Well hello and welcome!
This is our panel tonight...
00:00:30.74\00:00:34.72
the second part of our program.
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We just had a wonderful
message by Pastor Dwight Nelson.
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And after our panel
then Pastor Stephen Bohr
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will be bringing our
third message tonight.
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But Danny's over on the right
side; I'm on the left side.
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There's no
significance to that whatsoever,
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but we are gathering questions
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and if you from the audience...
I don't know how we can get
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questions in from
television land or not.
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Maybe you can
e-mail them to questions.
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If we'll ever get a hold
of them we'll surely ask them.
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But the live audience here
is working out some questions
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to ask our ex... I
started to say extinguished.
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It's distinguished.
No... DISTINGUISHED.
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Yeah, distinguished.
There's a difference there.
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I had the wrong word. You've
got to be careful with words.
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Experts, too. You don't
want to call them experts
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because when you break
that down: ex is a has been
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and a spurt is a
drip under pressure.
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OK. So they're
not experts either...
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they're just well-qualified
- they really are - Bible
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students. Yeah. All right.
You want to introduce them?
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Do you have a question already?
Well we do. Why don't you
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introduce for our television
audience. Well all right.
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This is Pastor Dwight
Nelson, Pioneer Memorial Church,
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and you've heard
him speak already here.
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Ya'll blessed by Bro.
Dwight? Let him know about it,
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all right? All right! Amen.
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And Pastor John Lomacang,
Pastor of the Thompsonville
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Church - all
right - a regular here.
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Shelley Quinn with 3ABN.
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And everybody knows
Shelley around the world.
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Pastor Stephen
Bohr, Fresno, California.
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And head of the... what's the
name of that ministry, Stephen?
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Secrets Unsealed. All right.
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And then... I didn't want
to mess up the language there,
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you know. And then
Pastor... What's your name, sir?
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Pastor C.A.
Murray. Dr. C.A. Murray.
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All right? Dr. C.A.
Murray. Dr. C.A. Murray.
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We've got a great panel and we
have a great audience tonight.
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We do! This is a
wonderful audience.
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It's great. We want
to... What we want to do...
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We want to have a prayer.
I'm going to ask Pastor John
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if he would say a short
prayer. And we're going to ask
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God's blessing,
anointing, on this panel and
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upon the Holy Spirit tonight
because there are questions
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that many of us have. And
we rarely have the opportunity
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to have this many
folk in front of us
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who are such Bible students
that can help us with these.
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So we're going to ask
the Lord to really bless
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not only what they say
but bless our hearing also.
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Pastor John.
Heavenly Father, we thank you
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for the opportunity
as frail human beings
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to become the vessels now
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through which
Your Holy Spirit works.
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Give wisdom and understanding
that every answer given
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may honor and glorify Your name.
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In Jesus' name,
Amen. Amen; amen.
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OK, the first question...
We got a couple before we
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came out here, so the rest
of you here in the audience
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please write your question
and then raise your hand
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and they'll pick them up for you
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and bring them
to Pastor Jim and I.
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The first question for
our panel tonight is this:
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Is it harder to be
saved or lost or is it easier
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to be saved than lost.
Maybe I should word that.
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Is it easier to
be saved than lost?
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I'm hearing a little
reaction from the audience
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from laughing to
quiet to I'm not sure.
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It's a good question. Shelley,
you going to start that off?
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Your mike's up there.
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Well the thought that comes
to my mind is everywhere I look
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I see evidence of God.
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And it would be to
me absolutely foreign
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to think that someone
wouldn't know that there is
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a Creator... someone
who designed the earth.
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And of course they
have to hear the message
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I suppose to know,
truly, but I'm thinking of the
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missionaries who come back
and tell of tribes in Africa
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where no one
had ever been before
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where people celebrate the
Sabbath and they know about God.
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And I believe that
God is reaching out
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to people everywhere
and I think it is easier
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to be saved because if we really
accept His gifts of grace:
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the Lord Jesus
Christ, the Holy Spirit,
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and we see His Word,
God's plan is to be totally
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dependent upon Him.
And we find that to me
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it's easier to be
saved than it is to be lost.
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OK... somebody else.
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I come down on the side
it's easier to be saved.
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Ephesians 2:10 says we are
created by God for good works.
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We are His
craftsman... His handiwork.
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Created for good works.
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And I'm looking at
II Corinthians 2:14.
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"Now thanks be to
God who always leads us
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in triumph in Christ
and through us diffuses
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the fragrance of His
knowledge in every place. "
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So victory is
guaranteed in Christ Jesus.
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We are created for good works.
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We are created to be like Him.
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Pastor Bohr said
something backstage.
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We were just
talking on another subject.
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But he talked about the
problem is not God's ability...
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it's our
willingness to surrender.
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And if we will
cooperate with Him,
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salvation is guaranteed.
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OK. I think, Danny,
that one of the problems is
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that we reverse the order
when it comes to salvation.
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We think that we need to perform
in order to be saved - oh, oh -
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instead of the idea
that when we come to Christ
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and we yield, we are saved and
then our performance changes.
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Wow! Would you say that
again? That's really deep.
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I mean, that's something that
a lot of us seem to be missing.
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I think Adventists are pretty
much performance oriented.
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Hmmm. I'm all for performance,
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but performance or works
have to come from a relationship
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with Christ. OK.
And in order to have
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a relationship with Christ I
have to yield my will to Him.
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Wow. When I
yield my will to Him,
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then in my life I
perform His will - OK -
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because He's in
control of my will.
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Ya'll agree with that here? OK.
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Well the statement
I'd like to make is
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found in Hebrews 7 and verse 25.
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I like to approach it
from the perspective of
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is there anyone
that Jesus cannot save?
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And according to this text,
no. No matter what you have done
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you can be saved if you
simply submit your life to Him.
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And the question is: "How
completely can He save you? "
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And the Bible
says in Hebrews 7:25
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"Therefore He is able
to save to the uttermost. "
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OK. Coming from New
York City we used to say
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"From the
guttermost to the uttermost. "
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So it's not how
far down you are...
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but the question is:
"How far down can God reach? "
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He can reach to the uttermost.
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He'll save to the
uttermost those who come to God
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through Him. And then
one more text in Hebrews 8.
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Hebrews 9 and verse 12 and 13.
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"Not with the blood of goats and
calves but with His own blood
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He entered the Most Holy Place
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once for all, having
obtained eternal redemption. "
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And get this: this is
always a text to rejoice.
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"For if the blood of
bulls and goats and ashes of
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a heifer sanctifies for
the purifying of the flesh
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how much more
shall the blood of Christ
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who through the eternal Spirit
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offered Himself
without spot to God
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purge your
conscience from dead works
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to serve the living God. "
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There's nothing
that He cannot do
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if we simply submit. He
can save every one of us
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no matter what the
sin to the uttermost.
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That means completely.
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Danny, let me just
be the last on this one.
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And John, I love
that "how much more" line.
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It reminds me of these
words of Jesus here in Matthew 7
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in the Sermon on the
Mount. "If you then, being evil,
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know how to give good gifts
to your children, how much more
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will your Father in
heaven give good things
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to those who ask Him. "
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I don't know a parent on
earth who tries to make it more
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difficult for his
children to love him.
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Every father I
know, every mother I know
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is just wide open in the embrace
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of those precious children.
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I cannot imagine
the God of heaven,
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the Father of the universe,
trying to make it tough
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for His kids to
make it in His family.
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If you're evil and you do
what's right for your children,
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how much more will
the Father of us all
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throw open those
arms and draw us.
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Now look, we have free
choice. We can say "No. "
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Right? We can say "No. "
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But if you say "Yes, "
those arms are around you
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in that instant. All
right... praise the Lord.
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That's good news, right.
If I could just add one thing,
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because John came
from Hebrews also.
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I think the book of
Hebrews was written to assure
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men and women that
Jesus is the real deal.
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He is not sham; He is
not fake; He is not pretend.
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There is a real value
in surrendering your life
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to Christ. And if you
think there is any other way,
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the power is in Christ Jesus.
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And that book of
Hebrews was written to assure us
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that Christ is the real deal.
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And when you surrender
to Him and fall upon Him
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He can carry
you... He can sustain you.
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All right... thank you.
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Could I say one thing?
Shelley, all right. Real short
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now... we've got a
bunch more questions.
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Let's don't do one
question all night long, but
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I just have to add this
one because I was coming
00:10:02.42\00:10:04.42
from a different direction.
I Thessalonians 5:23-24 says:
00:10:04.52\00:10:10.47
"Now may the God of
peace Himself sanctify you
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completely. " It's God's job.
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"And may your whole
spirit, soul, and body
00:10:17.18\00:10:19.27
be preserved blameless
at the coming of our Lord
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Jesus Christ. He who calls you
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is faithful; He will do it. "
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As you said, it's
all about surrender.
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It's God...
salvation belongs to God.
00:10:32.26\00:10:35.55
Amen. That's great
news tonight, right folks?
00:10:35.65\00:10:38.02
Bro. Jim. All right,
somebody gave me a question
00:10:38.32\00:10:40.95
and they asked me if we
were going to get to it.
00:10:41.15\00:10:44.27
At this rate I don't think so.
00:10:44.67\00:10:46.80
But that is a very important
question that you've just been
00:10:47.00\00:10:52.06
talking about. Now this
is sort of a follow-up to it
00:10:52.16\00:10:55.41
from someone who writes and says
00:10:56.56\00:10:59.13
"As long as I believe in Jesus
00:10:59.33\00:11:01.38
do I have to become
a Seventh-day Adventist
00:11:01.58\00:11:04.24
to be saved? "
00:11:04.44\00:11:06.49
Do you want to just say "No"
and go on? Or do you want to
00:11:08.94\00:11:11.92
pontificate? OK, Stephen.
00:11:12.12\00:11:14.93
The Seventh-day Adventist
Church has always believed
00:11:15.23\00:11:18.69
that there are going to
be people saved from not only
00:11:19.29\00:11:23.28
other Christian churches
00:11:23.48\00:11:25.73
but also from non-Christian
churches or organizations.
00:11:25.93\00:11:30.62
We don't believe that salvation
is exclusively Adventist.
