A good father
takes time to play.
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He has strong integrity.
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He is someone that
is truly dedicated.
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He is not afraid
to show his love.
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He is a caring provider.
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And he is a kind
spiritual leader.
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These are just a few ways
to describe A Father's Heart.
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Hi. Welcome to A Father's Heart.
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I'm your host Xavier.
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Question I pose to you today is
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where are the men in the church?
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Specifically, where are
the fathers in the church?
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And with me, to
discuss that today,
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is my friends Gordon and Paul.
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How are you guys doing today?
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Great, man. I'm
grateful to be here.
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Amen. So that's the question.
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Where are the men, you
know, specifically the fathers
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because statistics
show on a worldwide scale,
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on a worldwide church scale,
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aside from
Adventism and everything,
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it shows that
80% of the churches
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are comprised of
women, 20% are men.
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And obviously, fathers are men.
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We want to know
where are our fathers,
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where are our men?
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True, true, true.
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That is a challenge
for us within the church.
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But I mean, we plan for things,
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we work hard towards
objectives, case in point.
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I'm grateful to be here.
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I packed very well.
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No sooner than I
got here and I unpacked,
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I realized there was something
that I forgot to pack, socks.
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I had no socks.
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I'm grateful to my brother here,
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for the pastor here,
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for allowing and
sharing his socks with me.
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So if anybody has questions
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about why the
preacher looks so socksy today,
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pastor right here,
but likewise, likewise,
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there are things in church
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that we make every
effort to be intentional about.
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This one is very serious.
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Why are there or why
is there not more men,
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not more fathers in the church,
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since we are
such an integral part
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of that nurture
process for the family.
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We look back at
the time of Christ,
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and when they
were numbering by men,
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all those numbers we
see referenced in scripture,
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Old, New Testament,
they're counting men.
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They often would not
include women and children.
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And those
numbers were significant,
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day of Pentecost over thousands,
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and so on and so forth,
Jesus feeding the hungry,
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thousands again.
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What happened?
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Where are we?
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I think there's a fundamental,
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there's a breakdown
that has taken place
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in the home through generations.
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And it has
brought us to this point
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where we don't have
fathers in the church.
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We don't have men in the church.
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I think they're busy,
or the devil has them busy,
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dealing with sports
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because you can find
them in the sports arena.
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You can find them
doing all these macho things
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instead of being in the church,
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you know? And if you
go back in the Bible,
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you realize that,
and the devil knows this,
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you realize that God has
called men to be priests,
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to be fathers,
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to be that pivotal role
of guiding their children,
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of leading the church.
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And I think the
devil knows that.
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So what he has done is
that he has distracted men.
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I think fathers and men
don't know their purpose,
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what role and what
purpose they have in the church.
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And so as a result,
in has caused them to...
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Instead of being a
part of the church,
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it has caused them just
to sit back, and stay home,
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and pick up that remote,
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and you know, watch
the different games.
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I think that is one of
the fundamental problems.
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The devil has
caused the distraction,
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that's why we don't
have men in the church
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because he knows
the power of the father,
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he knows the
power of their role.
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And I really enjoy that,
you know, what you just said.
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It's just so different,
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you know, in
trying to figure out
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where are the fathers.
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You know, Ephesians talks about,
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in the book of Ephesians
5, it goes into discussion,
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and we use that a lot,
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you know, we talk about
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how men are
supposed to love their wives
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as Christ loves his church,
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and then we infamously
use the verse about women
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in a negative
light, in a way that is,
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you know, not the best.
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But at the same time,
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I have to think about
all the fathers in the Bible,
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you know, and what can we do,
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what is it or
what is so negative
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about church culture,
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about our culture
that is keeping the fathers
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not only out of the homes
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but out of the
church in its entirety?
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Before I would answer that,
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I would ask a
question for clarity.
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And I know the question
that resonates is, well,
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whose fault is it?
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Is this a societal problem?
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Is this a general predicament
of society or is this something
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that's the
immediate fault of the church?
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Is this something that
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we're doing wrong as
pastors within our church
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or leaders within our church?
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Is it that we changed
from the original model?
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What is it exactly?
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I think it's clear direction.
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I think men need direction.
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They need to find a purpose.
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They need to know what is
it that we need to be doing,
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what God expects of us.
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And for that, I
run to 1 Timothy.
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It gives a...
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And if I may, I
just want to read it
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because I think
it's a powerful text.
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1 Timothy 2:8,
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where Timothy
gives a direct focus
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as what men should be doing,
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what the
fathers should be doing.
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The Bible says,
"I desire, therefore,
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that the men pray everywhere,
lifting up holy hands,
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without wrath and doubting."
