it's full of
fiction, even though it's
00:15:15.09\00:15:16.69
full of fantasy, and there's
all kinds of things in there
00:15:16.72\00:15:19.17
that are not real, there
are things that are real.
00:15:19.20\00:15:22.90
There's real places mention,
London is mention, there's
00:15:22.93\00:15:25.48
a subway station in London that
is mentioned, there's countries:
00:15:25.51\00:15:29.06
America, Africa, Egypt; there
are places, there are people,
00:15:29.09\00:15:32.80
like Nicolas Flamel, there's
a lot of real witchcraft things
00:15:32.83\00:15:36.86
that are in there. J. K.
Rowling has a Master's degree
00:15:36.89\00:15:40.61
in Mythology from the University
of Exeter, and she, again,
00:15:40.64\00:15:43.72
has publicly admitted that
30% of what's in those books
00:15:43.75\00:15:47.17
is the result of her research
into real witchcraft, so there's
00:15:47.20\00:15:51.47
a lot in there. And as
I mentioned, when you look
00:15:51.50\00:15:53.27
at the Harry Potter philosophy
and the story line you've got
00:15:53.30\00:15:56.47
good wizards, you've got
them practicing white magic,
00:15:56.50\00:15:58.83
you've got Harry Potter
going to school and learning how
00:15:58.86\00:16:01.48
to protect himself
from evil by casting spells.
00:16:01.51\00:16:04.75
That is the philosophy of real
Wicca today, and if people don't
00:16:04.78\00:16:08.70
see it, they just
don't know what's happening.
00:16:08.73\00:16:12.47
It's my my
conviction without a question
00:16:12.50\00:16:17.18
that Harry Potter is
contributing to the Wiccan
00:16:17.21\00:16:21.54
craze, the Wiccan
interest among young people.
00:16:21.57\00:16:25.25
I have another friend of
mine that took a camera and went
00:16:25.28\00:16:27.22
to one of the Harry Potter
movies, and he interviewed
00:16:27.25\00:16:29.94
people, he and his wife
interviewed them as they were
00:16:29.97\00:16:31.60
coming out of the film, and
there was a mom that came out
00:16:31.63\00:16:34.24
with her 2 kids, and they
were asking them questions:
00:16:34.27\00:16:36.75
"How'd you like the
movie? " And the mother said
00:16:36.78\00:16:39.27
"Oh, it was great, it was fun. "
And the kids said "Yeah, it was"
00:16:39.30\00:16:42.03
"really cool". Then she started
asking the kids whether they
00:16:42.06\00:16:44.87
could possibly become interested
in casting real spells,
00:16:44.90\00:16:48.63
and the girl, the daughter,
looked at the interviewer,
00:16:48.66\00:16:52.84
this woman and was nodding
her head, and her mother looked
00:16:52.87\00:16:55.91
at the daughter and said
"Don't you dare, this is just"
00:16:55.94\00:17:00.00
"a story", and the girl
just kind of clamped up and just
00:17:00.03\00:17:03.26
looked back the interviewer
and didn't say anything.
00:17:03.29\00:17:06.05
But you know, there's just
a simple example right there,
00:17:06.08\00:17:08.65
and there's a lot of
examples that I can mention.
00:17:08.68\00:17:12.21
I have a few statistics
here that I picked up, it says
00:17:12.24\00:17:14.65
"The 6 books to date have
collectively sold more than"
00:17:14.68\00:17:18.02
"300 million copies, and
have been translated into more"
00:17:18.05\00:17:21.32
"than 63 languages", this
is a phenomena that is sweeping
00:17:21.35\00:17:25.16
across our world, and it
illustrates, like you've said,
00:17:25.19\00:17:27.79
the power of the medium of story
that is becoming the agency
00:17:27.82\00:17:32.79
through which it's connecting
with witchcraft and the parents
00:17:32.82\00:17:36.34
are saying "Hey, this is
just innocuous entertainment,"
00:17:36.37\00:17:39.31
but you've seen that it
can lead to something deeper.