00:11:32.00\00:11:35.90
However, we do
believe that when a person
00:11:36.40\00:11:39.50
comes face to face with
the truth of God's Word -
00:11:39.70\00:11:43.23
truth that perhaps
people didn't know before -
00:11:43.43\00:11:45.77
if they're submitted to
Christ and they love Jesus
00:11:45.97\00:11:48.53
they're going to walk with Jesus
and they're going to embrace
00:11:48.73\00:11:51.49
those truths. And some of
those truths are for example
00:11:51.69\00:11:53.73
the Sabbath; the idea that
when a person dies they're dead
00:11:53.83\00:11:56.92
until Jesus comes with
His power to resurrect them;
00:11:57.02\00:11:59.58
the idea of living a
healthful life so we can have
00:11:59.88\00:12:02.32
a clear mind to
communicate better with Jesus.
00:12:02.42\00:12:05.64
In other words,
those things don't save us
00:12:06.05\00:12:09.14
but a saved person
will want to do those things
00:12:09.34\00:12:12.32
because they are in
harmony with the will of Christ.
00:12:12.52\00:12:14.56
All right, John.
00:12:14.77\00:12:16.13
I like to say it this
way: a lot of people would add
00:12:16.23\00:12:18.77
to that a thing
that they haven't said.
00:12:18.87\00:12:20.19
They'll say: "Well do you
think you have the truth? "
00:12:20.30\00:12:22.01
I always say "No. "
00:12:22.21\00:12:24.42
I say: "The truth has us. "
00:12:24.62\00:12:26.41
We are too small
to have the truth.
00:12:27.50\00:12:30.14
The truth has us.
00:12:30.44\00:12:32.09
I'm where I am
because the truth drew me.
00:12:32.29\00:12:35.60
I'm not where I am
because of a label.
00:12:35.80\00:12:38.03
I went looking for truth.
00:12:38.24\00:12:39.67
If I go looking for St. Thomas,
00:12:39.87\00:12:42.15
I'll end up in
the Virgin Islands.
00:12:42.25\00:12:43.90
If I go looking
to Eastern Europe,
00:12:44.30\00:12:46.14
I could end up in
Russia or Ukraine.
00:12:46.24\00:12:49.47
It's what you're looking for.
00:12:49.77\00:12:51.05
If you're looking for the
truth, the truth draws you.
00:12:51.25\00:12:53.97
The Holy Spirit
does the drawing.
00:12:54.47\00:12:56.51
And He who has drawn
me... And I'll just give
00:12:56.62\00:12:58.98
a little small testimony.
I went to different churches
00:12:59.08\00:13:03.05
to see if I could still be
a disc jockey and be saved.
00:13:03.19\00:13:06.57
I went to three, and I
came up with the answer "No. "
00:13:07.47\00:13:10.94
And so here I am... not because
I believe I have the truth
00:13:12.08\00:13:15.27
but the truth has me. All right.
00:13:15.48\00:13:17.68
Good good answer. Anybody else?
00:13:17.98\00:13:19.80
OK. Next question. All right.
00:13:20.20\00:13:23.89
This one says: "Will the
final death of the wicked
00:13:24.09\00:13:26.72
be from the same experience
as Jesus on the cross?
00:13:26.92\00:13:31.53
Or will they die from the
flames or of the knowledge
00:13:31.73\00:13:35.49
they are eternally forsaken?
00:13:35.69\00:13:37.74
What destroys the
wicked in the end?
00:13:37.94\00:13:41.02
Danny, let me respond to
that since we just came out of
00:13:42.96\00:13:45.43
a study on Calvary.
00:13:45.53\00:13:47.07
I believe with all my heart
that what Jesus was experiencing
00:13:48.07\00:13:51.54
on the cross IS
the second death.
00:13:51.94\00:13:54.77
He was paying the wage.
00:13:54.97\00:13:56.65
The wage of the second
death is not death by fire.
00:13:56.95\00:14:00.30
The wage of the second
death is eternal separation
00:14:00.50\00:14:03.94
from the life source.
00:14:04.14\00:14:05.90
God is the source of all life.
00:14:06.10\00:14:07.78
I have been in many a hospital
room and I know the pastors
00:14:08.91\00:14:11.27
on this - and Shelley as well -
00:14:11.37\00:14:14.02
have had this experience
in an ICU unit where you are
00:14:14.42\00:14:17.46
standing beside...
by the side of someone
00:14:17.56\00:14:20.37
whose life is being
sustained mechanically.
00:14:20.47\00:14:23.81
The respirator is
breathing for the individual.
00:14:24.21\00:14:29.21
That person is alive
simply because of the
00:14:30.14\00:14:33.07
life-support system.
00:14:33.17\00:14:34.62
I've been in that ICU room when
the family made the decision,
00:14:34.82\00:14:38.56
Pastor Steve, to... as
we say... "pull the plug. "
00:14:38.66\00:14:41.91
And the technician
walked in. We were singing songs
00:14:42.21\00:14:45.13
together. Papa went
through an open-heart surgery
00:14:45.34\00:14:47.09
that went bad.
And we stood there
00:14:47.30\00:14:50.97
as that technician walked
over to that piece of machinery
00:14:51.17\00:14:53.99
and clicked the button.
00:14:54.19\00:14:56.23
That life-support
system is what infused life.
00:14:58.18\00:15:03.14
If we can imagine
God as the ultimate...
00:15:04.17\00:15:06.62
the eternal life-support system,
00:15:06.72\00:15:08.14
He is the source of
life for the whole universe,
00:15:08.27\00:15:10.28
death is when we pull the plug.
00:15:10.48\00:15:12.39
God doesn't pull the plug on us.
00:15:12.59\00:15:14.29
We pull the plug. We
choose to live separately
00:15:14.49\00:15:18.88
from the Son.
00:15:19.18\00:15:21.39
I John 5: "She who
has the Son has life...
00:15:21.59\00:15:24.54
he who does not have
the Son does not... " What?
00:15:24.74\00:15:27.44
You're not in the
life-support system.
00:15:27.64\00:15:29.91
And I don't believe that
hell is about God... God using
00:15:30.31\00:15:35.21
fire to extinguish life.
00:15:35.41\00:15:37.19
Calvary is proof enough.
00:15:37.39\00:15:38.58
Your heart
breaks when you realize
00:15:38.98\00:15:41.61
that you are being
separated from the Father.
00:15:41.71\00:15:43.25
Jesus died of a
broken heart. And I believe
00:15:43.35\00:15:45.43
all the children of the Father
- they are still His children -
00:15:45.73\00:15:48.70
they are not dogs now...
they are not animals now.
00:15:48.73\00:15:51.39
They are His children.
00:15:51.59\00:15:52.76
They will die in
the same way Jesus died.
00:15:52.96\00:15:55.29
The life-support
system will be shut off.
00:15:55.59\00:15:58.31
The heart will break.
00:15:58.61\00:16:00.57
Satan will be the last to
acknowledge... the last to
00:16:00.97\00:16:04.05
acknowledge that he has
lived in rebellion against Him
00:16:04.25\00:16:08.51
who is life... but
his heart will break.
00:16:08.61\00:16:11.01
Of course there's fire.
00:16:11.51\00:16:13.24
The whole earth is
re-created by that fire.
00:16:13.44\00:16:15.88
It's purified.
And then God says...
00:16:16.08\00:16:18.15
John says: "I saw a new
heaven and a new earth. "
00:16:18.35\00:16:20.86
You know, I was watching
in part the Jody Arias trial.
00:16:21.07\00:16:24.82
Some of you have seen that.
00:16:25.02\00:16:26.17
And I did that for
a particular reason.
00:16:26.37\00:16:28.19
Not to glory in
what was happening but
00:16:28.39\00:16:30.17
I cannot forget... they're
still in the penalty phase now
00:16:30.37\00:16:33.05
even though the
verdict has been reached...
00:16:33.25\00:16:35.08
the words that she
has echoed repeatedly:
00:16:35.38\00:16:37.93
"I'd rather die... "
That was the early statement.
00:16:38.13\00:16:41.55
"than spend my life
because that to me is worse. "
00:16:41.75\00:16:45.81
And I think that what
she was saying there is what
00:16:46.21\00:16:48.62
is echoed here in
Psalm 112 and verse 10.
00:16:48.73\00:16:51.40
I believe that hell is, first
of all, realizing what you've
00:16:52.59\00:16:55.08
lost. You see, being
alive brings a greater reality
00:16:55.18\00:17:00.27
of what you've lost than
your life being extinguished
00:17:00.37\00:17:03.83
where there is no
knowledge of what you've lost.
00:17:03.93\00:17:05.93
And in the book of
Psalms 112 and verse 10
00:17:06.33\00:17:10.76
it says: "The wicked
will see it and be grieved.
00:17:10.96\00:17:14.20
He will gnash his
teeth and melt away.
00:17:14.50\00:17:18.23
The desire of the
wicked shall perish. "
00:17:18.53\00:17:21.12
And that connects to
Matthew 25 where it says
00:17:21.42\00:17:23.95
that the unprofitable servant
will be cast in outer darkness.
00:17:24.15\00:17:27.01
That there will be
weeping and gnashing of teeth.
00:17:27.22\00:17:29.15
The weeping and
gnashing of teeth is more hell
00:17:29.45\00:17:31.73
than being destroyed
in the fires of hell.
00:17:31.93\00:17:35.35
When you realize
you've missed your flight
00:17:35.55\00:17:37.21
it's the worst
thing than anything else.
00:17:37.41\00:17:40.73
When you realize
the doors are shut
00:17:40.94\00:17:42.84
and there's no second chance
00:17:43.04\00:17:44.23
it is more hell than the
actual destruction itself.
00:17:44.43\00:17:47.48
I'd just like to follow up
on something that Pastor Dwight
00:17:49.64\00:17:52.17
had to say.
00:17:52.27\00:17:53.41
You know, Jesus - when He was
in the Garden of Gethsemane -
00:17:54.80\00:17:57.47
would have died in the garden
before anyone placed one finger
00:17:58.68\00:18:02.32
on Him... which means that
He did not die from the wounds
00:18:02.42\00:18:06.91
that He had. He would have died
00:18:07.01\00:18:09.32
simply because of the weight
of sin that He was carrying.
00:18:09.35\00:18:11.85
And I think that the good
news here is not so much...