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So what this is is a purpose.
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Men's purpose is to be praying.
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And if the men and
the fathers are praying,
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it brings the God
down into our space,
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and therefore,
situations are different,
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therefore lives are changed
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because when we
pray, we know what happens.
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And I think the
devil knows that.
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He knows that
that is the purpose
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God has called us.
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One of the greatest purposes
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that God has
called us is to pray,
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fathers need to be
praying for the children.
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Ellen White would say
that the job of the father,
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that priest, is
to, in the mornings,
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take his children and
his family to the altar,
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pray for them,
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ask God to forgive their known
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as well as their unknown sins.
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So that is the pivotal
role of the father, of the men.
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And because they
don't know what it is,
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they tend to find
other things to do.
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That's what I think.
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Again, whose fault is that?
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Is it something
we are doing wrong?
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And so are we...
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We were not educating.
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Are we not nurturing that?
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We're not, we're
not nurturing that,
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we're not talking about it,
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you know? Man is left to
figure things out themselves,
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you know, just figure it out.
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And it seems like
we're lacking commitment,
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like we're
lacking that commitment,
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almost like
we're afraid to commit
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to a role that is
given to us as fathers,
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a God given role.
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You know, an important
role because if you notice,
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not only are the fathers,
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you know, being
put out of the church
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but a lot of them are
no longer in the home.
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They find ways to get
astray from their marriage,
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from their children's lives,
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you know, and our kids see that,
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our children see,
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and that's the other factor
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that we do not understand
is the fact that we think,
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you know, kids, mom,
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kids, mom, kids, mom.
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No, it's kids, father.
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You know, we are fathers,
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we are called to be
there and show that example.
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And that's the other issue,
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are we just
afraid to be committed
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to what we're called to do?
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Is it a fear of commitment?
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I don't think it is
a fear of commitment.
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Going back again.
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I think it's a
fear of not knowing,
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not knowing,
that's what I think.
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We need to know,
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men need to
know, do this, do that.
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My wife would make
fun of me sometimes.
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I can't do four
things at a time.
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I can do one.
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Well, you've got to
give me some clear direction.
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And I think a lot
of men are like that.
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Give them clear direction
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that this is
what you need to do,
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and then we'll do
it, we'll execute it.
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But we don't know what
we need. So it's not...
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We can't be
committed if we don't know
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what we're committing to.
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So then what do we do?
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I mean, we have
evangelistic series.
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We have everything,
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we have baptisms,
we have altar calls,
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we send out flyers,
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we do Facebook
posts, everything.
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What can we do
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to get our fathers
involved back in the church
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and in their children's lives
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to be the priest
of the home once more?
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Right, well, pastor
here says nurturing,
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and I certainly value that.
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I think it is
primarily a societal problem,
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yet one that we
need to hold ourselves
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accountable for addressing.
00:09:35.64\00:09:37.74
So there are a lot of
things that impact that status
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or that statistic
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that we don't really
have much to do with.
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Take, for example,
China and other nations
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wherein you don't
have a large presence
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of men in the church
because of oppression.
00:09:56.22\00:09:59.09
So women are allowed to worship,
00:09:59.13\00:10:01.66
but some parts of China,
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if you are a man
and you are present,
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you get arrested.
00:10:05.43\00:10:06.77
And there are other
places in the world like that.
00:10:06.80\00:10:08.94
There are a lot more tolerance
extended towards women.
00:10:08.97\00:10:11.74
And then there
are societal changes
00:10:11.77\00:10:13.17
even here in our nation,
00:10:13.21\00:10:17.55
the masculinity of society,
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and what's now
attractive in media,
00:10:19.55\00:10:23.52
for example, but yes,
00:10:23.55\00:10:25.25
we need to be proactive about
how we address those deficits.
00:10:25.29\00:10:29.72
I try to look at myself,
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in each of the
church that I pass,
00:10:31.83\00:10:33.26
I try to look at
myself as a community leader,
00:10:33.29\00:10:36.46
so I'm observing
what's happening in community,
00:10:36.50\00:10:38.40
I'm observing what's
changing in the community,
00:10:38.43\00:10:40.14
what's lacking in the community,
00:10:40.17\00:10:41.87
and I'm doing my best
00:10:41.90\00:10:43.24
through my own
ministry to address those needs.
00:10:43.27\00:10:47.98
The accountability factor
00:10:48.01\00:10:49.34
I'm talking about
here is the things
00:10:49.38\00:10:52.18
that we are not
doing that we can do.