00:17:39.34\00:17:42.38
That's right, and people say,
"David, it's just fiction. "
00:17:42.41\00:17:45.48
But the fact is that fiction
is a powerful communicator
00:17:45.51\00:17:50.90
of ideas that do influence
people's lives. Here's a little
00:17:50.93\00:17:55.47
quotation about fiction,
and it says here, this is from
00:17:55.50\00:17:58.84
a British novelist
named Virginia Wolf. She said:
00:17:58.87\00:18:02.10
"Fiction is like a spider's web,
it is still attached to life"
00:18:02.13\00:18:05.52
"at all 4 corners". It's
very interesting, I'd like
00:18:05.55\00:18:08.74
to share a Bible text at
this point from Matthew 13:34.
00:18:08.77\00:18:16.66
And this is talking about the
primary method that Jesus Christ
00:18:16.69\00:18:19.37
used when He taught.
Verse 34, the Bible says:
00:18:19.40\00:18:24.17
[text on screen]
00:18:24.20\00:18:39.69
Jesus Christ, when He
was teaching, primarily used
00:18:39.72\00:18:43.86
stories, parables are stories.
And the reason why He did that
00:18:43.89\00:18:47.63
was because Jesus knew, He was
the master teacher, and He knew
00:18:47.66\00:18:51.36
that stories communicate ideas,
and that they're a very powerful
00:18:51.39\00:18:57.07
way of teaching people things,
and that's what Harry Potter is,
00:18:57.10\00:19:02.39
it's a story, and parents
that say that just because it's
00:19:02.42\00:19:05.27
a story we don't need
to be concerned about it,
00:19:05.30\00:19:09.42
that is just modern
ignorance, honestly, it is.
00:19:09.45\00:19:13.11
Stories are powerful, Jesus used
stories. Here's something else
00:19:13.14\00:19:16.96
to consider, I was holding
a meeting on this somewhere
00:19:16.99\00:19:19.83
in Northern Washington, and
a woman came up to me and she
00:19:19.86\00:19:23.60
drew my attention to something
in the Bible that I hadn't
00:19:23.63\00:19:25.70
previously thought of. She
said "I've been thinking about"
00:19:25.73\00:19:28.62
"the name Harry Potter.
What is a potter anyway? "
00:19:28.65\00:19:34.83
And I thought about that and
I thought "A potter is someone"
00:19:34.86\00:19:37.49
"that molds clay", and then
she reminded me of a Bible text.
00:19:37.52\00:19:42.14
There are a number of
texts, there's one in Jeremiah,
00:19:42.17\00:19:44.33
there's one in the book
of Isaiah 64:8 where God said
00:19:44.36\00:19:48.39
"I am the Potter and you are
the clay". So God uses the term
00:19:48.42\00:19:54.33
"potter" to illustrate that
He wants to mold His people.
00:19:54.36\00:19:59.03
So here you have a story line
of a boy wizard who practices
00:19:59.06\00:20:03.41
magic, who's cool, and
who mixes potions, and uses
00:20:03.44\00:20:07.15
white magic, and the kids
all around this world are just
00:20:07.18\00:20:11.02
fascinated by,
mesmerized by, absorbed by,
00:20:11.05\00:20:14.19
and what's happening is
that this generation is slowly
00:20:14.22\00:20:18.02
and subtly being molded
They're being molded, not just
00:20:18.05\00:20:21.95
by Harry Potter, but by a lot
of other TV programs that are
00:20:21.98\00:20:25.86
making witchcraft out to
be cool and fun, and exciting
00:20:25.89\00:20:30.10
for kids, and is it any wonder
that we're seeing at the same
00:20:30.13\00:20:33.90
time that Hollywood is putting
out all these stories about
00:20:33.93\00:20:37.80
witchcraft that we're seeing
real witchcraft on the rise
00:20:37.83\00:20:42.38
all around us. There's a
connection, 1+1 still equals 2.