00:18:12.25\00:18:15.41
You know, I believe the fire
ultimately is going to consume
00:18:15.61\00:18:18.51
the wicked, but the good
news is that Jesus suffered
00:18:18.61\00:18:22.73
that experience of
separation from God
00:18:23.03\00:18:26.43
so that we don't
have to suffer it.
00:18:26.53\00:18:28.07
The wicked will suffer
their own experience...
00:18:28.27\00:18:30.74
their own experience
of separation from God
00:18:31.04\00:18:33.63
because they
didn't accept Christ
00:18:33.83\00:18:35.42
who suffered that
experience for them.
00:18:35.52\00:18:37.52
And so we need to make
sure that we receive Christ
00:18:37.82\00:18:40.27
as our Savior and we'll
never go through that experience
00:18:40.37\00:18:43.17
because He did.
00:18:43.27\00:18:44.36
Stephen, not to prolong
this too much, but think of
00:18:44.76\00:18:46.97
all the tithe you've
paid into the church.
00:18:47.07\00:18:50.32
Think of all the meetings
you've paid... all the songs
00:18:50.62\00:18:53.04
that you've sung, Pastor John.
00:18:53.14\00:18:54.42
All the sermons
you guys have preached.
00:18:54.62\00:18:56.25
All the time and preparation.
00:18:56.45\00:18:58.13
All the times
you've denied yourself.
00:18:58.33\00:18:59.95
All the times someone has said
something really stupid to you
00:19:00.15\00:19:03.08
and you wanted to say
something back but you didn't
00:19:03.29\00:19:05.60
because you're a Christian.
00:19:05.71\00:19:06.79
And you didn't say
anything... you just took it
00:19:06.99\00:19:09.35
and you swallowed it.
00:19:09.55\00:19:10.58
And the times when somebody cut
you off and you didn't curse,
00:19:10.78\00:19:13.27
you didn't say
anything, you just took it
00:19:13.37\00:19:14.95
'cause you're a Christian.
And the times when somebody
00:19:15.05\00:19:17.35
cheated you or robbed you
and you didn't say anything,
00:19:17.45\00:19:19.45
you just took it
because you're a Christian.
00:19:19.55\00:19:21.19
And you spent all of
that time controlling yourself
00:19:21.50\00:19:23.92
and holding onto
yourself but you never really
00:19:24.12\00:19:26.22
got a hold of Jesus and
you come down to the last day
00:19:26.32\00:19:29.48
thinking you're ready to
go up and you hear the voice
00:19:29.68\00:19:31.46
"Depart from Me; I know you not"
00:19:31.56\00:19:33.01
or you run away from Him
and hide because you cannot
00:19:33.21\00:19:35.77
stand the brightness,
you cannot stand the light.
00:19:35.88\00:19:38.28
think of the agony that will be.
00:19:38.58\00:19:41.05
Think what you feel
sitting here now... what you
00:19:41.35\00:19:43.51
felt while Pastor
Dwight was preaching,
00:19:43.71\00:19:45.17
what you will feel when
Pastor Bohr is preaching.
00:19:45.27\00:19:47.28
To go through all of that
and get down to Judgment Day
00:19:47.38\00:19:50.05
and not be ready
and not be prepared.
00:19:50.26\00:19:52.78
I rather think the fire
will be a welcome relief
00:19:52.98\00:19:55.94
rather than having to face the
Jesus that you have disappointed
00:19:56.14\00:19:59.40
that you have let down,
that you are not ready to see.
00:19:59.50\00:20:01.78
You talk about
hell? That's what hell is
00:20:01.98\00:20:04.05
is separation
from the Life Giver.
00:20:04.15\00:20:06.41
And that will be much
more devastating than any fire
00:20:06.54\00:20:09.28
that could ever burn. Now
the follow-up to that question
00:20:09.38\00:20:12.28
here, if I can read this
'cause it's really pretty much
00:20:12.38\00:20:15.07
related. It says:
"The sanctuary lamb died
00:20:15.17\00:20:18.27
by bleeding to death.
Jesus died on the cross
00:20:18.47\00:20:22.00
with an exploding
heart, bleeding to death.
00:20:22.21\00:20:25.42
Will not the wicked die
convicted of their chosen life
00:20:25.46\00:20:30.38
of sin of a
broken, shattered heart
00:20:30.48\00:20:34.22
and that the fire is
just to clean up the mess. "
00:20:34.43\00:20:37.52
I don't know if that's
a question or a statement
00:20:39.12\00:20:42.00
but it's right on this
subject we're talking about.
00:20:42.21\00:20:45.40
I wanted to interject it here.
00:20:45.60\00:20:47.16
I think that would be a
pretty good description.
00:20:47.36\00:20:49.52
You know, I'd just like
to mention something about
00:20:49.92\00:20:53.59
the previous question.
00:20:53.79\00:20:55.17
You know, I was
listening to Dwight's sermon
00:20:55.47\00:20:58.78
in the back room as we
were preparing to come out
00:20:58.88\00:21:01.10
and I noticed that he
read several statements from
00:21:01.40\00:21:03.72
the chapter
Gethsemane in Desire of Ages.
00:21:03.92\00:21:06.61
There Ellen White clearly
says that Jesus felt like
00:21:07.96\00:21:10.88
sinners who are lost
will feel at the end.
00:21:11.08\00:21:14.07
They're going to feel the agony;
they could have been saved
00:21:14.47\00:21:17.00
and they're going to be
eternally separated from God.
00:21:17.10\00:21:18.86
That is the great
anguish of the second death.
00:21:19.06\00:21:21.53
You know, it's like
the experience of Jonah
00:21:21.83\00:21:24.36
in the belly of the fish.
00:21:24.57\00:21:25.82
You know, he felt like he would
never, never see the face of God
00:21:26.12\00:21:30.24
again. And of course,
he's symbolic of the experience
00:21:30.34\00:21:32.75
that Christ went through.
00:21:32.85\00:21:34.01
So, you know, fire
will clean up the mess
00:21:34.21\00:21:37.47
but the anguish
that comes before that
00:21:37.67\00:21:40.26
of being separated from God
as Jack Sequeira used to say
00:21:40.46\00:21:44.24
"saying goodbye
to life forever. "
00:21:44.44\00:21:45.64
That's where it is.
00:21:45.84\00:21:48.37
OK. I want to continue this
because it's such an important
00:21:48.78\00:21:53.19
topic. Right now there are
people watching. They're saying:
00:21:53.40\00:21:56.58
"Why are they talking
about how they're dying a death?
00:21:56.78\00:21:59.53
They burn forever. "
00:21:59.84\00:22:01.43
I mean, people burn forever.
That's what a lot of people
00:22:01.63\00:22:04.77
think. Isn't it
great news that God
00:22:04.87\00:22:08.43
is not in the business
of torturing and tormenting
00:22:08.53\00:22:10.71
people for eternity?
00:22:10.81\00:22:12.14
And when you tell people that
I am amazed that most people
00:22:12.34\00:22:15.37
get upset. So I asked one
Christian I was talking to...
00:22:15.47\00:22:18.53
He saw me in town and he said:
00:22:18.73\00:22:20.94
"You've got to get onto
your preachers out there. "
00:22:21.24\00:22:23.65
Stephen Bohr was
one of those. He said:
00:22:24.05\00:22:26.06
"That guy preaches that there's
no eternal burning hell! "
00:22:26.26\00:22:29.95
And he said: "You need to talk
to him or get him off the air.
00:22:30.15\00:22:32.92
That's terrible! " And I said...
00:22:33.12\00:22:34.81
I said: "But
isn't that good news? "
00:22:35.11\00:22:37.24
And he said: "No,
that's not good news. "
00:22:37.44\00:22:39.68
I said: "That's not
good news? Why not? "
00:22:39.71\00:22:41.77
And here's what he said:
00:22:42.07\00:22:43.38
"Because I'm a preacher
and how else you gonna get
00:22:43.58\00:22:46.60
people saved if you can't tell
them that they're going to burn
00:22:46.70\00:22:49.66
forever? How you
gonna get them saved? "
00:22:49.76\00:22:51.87
How would you answer that,
Steve? Since that's a question:
00:22:52.17\00:22:54.56
"How you gonna get
people saved if you don't preach
00:22:54.77\00:22:58.09
that they're
going to burn forever? "
00:22:58.19\00:22:59.22
The Bible tells us that we're
saved by righteousness by faith
00:22:59.41\00:23:02.20
not righteousness by fear.
00:23:02.30\00:23:03.84
OK... all right.
00:23:04.04\00:23:05.72
Danny, could I add something
to that that to me just makes
00:23:05.82\00:23:08.29
all the sense in the world.
00:23:08.39\00:23:09.73
The Bible says that
only God is immortal.
00:23:10.03\00:23:13.41
Only God has immortality.
00:23:13.71\00:23:16.13
Created beings do not have.
00:23:16.43\00:23:18.27
We will not put on
immortality until the end.
00:23:18.47\00:23:21.60
So the word "forever" is a word
that describes a period of time.
00:23:22.00\00:23:27.95
When we're talking about
Christ reigning forever and ever
00:23:28.15\00:23:31.84
because He is immortal
00:23:32.04\00:23:34.72
there will not be
an end to His reign.
00:23:34.92\00:23:37.28
But when it talks about Sodom
and Gomorrah burning forever
00:23:37.48\00:23:41.77
or hell burning forever
00:23:41.97\00:23:43.77
because we are
mortal and they are mortal
00:23:43.97\00:23:47.49
there will be
and end to that time.
00:23:47.59\00:23:49.34
When destruction is
complete that's the end of it.
00:23:50.55\00:23:54.00
And I was baptized
because of fear of going to hell
00:23:54.40\00:24:00.11
when I was a child.
00:24:00.32\00:24:01.47
Three times I was baptized
from the fear of going to hell.
00:24:01.77\00:24:05.46
Fear is only a
temporary motivator.
00:24:05.69\00:24:08.96
It is love and a changed heart
00:24:09.26\00:24:12.17
and a relationship with God
that keeps people in the church.
00:24:12.37\00:24:15.85
Sounds like Shelley had
more saves than a relief pitcher
00:24:16.15\00:24:18.68
in the major leagues. So...
00:24:18.78\00:24:22.01
You know, part
of the process of...
00:24:22.41\00:24:25.88
the purpose for the fire
is not so much for the wicked
00:24:26.08\00:24:29.31
but for the righteous.