00:10:52.21\00:10:55.22
For example,
00:10:55.25\00:10:56.58
does your church
have a men's ministry
00:10:56.62\00:10:59.35
wherein you allow men an
opportunity to be empowered
00:10:59.39\00:11:03.79
and you allow
them to feel valued?
00:11:03.83\00:11:07.36
If men just come
into the church and sit
00:11:07.40\00:11:10.07
and they may not
be aesthetically,
00:11:10.10\00:11:14.97
you know, preoccupied to
like how the environment looks
00:11:15.00\00:11:19.01
or like how it sounds,
00:11:19.04\00:11:20.74
you know, those things may
not matter to them as much,
00:11:20.78\00:11:22.74
you know? So you have to get...
00:11:22.78\00:11:24.55
It's important that
we keep men involved
00:11:24.58\00:11:26.82
and that we also
keep them involved
00:11:26.85\00:11:28.62
and engaged in
exercising leadership.
00:11:28.65\00:11:32.65
Those are things
that we must ensure.
00:11:32.69\00:11:35.02
One thing that we do,
00:11:35.06\00:11:37.39
we have something
called ten minute men,
00:11:37.43\00:11:40.13
going on the same model
as empowering and teaching
00:11:40.16\00:11:44.30
and nurturing.
00:11:44.33\00:11:45.90
Then, after church, all the men,
00:11:45.93\00:11:48.80
if you are there
for the first time,
00:11:48.84\00:11:51.07
we go into the conference
room, we ask one of our elders,
00:11:51.11\00:11:53.88
he calls all the men,
00:11:53.91\00:11:55.88
they go into the conference room
00:11:55.91\00:11:57.25
for ten minutes,
00:11:57.28\00:11:58.61
we sit down and we
talk about manhood,
00:11:58.65\00:12:02.18
what it is to be that
father, what it is to be,
00:12:02.22\00:12:05.62
you know, to walk in the
call and walk in the giftedness
00:12:05.65\00:12:08.99
that God has
placed within your heart
00:12:09.02\00:12:10.93
to be a father,
00:12:10.96\00:12:12.29
and what we have
find out is that it is...
00:12:12.33\00:12:15.00
We have 13-year-olds.
00:12:15.03\00:12:17.07
See you've got to start there.
00:12:17.10\00:12:19.93
And we have the young guys.
00:12:19.97\00:12:22.50
They're there and
they're listening,
00:12:22.54\00:12:24.27
they are listening to
the older men sharing it,
00:12:24.31\00:12:26.98
they're listening to,
00:12:27.01\00:12:28.34
you know, so
they're getting something
00:12:28.38\00:12:30.81
from what is shared.
00:12:30.85\00:12:33.01
That, to me, makes a shift
00:12:33.05\00:12:36.05
because everyone is contributing
00:12:36.08\00:12:39.62
to the development
of the younger ones
00:12:39.65\00:12:42.02
and the older ones
are getting something
00:12:42.06\00:12:44.63
from the young
00:12:44.66\00:12:45.99
because they're
hearing the feedback.
00:12:46.03\00:12:48.40
You know, what is it like
00:12:48.43\00:12:49.76
to be in a home
without a father?
00:12:49.80\00:12:51.83
What is it like
being in a church
00:12:51.87\00:12:53.54
and, you know, your
father is not there?
00:12:53.57\00:12:56.91
You're there with your mother.
00:12:56.94\00:12:58.94
So what happens when you
00:12:58.97\00:13:01.64
when that young
man is now grown,
00:13:01.68\00:13:05.41
choices that he
would probably make
00:13:05.45\00:13:07.65
is to not be at church.
00:13:07.68\00:13:10.99
Well.
00:13:11.02\00:13:12.42
What if I say, I'm a
father, to me, Jesus is weak.
00:13:12.45\00:13:18.13
You know, I got to be sensitive.
00:13:18.16\00:13:20.53
I got to be, you know...
00:13:20.56\00:13:24.43
Jesus is going to
make me weak, you know?
00:13:24.47\00:13:27.27
I got to be a
man, I got to be tough,
00:13:27.30\00:13:29.24
I got to be showing my kids.
00:13:29.27\00:13:30.81
I got to make sure that
they see a tough father,
00:13:30.84\00:13:33.91
but Jesus is
going to make me cry.
00:13:33.94\00:13:35.81
Maybe we may be sensitive,
00:13:35.84\00:13:38.01
and now I got to commit
myself to come into a building,
00:13:38.05\00:13:43.49
you know, and be
some kind of elder,
00:13:43.52\00:13:46.42
or something,
and this, and that,
00:13:46.45\00:13:48.69
and then, you know, for what?
00:13:48.72\00:13:51.69
How is me coming
to a brick building
00:13:51.73\00:13:55.73
going to keep me
or get me into heaven?