00:20:42.41\00:20:48.12
So you're saying that the Harry
Potter phenomena is contributing
00:20:48.15\00:20:51.77
to the growth of Wicca world
wide. Let's go to this concept
00:20:51.80\00:20:56.43
of story, Jesus used stories.
Now, let's say that there's
00:20:56.46\00:21:00.69
a parent out there that has
Harry Potter in their house,
00:21:00.72\00:21:03.67
what would be your advice to
that parent that has some books
00:21:03.70\00:21:07.05
laying around the house
with Harry Potter, is it okay
00:21:07.08\00:21:09.45
to keep, or is it okay to read
sometimes? Or what would your
00:21:09.48\00:21:13.78
recommendation to
that individual be?
00:21:13.81\00:21:16.28
Yeah, I would say don't
let your kids read them at all.
00:21:16.31\00:21:18.96
Obviously when people get older
they make their own choices,
00:21:18.99\00:21:22.11
but I have a little boy named
Seth, he's 2 years old, and when
00:21:22.14\00:21:24.37
he gets to be 5, 6, 7, 8,
I'm not going to be buying him
00:21:24.40\00:21:27.55
the Harry Potter books.
Now, when he gets to be older
00:21:27.58\00:21:30.25
than that, if he chooses to
read them, that's up to him,
00:21:30.28\00:21:33.84
but when a child is young enough
to be under the influence of
00:21:33.87\00:21:36.42
their parents, I don't want
my child reading books that make
00:21:36.45\00:21:40.23
witchcraft out to be
fun, that plant seeds.
00:21:40.26\00:21:42.98
Also I've mention this
previously, I've recently gotten
00:21:43.01\00:21:45.31
into gardening and one
thing you do in gardening is you
00:21:45.34\00:21:47.85
prepare the soil, and then you
plant seeds, you put the compost
00:21:47.88\00:21:51.35
in, you [?] to till it up,
and then you put those seeds in.
00:21:51.38\00:21:54.45
Harry Potter is preparing the
soil and it's planting seeds,
00:21:54.48\00:21:57.86
and Wicca is reaping the
harvest. The president of
00:21:57.89\00:22:00.94
a witchcraft school acknowledged
that that is exactly what's
00:22:00.97\00:22:03.88
happening. Now, let me just kind
of shift gears a little bit.
00:22:03.91\00:22:06.34
Apart from the whole
witchcraft issue, when you
00:22:06.37\00:22:09.02
look at the character of Harry
Potter himself, as portrayed
00:22:09.05\00:22:13.01
in the movies and as portrayed
in the books, Harry Potter,
00:22:13.04\00:22:18.17
he's not really a role model
for kids, at least for Christian
00:22:18.20\00:22:22.51
kids, at least for kids that
really want to follow this book.
00:22:22.54\00:22:26.65
If you read the Potter
books or look at the movies,
00:22:26.68\00:22:29.93
Harry Potter as a character,
he lies, he lies a lot, he lies
00:22:29.96\00:22:34.00
many, many times for supposedly
good reasons. He curses,
00:22:34.03\00:22:38.24
he swears, he has temper
tantrums, he drinks fire whiskey
00:22:38.27\00:22:42.69
sometimes - he's an underage
drinker, he does a lot of
00:22:42.72\00:22:46.76
things, he breaks rules over
and over again at the school.
00:22:46.79\00:22:50.98
There's one particular scene
in one of the Potter books where
00:22:51.01\00:22:53.94
his best friend, Ron Weasley
is talking to his mother,
00:22:53.97\00:22:57.80
and this is what he
says: "Mum, shut up,"
00:22:57.83\00:23:01.11
and that's the British
way of saying "mom", he says
00:23:01.14\00:23:03.56
" 'Mum, shut up', Ron yelled'
". And he's not corrected,
00:23:03.59\00:23:07.42
there's nothing that's
apparently wrong with this.