00:24:29.41\00:24:30.69
You see, as God erases
sin and every memory of it
00:24:30.99\00:24:35.31
He creates a perfect
environment for the righteous.
00:24:35.51\00:24:38.11
He's not perpetuating sin...
He's perpetuating righteousness.
00:24:38.41\00:24:43.51
Eternal burning is
a perpetuation of sin.
00:24:43.75\00:24:46.89
And the product of destruction
00:24:47.20\00:24:51.18
is not the
process of destruction.
00:24:51.38\00:24:53.50
So the product is
they are eternally gone...
00:24:53.53\00:24:57.52
not the process.
00:24:57.82\00:24:59.01
So this whole process of
eternal... People often forget
00:24:59.11\00:25:01.86
the verses right before
that. "Fire came down from God
00:25:01.96\00:25:04.46
out of heaven
and devoured them. "
00:25:04.56\00:25:06.53
The Lord is not looking forward
for there to be a smoking
00:25:06.73\00:25:09.50
eternity but where there
is no memory. No more pain,
00:25:09.60\00:25:15.42
no more death... for the former
things shall not be remembered
00:25:15.52\00:25:18.53
nor come to mind. How
will they not be remembered
00:25:18.63\00:25:20.52
if my uncle or family members
are still burning and withering
00:25:20.82\00:25:24.63
in the fires of
hell somewhere on earth?
00:25:24.73\00:25:26.13
And whenever I ask that
question: "Where is hell? "
00:25:26.23\00:25:28.55
people say: "Somewhere. "
00:25:28.75\00:25:30.21
They can never
find the location.
00:25:30.51\00:25:32.32
But it's the whole
earth before sin is destroyed.
00:25:33.63\00:25:37.69
Just very quickly there
are two texts in Ezekiel
00:25:38.29\00:25:41.15
that say "the soul
that sins shall die. "
00:25:41.25\00:25:43.32
Most of those texts -
I think there are three
00:25:43.52\00:25:46.16
that pop into my mind -
that seem to say that we burn
00:25:46.36\00:25:49.53
forever come from Revelation.
00:25:49.63\00:25:51.52
And just as a point of
when you're trying to determine
00:25:51.62\00:25:55.82
what the Bible says you
need to look at the book.
00:25:55.92\00:25:57.56
You don't want to
develop hard doctrinal premises
00:25:57.66\00:26:01.28
from texts that just come
from the book of Revelation.
00:26:01.38\00:26:03.56
You need to go through the
whole constellation of texts
00:26:03.87\00:26:07.61
to try to find
your doctrinal premise.
00:26:07.81\00:26:09.59
In a book that
has so much illusion,
00:26:09.99\00:26:12.10
so many things that are
representative of other things,
00:26:13.66\00:26:16.29
you need to be very, very
careful when you try to develop
00:26:16.49\00:26:19.89
a doctrinal premise
from the book of Revelation
00:26:20.09\00:26:22.47
alone. If you see a
parallel in other places,
00:26:22.67\00:26:25.50
then you can
plant your feet down.
00:26:25.60\00:26:26.77
But if it's only in Revelation
you want to be really, really
00:26:26.87\00:26:29.57
careful before you try to
develop a doctrine from that.
00:26:29.67\00:26:32.27
Danny, let me come
back just one more time.
00:26:32.57\00:26:34.63
There is a verse... I'm
sure these seasoned evangelists
00:26:34.83\00:26:37.89
have used this verse before
00:26:38.09\00:26:39.18
but I never knew
it was in the Bible.
00:26:39.28\00:26:40.78
I just found it
within the last 18 months.
00:26:40.99\00:26:44.30
This is over here in
Jeremiah chapter 51 verse 57.
00:26:44.60\00:26:49.62
This is so powerful.
00:26:49.82\00:26:51.54
God is describing the end
00:26:51.84\00:26:54.52
of those who have
walked away from Him.
00:26:54.72\00:26:57.16
And here is His
description: Jeremiah 51:57.
00:26:57.36\00:27:01.50
"And they shall
sleep a perpetual sleep
00:27:01.80\00:27:05.25
and not awake says the King
00:27:05.45\00:27:08.22
whose name is
the Lord of Hosts. "
00:27:08.32\00:27:10.19
The TNIV... the
New NIV renders it:
00:27:10.39\00:27:13.25
"And they will sleep forever. "
00:27:13.45\00:27:15.68
That's what we believe
the Bible teaches about hell:
00:27:15.88\00:27:18.85
you go to sleep
forever and ever. Amen.
00:27:19.05\00:27:21.64
All right.
That's good news, right?
00:27:21.67\00:27:24.23
Steve's got his
mike up. One more comment
00:27:24.43\00:27:26.74
then we'll go to Jim.
00:27:26.84\00:27:28.28
Well I have a
little different concept.
00:27:29.70\00:27:31.94
I believe that the fire
that consumes the wicked
00:27:32.35\00:27:35.85
is eternal but the
wicked are not eternal.
00:27:36.05\00:27:39.97
That's right. See, the
fire that consumes the wicked
00:27:40.17\00:27:42.87
is the glory of God.
00:27:42.97\00:27:44.43
Um-hmm. Let me
just read Exodus 24
00:27:44.63\00:27:47.87
and verse 17. It's
speaking about the fire
00:27:48.17\00:27:51.00
on Mt. Sinai.
00:27:51.20\00:27:52.88
It says: "The sight of
the glory of the Lord... "
00:27:53.08\00:27:55.52
Notice... of the
glory of the Lord...
00:27:55.72\00:27:57.87
"was like a consuming
fire on the top of the mountain
00:27:58.80\00:28:01.95
in the eyes of the
children of Israel. "
00:28:02.15\00:28:04.02
So the consuming fire
is the glory of the Lord.
00:28:04.95\00:28:07.91
You know, those who believe
that the wicked are going to
00:28:08.82\00:28:11.30
burn in hell
forever... they've got it wrong!
00:28:11.40\00:28:14.46
It's the righteous that
are going to live in the midst
00:28:15.30\00:28:17.49
of the flames forever. OK.
00:28:17.59\00:28:20.12
You say: "Where does
the Bible teach that? "
00:28:20.22\00:28:21.54
In Isaiah 33.
00:28:22.23\00:28:23.75
It says in verse 14: "The
sinners in Zion are afraid,
00:28:24.15\00:28:27.47
fearfulness has
seized the hypocrites. "
00:28:27.67\00:28:29.34
And then asks the question:
"Who among us shall dwell
00:28:29.54\00:28:32.33
with the devouring fire?
00:28:32.53\00:28:33.86
Who among us shall dwell
with everlasting burnings? "
00:28:34.98\00:28:37.87
Notice the answer:
00:28:38.17\00:28:39.60
"He who walks righteously
and speaks uprightly.
00:28:39.90\00:28:43.23
He who despises
the gain of oppression,
00:28:43.46\00:28:45.69
who gestures with his
hands refusing bribes,
00:28:45.89\00:28:48.44
who stops his ears
from hearing of bloodshed
00:28:48.64\00:28:51.19
and shuts his eyes
from seeing evil. "
00:28:51.49\00:28:53.48
It's the righteous that will
live in the midst of the fire
00:28:53.78\00:28:56.14
because the glory of
God is the consuming fire.
00:28:56.34\00:28:58.34
Wow! The fire is eternal
00:28:58.54\00:29:00.46
but that which the fire
consumes is not eternal.
00:29:00.66\00:29:03.81
OK, thank you. I had my Bible
open to that just last week.
00:29:04.11\00:29:07.24
I've got my paper
still here. Appreciate that.
00:29:07.44\00:29:08.67
All right. Bro. Jim. Well
these are really good answers.
00:29:09.74\00:29:13.65
And now this question is
one that we run into from time
00:29:13.85\00:29:17.66
to time: "Should we
observe the feasts and festivals
00:29:17.76\00:29:22.00
and if we should, why
should we or why not? "
00:29:22.20\00:29:26.94
All right. Who goes first? John?
00:29:31.46\00:29:33.79
First John. All right.
00:29:34.83\00:29:38.34
It's funny that you
asked that question.
00:29:39.43\00:29:41.62
I was up in Minnesota...
I was making that reference
00:29:41.72\00:29:44.42
this morning... and I did
a little more than an hour
00:29:44.52\00:29:47.75
presentation:
Feast Days or Not. Yeah.
00:29:47.85\00:29:51.86
And I asked a question
that couldn't be answered.
00:29:51.99\00:29:54.75
And I asked just a
general question - much longer -
00:29:54.95\00:29:57.30
but I just want to
put this one out there.
00:29:57.50\00:29:58.55
I thought it was an
apex of the whole thing.
00:29:58.65\00:29:59.97
We are living in the
anti-typical Day of Atonement.
00:30:00.87\00:30:05.71
We are living in the
what? Say this together: the...
00:30:05.92\00:30:09.74
And so when did the anti-
typical Day of Atonement begin?
00:30:09.95\00:30:14.19
1844.
00:30:17.93\00:30:19.49
When will it end?
00:30:19.69\00:30:21.20
So can type and antitype
exist together is the question.
00:30:22.51\00:30:27.57
And my answer is "No. "
00:30:28.41\00:30:29.99
You see, all the types pointed
to the coming of the antitype.
00:30:30.99\00:30:35.08
All the feasts were symbols
and signs and object lessons
00:30:35.94\00:30:41.77
of what the work of
Christ would accomplish.
00:30:41.91\00:30:44.31
And so they all
pointed to the coming Messiah.
00:30:44.61\00:30:47.55
And the big argument is
people say that when the Bible
00:30:47.75\00:30:50.09
says in Colossians 2
"Let no one judge you
00:30:50.19\00:30:53.05
of meats and drinks and
new moons and Sabbath days"
00:30:53.15\00:30:56.05
the big argument among many
of those who observe the feasts
00:30:56.35\00:30:59.66
is that that
doesn't refer to the feasts.
00:30:59.96\00:31:02.33
But new moons,
holy days, Sabbath days,
00:31:02.63\00:31:06.62
all refer to the feasts.
So the answer in a nutshell
00:31:06.82\00:31:08.63
to me is: "No, we
are in the antitype. "
00:31:08.83\00:31:11.75
The types all led
up to the antitype.
00:31:11.95\00:31:16.11
The lamb... to Christ.