00:13:55.76\00:13:59.93
Why can't I just pray at home?
00:13:59.97\00:14:02.44
Why can't I just, you
know, be a dad at home?
00:14:02.47\00:14:04.37
I mean I can
google all this stuff.
00:14:04.41\00:14:06.68
Why can't I just
be a father at home?
00:14:06.71\00:14:09.64
Why do I have to come to church?
00:14:09.68\00:14:11.98
For what?
00:14:12.01\00:14:13.35
Let me share something with you.
00:14:13.38\00:14:14.95
I have to say...
00:14:14.98\00:14:16.32
And growing up,
00:14:16.35\00:14:17.69
because my dad
was not in the church,
00:14:17.72\00:14:20.89
my dad left the
church, and so it was my mom.
00:14:20.92\00:14:25.36
I got to a certain
age, moved to Florida,
00:14:25.39\00:14:28.16
and I had the same idea.
00:14:28.20\00:14:29.80
And I said to my mom, "I
don't have to go to church.
00:14:29.83\00:14:32.37
I can stay at home
and I can watch church
00:14:32.40\00:14:35.94
and I can
experience God at home."
00:14:35.97\00:14:39.57
And that's what I started doing.
00:14:39.61\00:14:41.91
Why?
00:14:41.94\00:14:43.28
Because my model, my
father model wasn't there.
00:14:43.31\00:14:47.58
But what God did to me
in my life changed that
00:14:47.62\00:14:53.22
because when I stayed at home
00:14:53.25\00:14:54.59
and I would watch church,
00:14:54.62\00:14:55.96
I felt that I was drifting
00:14:55.99\00:14:57.33
farther and farther
away from the church.
00:14:57.36\00:14:59.79
So staying at home or
watching church at home
00:14:59.83\00:15:03.50
is not the answer,
was not the answer for me.
00:15:03.53\00:15:06.53
And so I don't, you know,
00:15:06.57\00:15:08.34
I think we have to let
the men know that Jesus,
00:15:08.37\00:15:12.17
he was sensitive,
it's okay to be sensitive.
00:15:12.21\00:15:15.18
Did He weep? Amen.
00:15:15.21\00:15:16.75
Right? Amen.
00:15:16.78\00:15:18.11
So it's okay to weep.
00:15:18.15\00:15:19.98
I don't have a problem crying.
00:15:20.02\00:15:21.35
I mean, I cry, you know?
00:15:21.38\00:15:23.49
Well.
00:15:23.52\00:15:25.62
I do agree.
00:15:25.65\00:15:26.99
And I am hearing
in between the lines
00:15:27.02\00:15:28.69
here the value of mentorship
00:15:28.72\00:15:31.13
which is another good
value to have within the church
00:15:31.16\00:15:34.30
as it relates to men,
00:15:34.33\00:15:36.00
ensuring that older men
are empowering younger men.
00:15:36.03\00:15:40.07
I think it's also of great value
00:15:40.10\00:15:41.54
that we start early,
00:15:41.57\00:15:42.90
that we not wait
until men are missing,
00:15:42.94\00:15:45.91
that we do our best
proactively to address
00:15:45.94\00:15:49.51
that challenge in youth
00:15:49.54\00:15:52.71
because if they're
present in the church
00:15:52.75\00:15:55.22
through their
youth and teenage years,
00:15:55.25\00:15:57.52
as teenage men or teenage boys,
00:15:57.55\00:16:00.92
it's more likely that we
may be able to retain them
00:16:00.96\00:16:04.29
into adulthood,
into their manhood.
00:16:04.33\00:16:06.49
So we also need to
be very intentional
00:16:06.53\00:16:10.03
about what we're
doing with our young males
00:16:10.07\00:16:13.13
at this time and to ensure that
00:16:13.17\00:16:16.50
they are receiving
the appropriate nurturing,
00:16:16.54\00:16:18.47
as you were saying here,
00:16:18.51\00:16:20.14
Christ is the greatest
leader that I see as a model,
00:16:20.18\00:16:23.95
I have no greater
example or model of leadership
00:16:23.98\00:16:27.35
than what Christ
Himself demonstrated.
00:16:27.38\00:16:29.28
And at the zenith of that
00:16:29.32\00:16:31.52
was His sacrificial
relationship with humanity.
00:16:31.55\00:16:35.22
So it's a good
thing for our boys
00:16:35.26\00:16:37.46
to learn that value,
00:16:37.49\00:16:39.79
that in being sacrificial,
you are being a man,
00:16:39.83\00:16:42.73
in being responsible,
you are being a man.