00:23:07.45\00:23:10.08
So here you've got a series
of books where Harry's best
00:23:10.11\00:23:12.74
friend is telling
his mother to shut up.
00:23:12.77\00:23:15.09
Now parents, is that a seed
you want planted in the minds
00:23:15.12\00:23:18.28
of your kids? Do you want them
reading this kind of material?
00:23:18.31\00:23:22.21
I don't, my Bible says
"Honor your father and mother,"
00:23:22.24\00:23:24.85
my Bible says he who
curses his father and mother
00:23:24.88\00:23:28.72
there's consequences to that,
won't quote the whole verse,
00:23:28.75\00:23:31.75
but there's a lot in there.
It talks about the importance
00:23:31.78\00:23:34.54
of children having respect for
their parents. In 2 Timothy 3
00:23:34.57\00:23:38.97
it talks about one of the signs
of the end is that kids will be
00:23:39.00\00:23:42.59
disobedient to their parents,
disrespectful to their parents,
00:23:42.62\00:23:45.13
and I don't want my little
boy reading a book where one
00:23:45.16\00:23:48.48
of the key characters
tells his mother to shut up.
00:23:48.51\00:23:55.04
So outside of the Wiccan
connection to Harry Potter
00:23:55.07\00:23:58.36
you're saying that there's
other issues with Potter morals
00:23:58.39\00:24:01.00
that's involved, that he
lies, he curses, he gets angry,
00:24:01.03\00:24:04.23
- he breaks rules. -
These things are not presented
00:24:04.26\00:24:07.77
- as wrong in the
books. - Positively.
00:24:07.80\00:24:11.20
That's right, it's just
something he does, and they're
00:24:11.23\00:24:14.01
not corrected. Now
what about the parent
00:24:14.04\00:24:16.67
out there that's saying
"Hey, if I can't have them read"
00:24:16.70\00:24:19.81
"Harry Potter, which is all
over, and the kids want to read"
00:24:19.84\00:24:22.67
"this type of material, what
do I feed my kids as far as"
00:24:22.70\00:24:26.89
"a mental diet", what are
some resources that we can point
00:24:26.92\00:24:29.59
them to? We want to not only say
00:24:29.62\00:24:31.82
that this is not something that
we support, but at the same time
00:24:31.85\00:24:34.69
we want to replace
it with something good.
00:24:34.72\00:24:37.29
Yes David, thank you for
bringing me back to that,
00:24:37.32\00:24:39.71
you did ask that question.
Our ministry, White Horse Media
00:24:39.74\00:24:42.78
has, on our website, a lot
of resources for young people,
00:24:42.81\00:24:45.69
www.whitehorsemedia.com.
One of the books that I strongly
00:24:45.72\00:24:49.01
recommend to parents to replace
Harry Potter is the book called
00:24:49.04\00:24:52.60
"Pilgrim's Progress", which
is a classic work written by
00:24:52.63\00:24:55.31
John Bunyan, it's an allegory,
it's a story, but it has
00:24:55.34\00:24:58.02
affected people's lives for
300 years, it teaches morality,
00:24:58.05\00:25:02.66
it teaches purity, it teaches
obedience to God, it teaches
00:25:02.69\00:25:05.71
humility, it teaches following
the Bible, and those lessons:
00:25:05.74\00:25:10.21
humility, purity, obedience,
faith in God, you won't find
00:25:10.24\00:25:14.41
those lessons one time in any
Harry Potter book, they're just
00:25:14.44\00:25:17.82
not there. So we encourage
something better, we encourage
00:25:17.85\00:25:21.28
reading the Bible, obviously,
the most important book.
00:25:21.31\00:25:23.70
We do have a number of
other resources for young people
00:25:23.73\00:25:26.01
"Pilgrim's Progress" I
mentioned, is a wonderful book,
00:25:26.04\00:25:28.49
it's a powerful book, and
we encourage people to look,
00:25:28.52\00:25:32.37
instead of to a boy
wizard that's cool and practices
00:25:32.40\00:25:35.13
magic, we encourage
people to look ultimately to one
00:25:35.16\00:25:39.33
particular Person, the
Person above all persons,
00:25:39.36\00:25:42.83
and that is Jesus Christ.