00:31:16.41\00:31:18.27
All the feasts,
all their works, led to
00:31:18.37\00:31:20.66
the work that
Christ would accomplish.
00:31:20.76\00:31:22.35
And there's a statement.
I'm going to let some of the
00:31:22.65\00:31:24.25
other brethren
speak. I'll look for it here
00:31:24.35\00:31:25.65
and just share it
with you in just a moment.
00:31:25.75\00:31:27.04
OK, it's... Dwight. I'm
not going to shed any light
00:31:29.08\00:31:32.33
on this, but if the
Creator of the universe
00:31:32.43\00:31:34.98
has had a difficult time
getting His earth children
00:31:35.18\00:31:38.40
to remember one day -
00:31:38.70\00:31:40.67
all right, come on -
00:31:42.23\00:31:43.44
how in the world is He
going to get 7 billion children
00:31:43.64\00:31:47.07
to remember 7 or 9 holy days?
00:31:47.17\00:31:50.81
It's just... And John's answer.
00:31:51.11\00:31:53.44
That didn't answer the question
but John's point is well taken.
00:31:53.54\00:31:56.00
They were shadows pointing
forward to the culmination.
00:31:56.14\00:32:00.56
Once in a while I get a letter
from some dear friend of Jesus
00:32:00.86\00:32:04.57
somewhere on earth saying
00:32:04.78\00:32:06.21
"I think we've got to
go back to the feasts. "
00:32:06.34\00:32:08.29
Why go back to that
which has been fulfilled?
00:32:09.16\00:32:11.98
We need to keep our eyes
on the great feast of the
00:32:12.09\00:32:15.29
Lamb's Supper in heaven.
00:32:15.39\00:32:17.08
That's the feast
we're looking forward to.
00:32:17.18\00:32:18.80
All right, thank
you. All right... Steve.
00:32:19.00\00:32:21.21
Yes. In the
prophecy of the 70 weeks
00:32:22.43\00:32:25.29
there's a very
interesting little phrase.
00:32:26.50\00:32:28.91
It says that He shall bring...
this is verse 27 of Daniel 9...
00:32:29.31\00:32:33.41
"He shall bring an end
to sacrifice and offering. "
00:32:33.61\00:32:37.46
In the King James
it says "He shall cause
00:32:37.57\00:32:42.29
the sacrifice and
the oblation to cease. "
00:32:42.59\00:32:45.59
Now there's something
that maybe we've missed here,
00:32:45.90\00:32:48.52
and that's the
comment that Ellen White makes
00:32:48.82\00:32:50.82
in Desire of Ages
00:32:50.92\00:32:52.51
where she says that the priest
had the knife in his hand.
00:32:52.81\00:32:56.12
He was ready to slit
the throat of the lamb.
00:32:56.42\00:32:59.24
And then you had the earthquake
00:32:59.54\00:33:01.34
and the lamb escaped
and the lamb never died
00:33:01.64\00:33:04.24
because the real Lamb
of God died at that moment.
00:33:04.54\00:33:08.40
God was trying to say:
"No more sacrifice of lambs
00:33:08.81\00:33:12.67
because the
real Lamb has died. "
00:33:12.87\00:33:14.58
And so Ellen White says
that to celebrate the Passover
00:33:14.78\00:33:18.18
would be an insult to Jehovah.
00:33:18.48\00:33:21.25
I mean that's a
very strong expression.
00:33:21.45\00:33:23.51
And you know, if He
doesn't require to celebrate
00:33:23.81\00:33:25.62
the Passover, I don't think
that He would require us to do
00:33:25.72\00:33:29.50
any of the other feasts that
have already been fulfilled.
00:33:29.60\00:33:32.28
And I want to add to
that. Thank you so much
00:33:32.58\00:33:34.54
for bringing that point.
It appears in this statement
00:33:34.64\00:33:37.99
Ellen White makes, she says...
speaking of Christ and the
00:33:38.09\00:33:40.34
disciples she
says: "This was virtually
00:33:40.44\00:33:43.00
the last Passover that
was ever to be celebrated
00:33:43.20\00:33:46.85
for type was to meet antitype
00:33:47.06\00:33:49.30
in the slaying of the Lamb of
God for the sins of the world. "
00:33:49.50\00:33:52.69
Also study further into
that and people say: "Paul the
00:33:52.99\00:33:55.26
apostle kept the
feasts for a short time. "
00:33:55.36\00:33:57.35
He used the feasts -
and read what she says -
00:33:57.45\00:33:59.29
he used the feasts to
teach the work of Christ
00:33:59.49\00:34:03.05
but he never imposed
the keeping of feasts
00:34:03.25\00:34:05.29
on the New Testament church.
00:34:05.49\00:34:07.05
So no, I don't
believe that the feasts
00:34:07.35\00:34:08.83
should be...
continue to be kept.
00:34:09.03\00:34:10.47
You know, there was
the celebration of a feast
00:34:10.57\00:34:12.29
say by the apostle
Paul was really descriptive
00:34:12.39\00:34:15.60
not prescriptive.
Correct. In other words,
00:34:15.70\00:34:17.32
he simply because he was a Jew
and he knew that Jews would be
00:34:17.52\00:34:19.92
celebrating the feasts,
you know, he went because
00:34:20.02\00:34:22.48
he knew he
would find them there.
00:34:22.58\00:34:24.11
OK, Danny. All
right. Let's move on.
00:34:24.41\00:34:26.98
This one says: "My
son is starting college.
00:34:27.38\00:34:30.20
And how can we as
parents continue to guide him
00:34:30.50\00:34:33.65
towards the truth as he begins
to become more independent? "
00:34:33.85\00:34:38.55
I can answer that one:
send him to Andrews University
00:34:38.85\00:34:41.63
and Bro. Dwight
Nelson will be his pastor.
00:34:41.73\00:34:43.94
All right.
00:34:44.74\00:34:45.95
That'll work.
00:34:48.14\00:34:49.51
Dwight, you have dealt
with thousands of young people.
00:34:50.61\00:34:54.32
How would you
answer these parents?
00:34:54.52\00:34:56.02
It is a tough
00:34:57.09\00:35:00.08
crossing for a
parent to relinquish
00:35:02.28\00:35:05.91
his or her child to
independence and to free choice.
00:35:06.21\00:35:10.57
God does it
with every one of us.
00:35:10.80\00:35:12.58
It's a tough moment
when God says: "All right,
00:35:12.78\00:35:14.82
you're free to choose. "
00:35:15.02\00:35:16.70
The most critical
weapon a parent possesses
00:35:17.79\00:35:21.51
are these two pieces
of the anatomy right here.
00:35:22.87\00:35:25.66
I am absolutely
convinced that parental prayer
00:35:26.06\00:35:30.34
intercession is
absolutely essential
00:35:30.54\00:35:33.84
for the
salvation of our children.
00:35:34.14\00:35:35.87
OK. You say: "Well I'll come
up with clever little answers. "
00:35:36.27\00:35:38.58
"I'll come up
with strategic gifts. "
00:35:38.78\00:35:43.72
Yeah, all of that is the
outpouring of a mother's love,
00:35:44.02\00:35:47.10
is the outpouring
of a father's love.
00:35:47.20\00:35:48.78
But the intercession
before the Jesus that John just
00:35:48.88\00:35:52.65
read in Hebrews 7:25
"who ever lives to make
00:35:52.85\00:35:55.04
intercession for us... "
The parental intercession
00:35:55.14\00:35:57.30
for children is
God's most potent weapon.
00:35:57.50\00:36:01.38
Because if the child is
not praying for himself,
00:36:01.68\00:36:04.32
if she's too caught up in
the giddiness of being free
00:36:04.52\00:36:07.62
and she's not
praying for herself,
00:36:07.82\00:36:09.03
God still has - by the authority
of that godly mother's prayers -
00:36:09.23\00:36:14.44
permission to step
into that life and offer her
00:36:14.64\00:36:18.24
again and again -
praise the Lord - offer him
00:36:18.44\00:36:21.47
the opportunity. "Come
on, boy, come back to Me.
00:36:21.67\00:36:23.61
You're getting too far.
Come on back to me, boy,
00:36:23.71\00:36:25.71
your mother's praying for you. "
00:36:25.91\00:36:27.36
Love it. All right.
Maybe we can move on.
00:36:27.66\00:36:29.57
That was a good one.
Let's move on to that one.
00:36:29.77\00:36:32.41
Don't know how
we're going to beat that.
00:36:32.51\00:36:33.96
All right. This
question is: "How do we know
00:36:34.16\00:36:37.33
which day the
Sabbath really is? "
00:36:37.53\00:36:39.68
How do we know?
00:36:41.97\00:36:43.18
Well, maybe I can just
say that Sunday keepers
00:36:43.48\00:36:47.55
are sure which day is Sunday.
00:36:47.75\00:36:49.42
You know, I
always have people say:
00:36:51.38\00:36:53.57
"How do you know that
the Sabbath today is the same
00:36:53.77\00:36:56.27
Sabbath of the days of Christ? "
00:36:56.47\00:36:58.73
And my answer is:
"How do you know that the
00:36:59.03\00:37:01.30
Sunday that you celebrate
in honor of the resurrection
00:37:01.40\00:37:03.67
is the same Sunday? "
00:37:03.87\00:37:04.93
And then... and
then they say: "Well, OK,
00:37:05.23\00:37:07.76
the same Sabbath today is
the same Sabbath as the days of
00:37:07.96\00:37:10.78
Christ, so how do you know it's
the same Sabbath of creation? "
00:37:10.88\00:37:14.23
And I say: "Very simple...
Jesus created the Sabbath
00:37:14.53\00:37:18.10
and He would not
keep the wrong day. "
00:37:18.24\00:37:20.07
OK.
00:37:23.57\00:37:25.11
Very good! Any other?
00:37:29.64\00:37:31.41
I think he just
said it all. I do too!
00:37:31.71\00:37:35.02
If I said to you: "Come on
Sunday to pick up your check, "
00:37:37.67\00:37:39.94
everybody would
know what day I meant.
00:37:40.14\00:37:41.52
Absolutely. And the
Jews haven't ever forgotten
00:37:41.82\00:37:44.77
which day is Saturday,
and the Catholics that started
00:37:44.87\00:37:46.82
virtually not long afterwards
they haven't forgotten
00:37:47.12\00:37:50.05
which day is Sunday. So I
think when people ask that
00:37:50.15\00:37:52.88
once you think
about it a little bit
00:37:52.98\00:37:55.49
it's not really that difficult.