00:16:42.76\00:16:45.80
But it's not until
you actually go through
00:16:45.83\00:16:48.67
and experience God
for yourself as a Father.
00:16:48.70\00:16:54.31
If you grow up
without that father figure,
00:16:54.34\00:16:58.38
you will tend to
do the same thing
00:16:58.41\00:17:01.32
and repeat the same
mistakes as your father.
00:17:01.35\00:17:03.85
And that is what I
was struggling with.
00:17:03.89\00:17:06.19
When I stayed at home,
00:17:06.22\00:17:07.56
it wasn't until I experienced
and I know that God was love
00:17:07.59\00:17:11.39
and I know that God cared for me
00:17:11.43\00:17:13.66
and I know that
he's always there for me.
00:17:13.70\00:17:16.97
That's what brought
a change in my life.
00:17:17.00\00:17:19.47
I had to end up behind bars.
00:17:19.50\00:17:23.04
I had to end up
looking at a life sentence
00:17:23.07\00:17:25.97
before I could
really come to my senses,
00:17:26.01\00:17:29.48
and nothing that, you
know, that I asked for,
00:17:29.51\00:17:32.95
but it's because
I made some choices.
00:17:32.98\00:17:34.72
I made a choice to stay home
and said, "I don't want God.
00:17:34.75\00:17:37.19
I don't want this
thing called church.
00:17:37.22\00:17:38.82
I don't want this.
00:17:38.85\00:17:40.26
I'm going to
watch it on television.
00:17:40.29\00:17:42.32
I want to be
good just doing that."
00:17:42.36\00:17:45.06
And I learned that
because I didn't have a mentor.
00:17:45.09\00:17:48.06
And I was going to church.
00:17:48.10\00:17:49.60
I was going
through the emotions.
00:17:49.63\00:17:51.50
But I didn't have Jesus.
00:17:51.53\00:17:54.10
I didn't have Him in my life.
00:17:54.14\00:17:56.10
I didn't know who He was.
00:17:56.14\00:17:57.51
But behind bars,
00:17:57.54\00:17:59.17
when I find that
I had nowhere to go,
00:17:59.21\00:18:01.61
I had no one to turn to,
00:18:01.64\00:18:04.15
and I remembered
somewhere in the back of my head
00:18:04.18\00:18:07.55
that I can cry out to somebody
00:18:07.58\00:18:11.55
who I can just cry out
00:18:11.59\00:18:16.79
because somehow my mother
00:18:16.83\00:18:20.70
had placed Him inside of me,
00:18:20.73\00:18:23.53
my heart.
00:18:23.57\00:18:26.00
And when I cried out
to Him in my desperation,
00:18:26.03\00:18:30.57
in my brokenness,
00:18:30.61\00:18:34.48
and He started to talk to me...
00:18:34.51\00:18:36.41
then I knew,
00:18:39.35\00:18:41.82
He was a God who cared for me.
00:18:41.85\00:18:44.95
And that's why this man
00:18:44.99\00:18:48.96
is in the church today.
00:18:48.99\00:18:52.76
That's why I can look
00:18:52.79\00:18:56.93
and try to mentor
other young men to stay
00:18:56.97\00:19:02.10
and know that this God is love.
00:19:02.14\00:19:05.24
Unless you have
that experience...
00:19:05.27\00:19:06.81
No. Amen.
00:19:09.81\00:19:11.41
It's true. Yeah.
00:19:11.45\00:19:12.78
It's true because,
you know, it's ironic how,
00:19:12.81\00:19:17.92
as fathers, you know,
00:19:17.95\00:19:20.16
we're sitting here
sharing our brokenness.
00:19:20.19\00:19:23.43
We are pastors.
00:19:23.46\00:19:24.99
We're men of the cloth,
00:19:25.03\00:19:26.36
we're supposed
to be perfect. Yeah.
00:19:26.39\00:19:27.93
You know what? I'm reminded
00:19:27.96\00:19:30.83
the three angriest disciples,
00:19:30.87\00:19:33.23
the three most
temperamental disciples,
00:19:33.27\00:19:35.84
one chopping somebody's ear off,
00:19:35.87\00:19:38.21
and the other two fishermen,
00:19:38.24\00:19:40.44
probably were like
sailors and angry, I mean,
00:19:40.48\00:19:43.58
just impulsive anger,
00:19:43.61\00:19:44.95
they were the
three closest to Jesus.
00:19:44.98\00:19:48.98
You know, I had a good
friend of mine in seminary.
00:19:49.02\00:19:52.25
People misunderstood me
because we all have an issue
00:19:52.29\00:19:54.52
with temper sometimes,
00:19:54.56\00:19:55.89
I still struggle with it
00:19:55.92\00:19:57.26
'cause certain
things just irk me,
00:19:57.29\00:19:58.63
it just gets under my skin.