Here it says in Hebrews 12:2
00:25:42.86\00:25:47.16
that we are to be looking
unto Jesus, and the Harry
00:25:47.19\00:25:51.29
Potter storyline Harry
has an encounter when he's
00:25:51.32\00:25:54.43
a little baby with the
evil Lord Voldemort, and a curse
00:25:54.46\00:25:59.05
falls upon him, which
bounces back on the evil wizard
00:25:59.08\00:26:01.52
and it leaves a lightning
shaped scar on his head.
00:26:01.55\00:26:05.43
So when people watch
these movies they'll see Daniel
00:26:05.46\00:26:08.20
Radcliffe, who's the
boy that plays Harry Potter,
00:26:08.23\00:26:11.49
who, by the way, starred
in a British play without any
00:26:11.52\00:26:16.26
clothes on in a certain scene,
so he's certainly not a role
00:26:16.29\00:26:18.84
model, but anyway, he has
this lightning bolt on his head,
00:26:18.87\00:26:22.29
he has a scar. And all
these kids around the world are
00:26:22.32\00:26:25.14
looking to a boy wizard
who has a scar, and in my mind
00:26:25.17\00:26:29.21
when I think of that
I think of Jesus Christ,
00:26:29.24\00:26:31.41
and I think "Why have
kids focused on a wizard that"
00:26:31.44\00:26:34.66
"has a scar when they could
be looking at a real man, "
00:26:34.69\00:26:38.46
"at the real Jesus, who
has real scars in His hands"
00:26:38.49\00:26:41.72
"and in His feet, He had
the crown of thorns placed"
00:26:41.75\00:26:44.61
"upon His head, and He
did this because He loves us".
00:26:44.64\00:26:48.88
Harry is fantasy, he doesn't
exist, Jesus Christ is real.
00:26:48.91\00:26:53.12
He loves boys and girls,
He wants them to be happy,
00:26:53.15\00:26:56.09
He wants them to fill their
mind, as Philippians 4:8 says,
00:26:56.12\00:26:59.65
with things that are true that
are lovely, that are honest,
00:26:59.68\00:27:02.26
that are pure, the Bible
says "Think on these things",
00:27:02.29\00:27:05.70
Deuteronomy 18:11 says that
witchcraft is an abomination,
00:27:05.73\00:27:09.99
and certainly there's a
subtle devil behind the scenes
00:27:10.02\00:27:13.68
that is leading kids to look at
witchcraft, look at their hero
00:27:13.71\00:27:17.60
and to be molded in a
direction that is not good.
00:27:17.63\00:27:23.81
My advice is look to Jesus,
parents, put things that are
00:27:23.84\00:27:28.02
pure and good before your
kids, and pray, and God will
00:27:28.05\00:27:31.62
- bless you as you do
that. - We're about out of time.
00:27:31.65\00:27:35.04
Steve, thank you so
much for sharing with us,
00:27:35.07\00:27:37.46
it's been enlightening.
We've gone through this series
00:27:37.49\00:27:40.41
on the supernatural, and
magic, ghosts and the Bible.
00:27:40.44\00:27:43.53
We've talked today specifically
about Potter mania, and how
00:27:43.56\00:27:47.46
Harry Potter is linked, 30% of
J. K. Rowling's books is linked
00:27:47.49\00:27:51.42
with witchcraft, we've
also talked about the issue with
00:27:51.45\00:27:54.17
morals throughout the Harry
Potter series, and finally we've
00:27:54.20\00:27:57.20
talked about this power of
a story in dealing with this.
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We'd like to thank you so
much for joining us today for
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Battles of Faith, and it's our
prayer that you'll learn to live
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by every word that
precedes from the mouth of God.
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