00:37:55.69\00:37:57.16
OK, this one...
There's been several questions
00:37:57.36\00:37:59.80
about the 144,000. I
know that's a long topic.
00:38:00.01\00:38:03.02
We don't have a chance
to do it, but people are
00:38:03.22\00:38:05.43
asking: "Will we be
sinning when Jesus comes
00:38:05.63\00:38:08.88
those who are saved?
And how does this reflect
00:38:09.08\00:38:12.47
the 144,000? Who's
going to be in that number? "
00:38:12.58\00:38:16.52
I've had several questions
all around that 144,000.
00:38:16.62\00:38:20.12
What can you tell us
00:38:20.32\00:38:23.38
that is spoken of in the
Bible before Jesus comes?
00:38:23.68\00:38:26.29
Well, one thing we
know for sure: there'll be
00:38:29.36\00:38:31.92
144,000 of them.
00:38:32.02\00:38:34.15
The Bible describes the
character of the 144,000
00:38:38.87\00:38:43.16
in Revelation 14. The character
is the most important focus
00:38:43.66\00:38:47.98
not who they are...
any more than we know
00:38:48.28\00:38:50.69
who's going to be a
member of this church next week
00:38:50.79\00:38:52.71
or next month or next year
00:38:53.01\00:38:54.60
any more than we know
who the names of the saved
00:38:54.70\00:38:56.81
are going to be. The character
is the most important thing.
00:38:56.91\00:39:00.49
And I think that
sometimes we focus...
00:39:00.60\00:39:02.05
If you want to find out what
that is: Revelation 14 verse 3
00:39:02.35\00:39:05.42
to verse 5. Dwight is there.
Why don't you read that, Dwight?
00:39:05.53\00:39:07.80
I want to give a break
so that people can hear it.
00:39:07.90\00:39:09.52
This is Revelation 14:3.
"They sang... " speaking of the
00:39:09.72\00:39:12.34
144,000... "were with the
Father. " By the way, they have
00:39:12.44\00:39:15.54
the Father's name
written on their foreheads.
00:39:15.64\00:39:17.90
"They sang as it were a
new song before the throne,
00:39:18.10\00:39:20.12
before the four living creatures
and the elders and no one
00:39:20.47\00:39:22.76
could learn that song
00:39:23.06\00:39:26.35
who were
redeemed from the earth.
00:39:26.55\00:39:28.07
These... " Verse 4...
"are the ones who were not
00:39:28.27\00:39:30.79
defiled with women
for they are virgins.
00:39:30.89\00:39:33.31
These are the ones who follow
the Lamb wherever He goes.
00:39:33.51\00:39:37.11
These were
redeemed from among men
00:39:37.45\00:39:39.39
being first fruits
to God and to the Lamb.
00:39:39.49\00:39:41.25
And in their mouth
was found no deceit
00:39:41.45\00:39:43.64
for they are without fault
before the throne of God. "
00:39:43.84\00:39:46.31
And so in a nutshell
00:39:47.91\00:39:48.98
all we're going to continue
sinning... I think there were
00:39:49.29\00:39:51.42
two questions here. No,
once the declaration is made
00:39:51.52\00:39:54.36
"He that is
unjust... he that is righteous"
00:39:54.46\00:39:56.32
then we remain in that
character for all eternity.
00:39:56.62\00:40:02.47
Who they are? We don't know.
00:40:02.77\00:40:04.42
Are we striving to
be a part of that? I am.
00:40:04.62\00:40:06.74
I believe we all are.
00:40:07.14\00:40:08.28
But we have to live the
character and let the Lord
00:40:08.38\00:40:10.30
decide who that will be.
00:40:10.40\00:40:11.69
I think one of the
problems that we have
00:40:12.44\00:40:14.19
is that we focus
on overcoming sin
00:40:14.39\00:40:16.35
instead of focusing on the
One who helps us overcome sin.
00:40:16.65\00:40:21.08
You know, ceasing sinning
00:40:21.78\00:40:25.51
will only take place
when we're at Calvary
00:40:25.71\00:40:29.57
seeing what sin did to Jesus.
00:40:29.77\00:40:31.73
In other words, when I
hear Jesus in Gethsemane
00:40:32.36\00:40:35.45
crying out to His Father:
"Father, if this cup... "
00:40:35.75\00:40:38.13
Which had the
wrath of God by the way.
00:40:38.33\00:40:39.88
Same word that's used
in Revelation chapter 16
00:40:40.09\00:40:42.51
for the cups or the
vials of God's wrath.
00:40:42.81\00:40:44.82
Jesus prayed and said:
"If this cup can pass from Me
00:40:44.92\00:40:48.28
let it be so. But not My
will be done but Yours. "
00:40:48.58\00:40:51.47
When I see Him
sweating drops of blood,
00:40:51.77\00:40:53.87
when I hear Him
crying out on the cross
00:40:54.17\00:40:56.23
"Why have You forsaken Me? "
00:40:56.43\00:40:57.81
I ask Jesus: "Why
did this happen to You? "
00:40:58.01\00:41:00.14
Jesus says: "Because of sin. "
00:41:00.44\00:41:02.63
Then I will see
how terrible sin is
00:41:02.93\00:41:05.87
when I come to the cross.
00:41:06.07\00:41:07.40
And when I see how terrible
sin is, I will want to stop
00:41:07.60\00:41:11.03
sinning because it hurts Jesus.
00:41:11.13\00:41:12.81
Just to take a quick take off
from what Pastor Bohr is saying.
00:41:13.21\00:41:16.31
Two things. One: if
you don't make the 144,000
00:41:16.41\00:41:19.55
I think there's another
company that's just a little bit
00:41:19.75\00:41:21.79
larger that John saw
00:41:21.99\00:41:24.33
that is going to be saved,
that is going to be redeemed.
00:41:24.63\00:41:26.82
One of the things that I
think will insulate us from sin
00:41:27.12\00:41:29.64
throughout all eternity. I
think we have a little idea
00:41:29.84\00:41:32.13
of how much God loves us.
00:41:32.33\00:41:33.82
But I think at this
point in this dispensation
00:41:34.12\00:41:36.38
we have no idea
how much God hates sin.
00:41:36.58\00:41:39.96
I don't think there's
any... We have no clue
00:41:40.26\00:41:42.76
the hatred of God for sin.
00:41:43.93\00:41:46.53
I think one of the things
that we will begin to understand
00:41:46.64\00:41:48.65
at that point is
how much God hates sin.
00:41:48.75\00:41:52.02
I think we will be faced with
that throughout all eternity.
00:41:52.12\00:41:54.71
And it is the understanding of
the enmity between God and sin
00:41:54.91\00:41:57.99
that will be one of the
things that will insulate us
00:41:58.19\00:42:00.45
from having sin ever coming
back in the history of the
00:42:00.55\00:42:03.15
universe ever again - Amen!
- when we really understand
00:42:03.25\00:42:06.09
the sacrifice of Christ
given the hatred of God for sin.
00:42:06.19\00:42:10.56
Look at the
difference between a parent
00:42:10.76\00:42:12.88
that has a child on drugs
00:42:13.08\00:42:15.38
that's doing
cocaine vs. one who doesn't.
00:42:15.58\00:42:18.02
The one who has the
child... And I've talked to them
00:42:18.32\00:42:20.37
and you all have to says:
"I hate drugs; I hate drugs. "
00:42:20.47\00:42:24.12
Those of us not experienced with
that say: "Those are terrible.
00:42:24.42\00:42:27.26
Drugs are terrible. "
But Jesus knows... He's that
00:42:27.56\00:42:32.66
parent. He knows what sin is.
00:42:32.87\00:42:35.21
He sees it
destroying His creation.
00:42:35.31\00:42:37.57
Thank you. All right,
we have another question
00:42:37.87\00:42:41.10
here on the two
witnesses of Revelation 11:7-10.
00:42:41.20\00:42:46.36
It says: "How can this only
be referring to the Old and New
00:42:46.66\00:42:50.79
Testament? Could this not
also be two literal people?
00:42:50.89\00:42:56.38
Revelation 11:7-10.
00:42:58.63\00:43:02.27
Steve, you look like you're
ready to take in after this.
00:43:02.67\00:43:06.86
Well I have a whole presentation
00:43:07.83\00:43:13.13
on the two witnesses.
00:43:13.33\00:43:14.79
And, you know, you'd
have to believe that Moses
00:43:15.09\00:43:18.72
would have to
come back to the earth
00:43:18.92\00:43:21.93
and Elijah would have
to come back to the earth.
00:43:22.23\00:43:24.45
Of course, Elijah was trans-
lated from among the living.
00:43:24.55\00:43:26.68
Moses died and he
was taken to heaven.
00:43:26.98\00:43:29.46
It's much better when you
look at all of the evidence
00:43:30.55\00:43:33.14
of scripture to
believe that really...
00:43:33.24\00:43:36.43
By the way, they
ARE Moses and Elijah.
00:43:36.63\00:43:38.50
Yeah, and they did come back
at the Mt. of Transfiguration.
00:43:38.60\00:43:41.71
Right. But you're
dealing with typology.
00:43:41.81\00:43:44.42
It's just the same as Elijah.
00:43:44.72\00:43:46.49
You know, the Elijah in the
end time is not literal Elijah.
00:43:46.69\00:43:50.26
He's symbolic of
something far greater.
00:43:50.46\00:43:52.67
And so the two witnesses
are not literal Moses and Elijah
00:43:52.97\00:43:56.22
which would be like
going back to the Old Testament
00:43:56.32\00:43:58.51
to the type. But
this is an antitypical
00:43:58.61\00:44:01.71
meaning which represents
really... Moses looks backwards
00:44:01.85\00:44:06.29
and Elijah looks forwards
towards the New Testament.
00:44:06.42\00:44:08.75
In fact, John the Baptist
IS the New Testament Elijah.
00:44:08.95\00:44:11.15
And so he's the bridge between
the Old and New Testament.
00:44:11.45\00:44:14.33
So basically it's correct to say
00:44:14.63\00:44:18.48
that it's the Old and
New Testament because Moses
00:44:18.58\00:44:20.69
is identified
primarily with the Old
00:44:20.80\00:44:22.78
while Elijah looks
forward to the New.