00:19:58.66\00:20:00.86
But God showed His mercy
00:20:00.90\00:20:03.20
and His love
through those examples.
00:20:03.23\00:20:07.24
And I'm always intrigued by
this friend in the seminary.
00:20:07.27\00:20:11.44
Everybody thought I was
being kind of aggressive
00:20:11.47\00:20:15.51
in my speech.
00:20:15.54\00:20:16.88
But he knew, maybe
because he's Caribbean too,
00:20:16.91\00:20:19.41
but he said, "No,
he's not aggressive.
00:20:19.45\00:20:20.78
He is just passionate."
00:20:20.82\00:20:22.78
You know, and it's so critical
as fathers to show our kids
00:20:22.82\00:20:27.89
that brokenness,
00:20:27.92\00:20:29.26
to show if we are
here not because of Jesus,
00:20:29.29\00:20:33.06
then why are we not out there
teaching other broken fathers,
00:20:33.09\00:20:37.37
broken men
about this same healer
00:20:37.40\00:20:40.20
that doesn't
require you to be whole?
00:20:40.24\00:20:42.17
In fact, He
wants you partly broken
00:20:42.20\00:20:44.37
so that He can
make you whole again.
00:20:44.41\00:20:46.17
Why aren't we out
there doing more work?
00:20:46.21\00:20:48.64
Why are we just
talking from behind a pulpit?
00:20:48.68\00:20:50.58
What can we do?
00:20:50.61\00:20:51.95
What can we do to do more?
00:20:51.98\00:20:55.15
Because we don't
want to be vulnerable.
00:20:55.18\00:20:57.42
We don't want to
share what's inside of us.
00:20:57.45\00:21:02.32
And so because of
that, we tend not to share.
00:21:02.36\00:21:06.06
We want to just hide
behind this perfect self,
00:21:06.09\00:21:10.37
whatever that is,
whatever that looks like.
00:21:10.40\00:21:13.70
And we just don't want to share.
00:21:13.74\00:21:16.14
The problem with our society
00:21:16.17\00:21:17.51
is because we're not
sharing with our young men.
00:21:17.54\00:21:20.51
I'm not sure
00:21:20.54\00:21:23.51
we will ever be able
to see the statistics,
00:21:23.55\00:21:26.95
the figures, that
we would like to see,
00:21:26.98\00:21:29.25
a 50-50, for example.
00:21:29.28\00:21:31.99
But it should not
impair our ability or action
00:21:32.02\00:21:37.16
to be as active as possible
00:21:37.19\00:21:40.23
in reaching out
in all these things
00:21:40.26\00:21:42.30
that we're sharing here.
00:21:42.33\00:21:43.67
The small group
approach is also very helpful.
00:21:46.13\00:21:48.94
Yes.
00:21:48.97\00:21:50.31
And our churches need
to be more responsible
00:21:50.34\00:21:53.61
or intentional in
terms of male bonding.
00:21:53.64\00:21:56.54
So that statistic, actually,
00:21:56.58\00:21:59.85
I don't think it's
as much referencing men
00:21:59.88\00:22:01.65
that never come to the church.
00:22:01.68\00:22:03.42
I think it also has a
lot to do with retention.
00:22:03.45\00:22:06.09
Men may visit some
holiday or for a child's baptism
00:22:06.12\00:22:09.92
or for a wedding
or whatever have you,
00:22:09.96\00:22:12.36
it's the retention
that's also a factor there.
00:22:12.39\00:22:15.43
So we have to
market ourselves better.
00:22:15.46\00:22:18.20
This is not to say
okay, it's the church fault,
00:22:18.23\00:22:20.20
why it's a 80-20 balance?
00:22:20.24\00:22:22.00
As I said, I
think there are things,
00:22:22.04\00:22:23.54
societally,
that factor in there.
00:22:23.57\00:22:25.97
But we need to remain proactive
about just doing everything
00:22:26.01\00:22:29.54
that we can do in that sense.
00:22:29.58\00:22:30.91
Know the needs
of your community.
00:22:30.95\00:22:32.61
If it's a question
of low unemployment,
00:22:32.65\00:22:34.75
then you ought to be
having some stuff at your church
00:22:34.78\00:22:37.49
that's dealing with increasing
employment in the community,
00:22:37.52\00:22:40.69
job fairs,
00:22:40.72\00:22:42.06
whatever it will
be that you can do
00:22:42.09\00:22:43.43
within your church
setting for that community
00:22:43.46\00:22:46.09
to attract men also,
00:22:46.13\00:22:48.26
classes on parenting, in
my former responsibility,
00:22:48.30\00:22:52.43
my former
professional responsibility
00:22:52.47\00:22:54.57
as a family counselor,
00:22:54.60\00:22:56.00
you'd be surprised
when I would have cases
00:22:56.04\00:22:57.91
where it was a
father leading a household.