00:44:22.98\00:44:25.09
OK. C.A. you look
like you're ready.
00:44:25.59\00:44:28.09
Moses and Elijah came to
encourage Christ in the garden.
00:44:28.59\00:44:32.42
I wish I could have been
there for that conversation
00:44:32.62\00:44:34.44
because they realized
that they were in heaven
00:44:34.74\00:44:36.66
on a promissory
note. If Christ had failed,
00:44:36.76\00:44:39.44
they would have to
have gotten out of heaven.
00:44:39.64\00:44:41.71
They could not stay.
00:44:41.91\00:44:42.98
So I know what they were saying:
"Lord, You've got to come
00:44:43.28\00:44:45.29
through 'cause Your failure
is our eviction notice. "
00:44:45.39\00:44:48.10
They're not
coming back here anymore.
00:44:48.30\00:44:49.80
They're in and
they're going to stay in.
00:44:50.00\00:44:51.75
And if I were in where they are,
I wouldn't want to come back
00:44:51.85\00:44:53.61
either. Yes. So,
no, it's representative.
00:44:53.71\00:44:55.98
I think Pastor
Bohr was very correct.
00:44:56.08\00:44:57.57
OK. No round-trip ticket.
00:44:57.77\00:45:00.17
All right... OK. This
one: I'm hesitant to ask this.
00:45:00.37\00:45:03.98
We don't have much time, but
why don't we just do it quickly
00:45:04.18\00:45:07.93
as we can: "How do we
recognize spiritual formation
00:45:08.13\00:45:11.53
in our church? "
00:45:11.73\00:45:12.99
That's a tough one
that's going to be quick.
00:45:13.39\00:45:15.53
We don't want to
get... We only have about
00:45:15.73\00:45:17.53
10 or 11-12 minutes left.
00:45:17.56\00:45:19.18
What do we look for?
Who wants to tackle that?
00:45:19.48\00:45:22.26
Spiritual formation quickly
around "Where are you going? "
00:45:22.46\00:45:24.66
"Are you going in?
Are you going out? "
00:45:24.86\00:45:26.78
Spiritual formation says:
"If you can go in far enough
00:45:27.08\00:45:29.79
into yourself, there's
something good in there. "
00:45:29.99\00:45:31.65
The Bible seems
to say the opposite:
00:45:31.95\00:45:33.63
that there's
nothing good in you.
00:45:33.73\00:45:35.04
You've got to go
out to Jesus Christ.
00:45:35.24\00:45:36.97
If your church is
trying to tell you to go in
00:45:37.07\00:45:38.80
'cause there's something you're
going to find in there good,
00:45:38.90\00:45:40.80
they're not telling you
the truth, because when you
00:45:41.00\00:45:42.74
get there you will find that
there's nothing good in there.
00:45:42.84\00:45:45.00
The only good is Jesus.
00:45:45.20\00:45:46.74
That was quick and
to the point. Steve.
00:45:47.14\00:45:49.82
You know, I think that's
probably... This is a difficult
00:45:50.02\00:45:52.31
question to answer
because it's so extensive.
00:45:52.41\00:45:54.72
But you know I
would recommend a book
00:45:55.02\00:45:57.61
written by Howard Peth
that's called The Dangers of
00:45:57.81\00:46:01.46
Contemplative Prayer. Of
course, contemplative prayer
00:46:01.56\00:46:03.68
branches off from the
idea of spiritual formation.
00:46:03.88\00:46:06.51
And you know, we have
that book at our booth.
00:46:07.59\00:46:09.95
It's a small book; it
deals with all the issues,
00:46:10.25\00:46:13.98
all of the individuals who
teach contemplative prayer.
00:46:14.18\00:46:17.20
The dangers of it. It
actually was recommended
00:46:17.40\00:46:20.28
by the General
Conference by Mark Finley.
00:46:20.48\00:46:23.45
And so this is an excellent book
00:46:23.65\00:46:26.04
and I would recommend
that everybody if possible
00:46:26.24\00:46:29.02
get a copy of this book: The
Dangers of Contemplative Prayer
00:46:29.22\00:46:31.87
by Howard Peth.
00:46:32.07\00:46:33.99
OK... anybody else? Or go on?
00:46:34.29\00:46:36.45
The only thing I would
add is that if you can't find
00:46:36.65\00:46:40.64
the practice in the Bible,
00:46:40.74\00:46:42.11
if it isn't supported
by scripture, don't do it.
00:46:42.41\00:46:45.25
OK. All right.
00:46:46.94\00:46:48.42
This is a question that
I've not really run into before
00:46:48.62\00:46:53.37
quite honestly.
"What do you know about
00:46:53.57\00:46:55.85
the 2520 prophecy? "
00:46:56.06\00:46:59.35
We have stumped the panel.
00:47:04.37\00:47:06.00
Yeah, I'm stuck.
I'll just give one answer.
00:47:06.20\00:47:08.15
Secrets Unsealed
has its yearly summit
00:47:08.55\00:47:11.39
October 10-13
00:47:11.69\00:47:13.77
and I'm going to be dealing
with some very difficult issues
00:47:14.07\00:47:16.98
at our summit: 2520, and
I'll be dealing with the daily.
00:47:17.08\00:47:20.85
I'm going to be dealing
with the yearly principle.
00:47:21.05\00:47:23.41
Some of the real controversial
issues in Adventism.
00:47:23.61\00:47:26.30
So you're all
invited to come to our summit
00:47:26.50\00:47:28.34
October 10-13 in
Fresno. Where is it this summit?
00:47:28.54\00:47:30.27
Tell us a little bit
more about the summit.
00:47:30.57\00:47:31.83
Where is it? It's
going to be in Fresno -
00:47:32.03\00:47:33.58
OK - at the
University Square Hotel.
00:47:33.61\00:47:36.51
Uh-huh. And basically, we
have a summit where we invite
00:47:36.72\00:47:39.90
all of our supporters to come.
00:47:40.10\00:47:41.44
Everyone is welcome to
come. Just go to our website
00:47:41.74\00:47:44.56
secretsunsealed. org
00:47:44.77\00:47:46.30
and you'll get information.
00:47:46.50\00:47:47.90
We don't require donations
00:47:48.20\00:47:50.14
although Shelly
suggested it's a good idea.
00:47:50.34\00:47:52.87
Are you going to deal
with the 2520 prophecy?
00:47:53.17\00:47:55.87
We will deal with
the 2520 extensively
00:47:56.07\00:47:58.62
so that everybody
understands what the issues are.
00:47:58.82\00:48:00.74
John, would you like to answer
this so they don't have to go
00:48:00.94\00:48:03.80
to Fresno?
People probably wonder
00:48:03.90\00:48:05.19
is there a Bible
prophecy for 2520?
00:48:05.39\00:48:07.19
And the answer is "No! "
00:48:07.29\00:48:08.50
But there's no 2520 mentioned
in the Bible. You can't find it
00:48:08.80\00:48:11.99
anywhere. But
here's where it comes from:
00:48:12.09\00:48:13.72
it's 7 times 360.
00:48:14.02\00:48:17.44
There was a time-period
established by the early
00:48:17.64\00:48:20.41
Millerites who believed that
from the time of the preaching
00:48:20.61\00:48:24.00
to the time of
Christ would be seven years.
00:48:24.11\00:48:25.99
And they looked
forward for this 2,520 days.
00:48:26.09\00:48:29.54
But did Jesus come in
1844? And what's the answer?
00:48:29.74\00:48:31.86
No. But there is no
scriptural like the 2300 days.
00:48:32.16\00:48:35.82
There's no 2520
prophecy in the Bible.
00:48:36.02\00:48:38.73
And this is quite a
serious issue because
00:48:39.23\00:48:42.65
there are pockets of Adventists
in many different places
00:48:42.78\00:48:45.42
that are all
caught up in this 2520.
00:48:45.52\00:48:48.82
And they're even saying that
unless you have the 2520 clear
00:48:49.02\00:48:52.77
you can't be saved.
They're going that far.
00:48:52.97\00:48:55.73
And basically they misinterpret
the old 1843 Millerite chart.
00:48:56.03\00:49:00.14
And that's one of the things
that we're going to take a look
00:49:00.34\00:49:01.70
at. OK, Danny.
00:49:01.80\00:49:03.49
I guess I would have
to be lost on ignorance.
00:49:03.69\00:49:05.80
I didn't know about it;
first I heard about 2520.
00:49:06.01\00:49:08.64
Come to our summit.
00:49:08.74\00:49:10.36
I'm disappointed
in the rest of you.
00:49:10.56\00:49:12.05
Steve is the only one that
talked about items at his booth
00:49:12.25\00:49:15.09
for sale and gave his website
00:49:15.20\00:49:17.35
and got you
coming to his meetings.
00:49:17.55\00:49:19.12
Don't the rest of
you? Can't you direct us to
00:49:19.23\00:49:22.08
Pioneer or John
to? www. pmchurch. tv
00:49:22.18\00:49:27.17
tvsdac. org
00:49:28.62\00:49:31.23
OK. Every Wednesday night.
00:49:31.43\00:49:33.38
Every week actually.
00:49:33.58\00:49:34.96
All right... love it. No,
this is a great time to do it.
00:49:35.16\00:49:37.61
We only have a few minutes left.
Somebody wants to come back
00:49:37.81\00:49:39.98
and maybe this is one
we can kind of wrap it up
00:49:40.08\00:49:42.18
because I thought about
this earlier. But it says:
00:49:42.38\00:49:44.69
You all just said it was
easier to be saved than lost.
00:49:44.72\00:49:47.92
And everybody
was united on that.
00:49:48.12\00:49:49.61
But: "If it's really easier
to be saved than to be lost
00:49:49.91\00:49:53.34
why are so many people
being lost and so few saved? "
00:49:53.54\00:49:57.26
How do we bring
that down to the reality?
00:49:57.46\00:50:00.62
We know what you just
said and the scripture says
00:50:00.82\00:50:02.88
but it is tough out
here. There's a war going on.
00:50:03.18\00:50:06.41
So how can we? How can
we gain victory in this?
00:50:06.81\00:50:09.73
How can we be assured that
we can be one of those saved?
00:50:09.93\00:50:12.81
The Lord Jesus told
Paul on the road to Damascus
00:50:13.91\00:50:17.47
and it's recorded in Acts 26:18.
00:50:17.67\00:50:21.50
He said: "I am sending
you to open their eyes,
00:50:21.70\00:50:24.56
to turn them from
darkness to light,
00:50:24.66\00:50:26.31
from the power of Satan to God
00:50:26.41\00:50:28.10
that they may be sanctified" -
00:50:28.30\00:50:32.07
set apart from sin, made holy -
00:50:32.27\00:50:34.44
"by faith in Me and have a share
00:50:34.64\00:50:37.66
in the inheritance
among those who are sanctified
00:50:37.86\00:50:40.66
by faith in Me. "
And I believe that
00:50:40.86\00:50:44.57
we've got to get
our message right.
00:50:44.77\00:50:47.22
When we talk with
people it has to be love...
00:50:47.52\00:50:51.95
We have to reflect the love,
light, and life of Jesus Christ.
00:50:52.15\00:50:56.56
And we have to let them know
00:50:56.86\00:50:59.55
and I think in some
ways we still have to learn
00:50:59.75\00:51:01.94
that God's plan of salvation
is total dependence upon Him.
00:51:02.14\00:51:06.95
It isn't... It's all by grace.
00:51:07.35\00:51:09.83
It's not grace + works.
00:51:10.03\00:51:12.45
Our works are just a
proof of our profession.
00:51:12.85\00:51:15.70
But we count on
God - Philippians 2:13-
00:51:16.01\00:51:20.55
working in us to will and to do.
00:51:20.75\00:51:23.35
We count on God
- Philippians 1:6-
00:51:23.55\00:51:27.04
completing the good
work that He began in us.
00:51:28.10\00:51:30.83
We have to remember both
the Old and the New Testaments
00:51:31.85\00:51:35.22
say that salvation
belongs to the Lord.
00:51:35.42\00:51:37.26
And if we'll quit trying to
save ourselves and we'll just
00:51:37.56\00:51:40.63
surrender and ask every day to
be filled with the Holy Spirit
00:51:40.83\00:51:45.15
Acts 3:16-20 says that
when we have that Spirit
00:51:45.45\00:51:50.87
in our heart and that
power working in the inner man
00:51:51.07\00:51:55.06
we'll be rooted
and grounded in love
00:51:55.26\00:51:57.70
and we'll understand the width
and the length and the depth
00:51:58.00\00:52:01.30
and the height of God's love.
00:52:01.40\00:52:04.10
And He will be able to
do exceedingly abundantly
00:52:04.30\00:52:08.51
above all we ask or think.
00:52:08.81\00:52:10.99
If we can understand this
00:52:11.19\00:52:13.56
and we can relate it to others,
00:52:13.76\00:52:16.52
it's just easier
to be saved than lost.
00:52:16.72\00:52:19.89
That was great, but let
me make it really simple.
00:52:21.33\00:52:24.11
I'm going to go to
the thief on the cross.
00:52:25.13\00:52:27.53
He didn't know any of
that. He just called on Jesus.
00:52:27.73\00:52:30.12
You know, his situation was
different than everybody else's.
00:52:30.62\00:52:34.37
I'm completely
supporting what Shelley said,
00:52:34.57\00:52:36.19
and that's vitally important.
00:52:36.30\00:52:37.82
But the Lord says
whosoever believeth in Him
00:52:38.22\00:52:41.08
should not perish but
have everlasting life.
00:52:41.28\00:52:42.93
The work that happens after
you accept Christ in your life
00:52:43.33\00:52:45.69
happens by Him coming in. That's
what Shelley's talking about.
00:52:45.89\00:52:48.85
But the Lord turns away from
no one who calls on His name.
00:52:49.15\00:52:52.13
He says to no one: "This is what
you must do before I save you. "
00:52:52.71\00:52:56.64
"Whomsoever
will... let him come.
00:52:56.94\00:52:58.60
I will in no
wise cast you away. "
00:52:58.80\00:53:00.64
So salvation to me is
much easier than being lost.
00:53:00.94\00:53:05.73
All you've got to do
to be lost is nothing.
00:53:06.03\00:53:08.22
All you've got to do to be saved
is accept Jesus into your life
00:53:08.52\00:53:11.24
and the work begins. He
begins it; He carries it on;
00:53:11.44\00:53:14.78
and He finishes it.
00:53:14.98\00:53:16.23
Quick text: Romans 8:11.
00:53:16.43\00:53:18.25
"But if the Spirit of Him
who raised Jesus from the dead
00:53:18.55\00:53:22.03
dwells in you, He who
raised Christ from the dead
00:53:22.23\00:53:25.68
will also give life
to your mortal bodies
00:53:25.88\00:53:28.40
through His Spirit
who dwells in you. "
00:53:28.60\00:53:31.19
When Jesus said: "I am the
Way, the Truth, and the Life"
00:53:31.49\00:53:34.56
that is an
incredibly bigoted statement.
00:53:34.76\00:53:37.61
And in this
pluralistic age in which we live
00:53:37.91\00:53:40.24
it sound bad to be
sort of one way like that.
00:53:40.44\00:53:45.27
But it happens to be the truth!
00:53:45.47\00:53:47.20
There is life in
Christ and Christ alone.
00:53:47.41\00:53:50.13
There is no other way
to ascend into the kingdom.
00:53:50.23\00:53:52.50
You have to go
through Jesus Christ.
00:53:52.60\00:53:55.08
And once you are in Christ and
as long as you abide in Christ
00:53:55.28\00:53:58.11
salvation is yours.
00:53:58.31\00:54:00.37
When a person is drowning,
00:54:01.75\00:54:03.68
the lifesaver doesn't jump
in immediately to save a person
00:54:05.33\00:54:08.59
who is drowning.
00:54:08.69\00:54:09.96
He lets the person struggle and
fight and try to save himself
00:54:10.87\00:54:14.12
until his energy is expended.
00:54:14.32\00:54:16.33
And then he jumps in and helps
the person who is drowning.
00:54:17.43\00:54:20.19
Because if he jumps in
when the person is struggling
00:54:20.49\00:54:22.85
to save himself
then they both drown.
00:54:22.95\00:54:24.83
And so it is, you know,
when we struggle and struggle
00:54:25.33\00:54:30.91
and struggle to save ourselves
00:54:31.01\00:54:32.39
and finally we expended all the
energy to try and save ourselves
00:54:32.69\00:54:36.28
then Jesus jumps in
and He brings salvation.
00:54:36.38\00:54:40.36
The key point is yielding.
00:54:40.60\00:54:43.08
The difficult
part in being saved
00:54:43.28\00:54:47.31
is not the process that
God established to be saved.
00:54:47.52\00:54:50.48
The difficult part for us is
that we want to be in control
00:54:50.78\00:54:54.17
of our lives. We want
to dictate what we do.
00:54:54.27\00:54:57.28
But when we
yield our will to Jesus
00:54:57.48\00:55:00.63
and we expend all of our energy
00:55:00.83\00:55:03.63
trying to save ourselves
and we see that it's useless
00:55:03.83\00:55:06.19
then Jesus can
intervene to save us.
00:55:06.39\00:55:08.92
Pastor Dwight.
Jesus' words: John 6:37.
00:55:09.12\00:55:12.82
You remember these words.
00:55:13.02\00:55:14.22
"He/she who comes to Me I
will in no wise cast out. "
00:55:14.52\00:55:19.80
A friend of mine, Skip
MacCarty, found this quotation
00:55:20.10\00:55:22.66
and shared with me.
I have it taped to...
00:55:22.86\00:55:24.91
I always wonder what you
use these maps for in the back
00:55:25.31\00:55:27.53
of the Bible, but I
tape quotations to them now.
00:55:27.63\00:55:29.55
Written 100 years ago.
00:55:31.49\00:55:33.09
100 years ago: "The
message from God to me
00:55:33.39\00:55:36.73
for you is: him that
cometh unto Me I will in no wise
00:55:36.94\00:55:40.34
cast out. " Now listen:
00:55:40.54\00:55:41.99
"If you have nothing else
to plead before God but this
00:55:42.19\00:55:46.22
one promise from
your Lord and Savior,
00:55:46.32\00:55:48.37
you have the assurance
that you will never, never
00:55:48.57\00:55:52.72
be turned away. " In the
Greek it's a double negative.
00:55:52.93\00:55:55.45
Jesus says in the
Greek: "He who comes to Me
00:55:55.65\00:55:58.09
I will no not ever... "
It's the double negative
00:55:58.29\00:56:01.50
inserted in the
Greek into that sentence
00:56:01.60\00:56:03.99
and Ellen White
picks up on that double.
00:56:04.19\00:56:05.82
"You will never
never be turned away.
00:56:06.02\00:56:08.34
It may seem to you that you are
hanging upon a single promise
00:56:08.54\00:56:11.69
but appropriate that one
promise and it will open to you"
00:56:11.89\00:56:15.16
I love this... "the whole
treasure house of the riches
00:56:15.27\00:56:18.73
of the grace of
Christ. " Now hold on.
00:56:18.93\00:56:20.84
"Cling to that
promise - John 6:37-
00:56:21.04\00:56:23.31
and you are safe.
Present this assurance to Jesus
00:56:23.51\00:56:27.68
and you are as safe as
though inside the city of God. "
00:56:27.88\00:56:32.07
Amen! One promise...
just keep giving it to Jesus.
00:56:32.27\00:56:35.08
John 6:37. No matter what
you're wrestling with now, sir.
00:56:35.28\00:56:38.39
No matter what you
are battling, woman.
00:56:38.49\00:56:40.71
God's promise to
you is: "You hang on...
00:56:41.05\00:56:43.10
you hang onto Me and you're
as good as inside the city
00:56:43.30\00:56:47.00
tonight. " Mr. Gilley,
we only have a few seconds.
00:56:47.20\00:56:50.36
Can you comment
on that in closing?
00:56:50.56\00:56:52.26
Well I think that John
3:16, of course, has the gospel
00:56:52.46\00:56:56.20
and John 3:17 is one that many
people don't even know is there.
00:56:56.50\00:57:01.65
"For Christ came not into
the world to condemn the world
00:57:01.95\00:57:06.49
but through Him the
world might be saved. "
00:57:06.52\00:57:09.92
He came to save. Not
to condemn but to save.
00:57:10.42\00:57:14.96