00:22:57.94\00:23:01.48
The men were very committed
00:23:01.51\00:23:03.31
to learning the
parenting skills necessary
00:23:03.35\00:23:06.05
to be able to
present themselves competent,
00:23:06.08\00:23:08.28
you know, within the court
so they could have their...
00:23:08.32\00:23:11.05
Be reunified
with their children.
00:23:11.09\00:23:13.22
So all those
things are important.
00:23:13.25\00:23:16.93
Workshops,
00:23:16.96\00:23:18.99
if it's a matter of
education for substance abuse,
00:23:19.03\00:23:23.93
it's a great problem in many
of our communities with men.
00:23:23.97\00:23:27.00
Divorce is a great problem.
00:23:27.04\00:23:29.04
Financial
management is a great problem.
00:23:29.07\00:23:31.54
So we need to ensure
00:23:31.57\00:23:32.91
that we have all
these things in place
00:23:32.94\00:23:34.28
so we can be as attractive
00:23:34.31\00:23:35.74
as we can to the
men of our community,
00:23:35.78\00:23:38.35
and lastly, big
one today, advocacy.
00:23:38.38\00:23:42.15
Advocacy, and that is getting
behind the male population
00:23:42.18\00:23:45.49
for our community, especially
as it pertains to advocacy.
00:23:45.52\00:23:48.69
The imbalance we
have in society today
00:23:48.72\00:23:50.56
as a release of
civilians and law enforcement,
00:23:50.59\00:23:53.33
we have a role to present
00:23:53.36\00:23:54.93
law enforcement
as a trusted body,
00:23:54.96\00:23:56.77
we have police
officers in our congregation,
00:23:56.80\00:23:58.93
most of us, you know?
00:23:58.97\00:24:00.47
And we have to
be able to embrace
00:24:00.50\00:24:03.20
and help both sides,
00:24:03.24\00:24:04.87
you know,
whether it's the civilian
00:24:04.91\00:24:06.51
that has a need for advocacy
00:24:06.54\00:24:08.08
in terms of being
able to get along better
00:24:08.11\00:24:10.75
with the civil authorities
00:24:10.78\00:24:12.11
or whether it's
the civil authority
00:24:12.15\00:24:13.48
that needs to be presented
in a more positive light
00:24:13.52\00:24:16.42
and work towards
bringing those two together,
00:24:16.45\00:24:18.19
all those things contribute.
00:24:18.22\00:24:19.85
So we need to start a movement.
00:24:19.89\00:24:21.32
Yes.
00:24:21.36\00:24:22.82
That puts men into groups,
00:24:22.86\00:24:26.53
small groups
where they can talk,
00:24:26.56\00:24:28.10
where they can engage,
they can express themselves
00:24:28.13\00:24:31.53
because that's one
of the biggest issues.
00:24:31.57\00:24:33.57
Men are not willing to express.
00:24:33.60\00:24:35.87
But I think once you
get them in a small group,
00:24:35.90\00:24:37.91
that's what we're
finding in our ten minute men,
00:24:37.94\00:24:40.94
get them into that small
group, they express themselves,
00:24:40.98\00:24:43.75
and I'm hoping,
00:24:43.78\00:24:45.21
our long-term goal is that
this concept of ten minute men
00:24:45.25\00:24:48.98
can start in different churches,
00:24:49.02\00:24:52.45
right in the curriculum,
00:24:52.49\00:24:53.82
so it can start
different churches,
00:24:53.86\00:24:55.19
and it can spread
out across the world
00:24:55.22\00:24:57.13
so that men can be empowered,
00:24:57.16\00:24:59.59
you know, men need
to be doing something,
00:24:59.63\00:25:01.40
they need to know
what their purpose is.
00:25:01.43\00:25:03.33
They need to have a purpose,
their purpose is to pray,
00:25:03.37\00:25:06.33
their purpose is to help,
00:25:06.37\00:25:07.70
their purpose
is to do something.
00:25:07.74\00:25:09.07
And I think if we
started doing that,
00:25:09.10\00:25:11.41
we will find that
we'll have more retention,
00:25:11.44\00:25:14.91
we'll retain them in the church,
00:25:14.94\00:25:16.28
and we'll have
more men in the church.
00:25:16.31\00:25:18.21
And I think that's just key
for us to be able to do that
00:25:18.25\00:25:21.05
because we can go
through every possible scenario,
00:25:21.08\00:25:25.85
every process detail,
but at the end of the day,
00:25:25.89\00:25:28.42
it's up to us to do something,
00:25:28.46\00:25:31.36
just like injustices
happening in this world.
00:25:31.39\00:25:34.36
You can be silent about
it, it's still going to happen
00:25:34.40\00:25:36.20
or you can do
something about it.
00:25:36.23\00:25:38.63
And as fathers who were once
00:25:38.67\00:25:42.50
without God, so to speak,
00:25:42.54\00:25:45.11
we should be able to
step up a little more
00:25:45.14\00:25:48.04
and really
speak to these fathers
00:25:48.08\00:25:50.18
who are out of the church
00:25:50.21\00:25:53.45
to come back into
their kids' lives,
00:25:53.48\00:25:55.02
to come back and
do what they're given
00:25:55.05\00:25:57.05
and not just that
but ease hem into it
00:25:57.09\00:25:59.22
and help them
understand what that is,
00:25:59.25\00:26:01.52
what they're supposed to be like
00:26:01.56\00:26:03.32
and how God sees
them and values them
00:26:03.36\00:26:04.99
and that they
don't have to be perfect,
00:26:05.03\00:26:08.00
they can just do
what they need to do.
00:26:08.03\00:26:10.53
And I think,
00:26:10.57\00:26:13.37
as we discussed today,
00:26:13.40\00:26:17.14
there's so many of those details
00:26:17.17\00:26:20.48
when it comes to fatherhood,
00:26:20.51\00:26:21.84
especially when it comes
to fathers in the church.
00:26:21.88\00:26:25.31
There are so many things,
you know, you can be scared,
00:26:25.35\00:26:27.55
I've been scared,
we've all been scared.
00:26:27.58\00:26:30.22
There's apprehension,
00:26:30.25\00:26:31.59
there's I don't want to do this
00:26:31.62\00:26:32.95
or I don't want to
do that in the church.
00:26:32.99\00:26:35.09
The key is not
about what you are
00:26:35.12\00:26:36.59
or are not going
to do in the churches,
00:26:36.62\00:26:38.46
it's just to get connected,
00:26:38.49\00:26:40.70
you know, you don't live
on an island by yourself,
00:26:40.73\00:26:44.33
it's so critical,
we need each other,
00:26:44.37\00:26:46.37
it sounds soft, so to speak,
00:26:46.40\00:26:49.64
but honestly, as
fathers, we do need each other.
00:26:49.67\00:26:52.21
I don't know what I
would do without my friends
00:26:52.24\00:26:54.21
to support each
other, to laugh, to joke,
00:26:54.24\00:26:56.85
to share ideas, share notes,
00:26:56.88\00:26:59.55
whatever it may be
because fatherhood is hard.
00:26:59.58\00:27:03.32
It's hard enough
without believing in God
00:27:03.35\00:27:05.42
or without being with God.
00:27:05.45\00:27:08.49
And why keep, you
know, delaying it?
00:27:08.52\00:27:10.99
Why keep on putting it off,
00:27:11.03\00:27:15.00
making excuses,
00:27:15.03\00:27:17.07
you know, watching sports,
00:27:17.10\00:27:20.60
keeping yourself
preoccupied with things
00:27:20.64\00:27:22.27
that really are
not kingdom building,
00:27:22.30\00:27:25.34
things that are not of
value to your children.
00:27:25.37\00:27:29.04
Even if you don't
do it for yourself,
00:27:29.08\00:27:30.41
do it for your family.
00:27:30.45\00:27:32.41
This is not about you.
00:27:32.45\00:27:33.78
It's about our
families, our kids.
00:27:33.82\00:27:36.32
We live in a broken society
00:27:36.35\00:27:37.75
and the devil is truly out there
00:27:37.79\00:27:40.42
seeking to see
who he may devour.
00:27:40.46\00:27:43.46
It's not a fact, it's a reality.
00:27:43.49\00:27:46.19
Do yourself a favor.
00:27:46.23\00:27:47.83
Step up.
00:27:47.86\00:27:49.20
And if you have questions
00:27:49.23\00:27:50.57
because you're scared or afraid,
00:27:50.60\00:27:52.40
you can always
contact us at afh@3abn.org.
00:27:52.43\00:27:57.21
Please do yourself a favor,
00:27:57.24\00:27:59.94
even if it's
just for one Sabbath,
00:27:59.97\00:28:01.68
come to church.
00:28:01.71\00:28:03.04
Thank you.
00:28:03.08\00:28:04.41